You're Asked: 880USD worth the bugs?

[malakas 0]

Dear AVSIM community,

 

after 5 years my computer is starting to lose its capabilities and becoming a lot slower despite cleaning it and even resetting it to its factory state.

 

So I have decided that it is time to get a new PC.

 

Doing research I found lots of forums and blogs discussing 'what PC is ideal for FSX' however the topics seemed to be outdated and not really answering my concerns...

 

I don't know much about computers but this is what I was able to find and seemed to me price reasonable:

 

 

NvVidia GeForce GTX750 T1

1TB HDD + 256 SSD

Prozessor 3.56 GHZ

Intelcore I7

DDR3

8GB RAM

Windows 8.1

 

The Desktop is a Lenovo (an exhibition model) for modest   777EUR (~880USD)

 

 

I use only Scenery and Traffic Addons, with traffic set preferably to 100%  :smile:

 

Currently I run FSX SE on my laptop which I think is not even half as good; besides the long loading FSX is performing surprisingly well and almost never lags.

 

 

 

I would like to hear from you guys a second opinion weather this is pricely a good deal, or I could get for the same value perhaps something better?

 

I have the impression that FSX will run reasonable well on the above mentioned system? What do you think? 

 

 

 

I would be happy to hear from you guys and take this opportunity to excuse my bad english (obviously it is not my first language  )

 

 

Thanks in Advance

 

[TurboKen 221]

I too can run FSX smoothly on my laptop, its all in how much scenery you dial in. With that said the system you chose will work, but if you can find a deal on something with a faster processor 4690k or skylake would be ideal. then go for that, as you will be able to turn up scenery that much more.

[malakas 0]

I too can run FSX smoothly on my laptop, its all in how much scenery you dial in. With that said the system you chose will work, but if you can find a deal on something with a faster processor 4690k or skylake would be ideal. then go for that, as you will be able to turn up scenery that much more.

Hi,

 

thanks for the quick reply.

 

the processor is an Intel Core i7-4790 

I am not sure what that's supposed to mean.

How can I tell if a processer is faster/stronger than another? 

 

I thought that i7 is means that its faster than i5 and i3... 

[Jimm 437]

One thing I've learned over the years is that if you need to upgrade your machine or purchase a new one, as long as FSX (or even P3D) exists in your library of software, you need to invest in a good, solid performing machine.  That Lenovo, while it has decent specs, may still not cut it.  I found that sub grand machines are lacking in key hardware to run flight sims.  I recently (within the past 6 months) invested in a higher end laptop, capable of running FSX or P3D, without the headache or worry of whether or not my hardware would make the grade.  Doing research through AVSIM with member systems posted and learning from others' mistakes, I settled on Origin.  Through a veteran simmer online, I read that Origin builds solid machines, and at a decent price.  Jetline systems makes 'Cadillac' machines and even configure everything for you, but that will cost more.

 

An i7-4790k seems to be a good baseline these days for recent cpus that cut the proverbial mustard for FSX and P3D.  NVidia's latest line of gpus work very well.  For memory, you may get by with 8gb, but I would side with 16gb with low latency.  Hard drives are a no-brainer: go with SSD.  Their cost per gb is much lower now and if you can afford an all-SSD system, your machine will thank you for it.

 

Lastly, to get a good idea of performance of different cpus, go here: http://ark.intel.com/ . This site has all of intel's spec data sheets for their lines of cpus so you can make comparisons.  you can also go to cpuboss.com to do comparisons as well, and it will give ratings too.

 

-Jim

[TheFamilyMan 280]

That price is reasonable for that system, considering that it is really a i7 4790.  Its graphic card is low to mid-grade (which will limit FSX graphics detail settings), and I imagine that its PSU is limited well, which may make upgrading the gcard, if you decide later to do so, a problem unless you upgrade the PSU too.  As for that computer's FSX ability, it's OK but not close to top end.  For that requires a hefty overclock of a i7 4790k or better, and a high end-ish gcard, both of which that system cannot support as it is.

 

As you probably know, no system exists anywhere that can run traffic at 100% without suffering seriously low FPS...so don't even think about it :smile:

[YukonPete 586]

I would get at least a GTX 970 card myself!

[jaydor 233]

If you are not a main stream gamer then I would recommend the MSI NVIDIA GTX 960 GAMING 4G Graphics Card - 4GB.

 

That makes you future proof. Also a must is Steve's DX10 fixer and you will have no trouble with the 3.5Ghz CPU.

 

See what I am achieving with a 3.4 Ghz cpu here with a GTX 660ti 3Gb card:

 

http://www.avsim.com/topic/476916-fsx-se-results-after-rebuild/

[malakas 0]

If you are not a main stream gamer then I would recommend the MSI NVIDIA GTX 960 GAMING 4G Graphics Card - 4GB.

 

That makes you future proof. Also a must is Steve's DX10 fixer and you will have no trouble with the 3.5Ghz CPU.

 

See what I am achieving with a 3.4 Ghz cpu here with a GTX 660ti 3Gb card:

 

http://www.avsim.com/topic/476916-fsx-se-results-after-rebuild/

that indeed looks gorgeous! Thanks for sharing

 

could also be promotional photos of an upcoming add-on 

 

My eyes however now have caught the attention of a computer that is on sale at my local PC store;

 

it's a custom-built PC for rougly the same price....

however i realised that the processor is not an intel! 

It has an AMD FX6300 6x Core processor. it makes me wonder that the seller nowhere mentions what GhZ it has...Should I be worried ? 

 

The graphics card is an AMD R7-260x      2GB

[malakas 0]

That price is reasonable for that system, considering that it is really a i7 4790.  Its graphic card is low to mid-grade (which will limit FSX graphics detail settings), and I imagine that its PSU is limited well, which may make upgrading the gcard, if you decide later to do so, a problem unless you upgrade the PSU too.  As for that computer's FSX ability, it's OK but not close to top end.  For that requires a hefty overclock of a i7 4790k or better, and a high end-ish gcard, both of which that system cannot support as it is.

 

As you probably know, no system exists anywhere that can run traffic at 100% without suffering seriously low FPS...so don't even think about it :smile:

Thanks for the tip!

I certainly am considering of upgrading in the coming years when I get my next PC.

As my knowledge on computers is very limited, I wouldn't have thought that upgrading a pc would be so laborious!

 

So how can I tell weather a PC is upgradeable or not? 

 

As for the ai-traffic, i make custom flight plans and the traffic volumes in the regions I fly in are a joke compared to the volumes that you'd see in the US  

One thing I've learned over the years is that if you need to upgrade your machine or purchase a new one, as long as FSX (or even P3D) exists in your library of software, you need to invest in a good, solid performing machine.  That Lenovo, while it has decent specs, may still not cut it.  I found that sub grand machines are lacking in key hardware to run flight sims.  I recently (within the past 6 months) invested in a higher end laptop, capable of running FSX or P3D, without the headache or worry of whether or not my hardware would make the grade.  Doing research through AVSIM with member systems posted and learning from others' mistakes, I settled on Origin.  Through a veteran simmer online, I read that Origin builds solid machines, and at a decent price.  Jetline systems makes 'Cadillac' machines and even configure everything for you, but that will cost more.

 

An i7-4790k seems to be a good baseline these days for recent cpus that cut the proverbial mustard for FSX and P3D.  NVidia's latest line of gpus work very well.  For memory, you may get by with 8gb, but I would side with 16gb with low latency.  Hard drives are a no-brainer: go with SSD.  Their cost per gb is much lower now and if you can afford an all-SSD system, your machine will thank you for it.

 

Lastly, to get a good idea of performance of different cpus, go here: http://ark.intel.com/ . This site has all of intel's spec data sheets for their lines of cpus so you can make comparisons.  you can also go to cpuboss.com to do comparisons as well, and it will give ratings too.

 

-Jim

thank you very much for the informative answer!

 

it seems to me that origin is distributed only in North America? 

 

does it make a difference when the 8GB RAM is a '' 2x 4GB dual channel'' ? 

Should I avoid graphic cards that aren't Nvidia ? Somewhere I had picked up that Nvidia cards are the first choice when it comes for a PC for FSX.

 

 

    -kind regards

[Jimm 437]

Yes, Origin is based in Florida, USA but I'm sure you can get international shipping.  After getting this rig and seeing how well it performs, I won't deal with Alienware.  As far as price, Origin is very reasonable for a "boutique" laptop.

 

Memory, should always be paired evenly, or at least how I was told by many IT guys.  12gb won't perform as well as say 16gb...memory sticks should stay even when paired.  DDR3 or DDR3L is good, but DDR4 is better although I hear those are used by the new Skylake processors.

 

For graphics, it's a split decision.  I have always used nvidia but I can't say much for AMD, although some folks have had success with AMD.  It seems that nvidia became the gpu of choice for flight sim, not sure why.  I've always had good performance with nvidia and I guess it is more popular...again, not sure why that is.

 

-Jim

[malakas 0]

I agree with alienware being overpriced. I actually own a laptop and I must say I have a feeling that I paid more for the brand rather than the actual laptop... 

 

Nonetheless I'm thinking of giving the specs I need to my local computer store and see how much it would cost to get it build. 

 

I have found an article a few weeks back on system memory http://lifehacker.com/performance-tests-show-that-16gb-of-ram-is-overkill-1724827429

not sure if it is the most reliable source but still..

 

Is it possible to combine an AMD processor with an Nvidia graphics card or will I have problems? 

 

I read that people do face more problems running FSX with AMD so I will get Nvidia.

 

Yes, Origin is based in Florida, USA but I'm sure you can get international shipping.  After getting this rig and seeing how well it performs, I won't deal with Alienware.  As far as price, Origin is very reasonable for a "boutique" laptop.

 

Memory, should always be paired evenly, or at least how I was told by many IT guys.  12gb won't perform as well as say 16gb...memory sticks should stay even when paired.  DDR3 or DDR3L is good, but DDR4 is better although I hear those are used by the new Skylake processors.

 

For graphics, it's a split decision.  I have always used nvidia but I can't say much for AMD, although some folks have had success with AMD.  It seems that nvidia became the gpu of choice for flight sim, not sure why.  I've always had good performance with nvidia and I guess it is more popular...again, not sure why that is.

 

-Jim

[TheFamilyMan 280]

Off-the-shelf systems are designed and built to be only what they are.  Upgrading components can be problematic because of that.  Their power supplies are usually rated to handle only what's built for that box.  A higher end gcard will simply demand more power that the stock PSU can handle.

 

Read this to get a good idea what a really good FSX computer is all about, and what it takes to put one together and configure it:

http://www.simforums.com/forums/the-fsx-computer-system-the-bible-by-nickn_topic46211.html

[SAAB340 28]

that indeed looks gorgeous! Thanks for sharing

 

could also be promotional photos of an upcoming add-on

 

My eyes however now have caught the attention of a computer that is on sale at my local PC store;

 

it's a custom-built PC for rougly the same price....

however i realised that the processor is not an intel!

It has an AMD FX6300 6x Core processor. it makes me wonder that the seller nowhere mentions what GhZ it has...Should I be worried ?

 

The graphics card is an AMD R7-260x 2GB

Whatever you do, do NOT buy a flightsim PC with an AMD CPU in it. Period. Unfortunately the AMD CPUs are a lot slower for flightsim compared to Intel i5 and i7 CPUs.

 

You can get away with an i5 CPU.

FSX is one of very few programs where RAM speed also matters. Not as much as the CPU, but its still a vital component.

[Trans_27 Pilot Chase 59]

I hate to be THAT guy, but have you considered building? I have always been intimidated by the idea of building my own system, but after shopping parts and watching some how-to videos, I can say that I will definitely be building my next computer. After watching enough short videos and seeing how simple it is, I'm actually excited about it. 

 

Remember that FSX is written with old code and CPU clock speed is key here. I'd be looking at the 4790k or the 6700k. Out of the box they're clocked at 4.0 and they overclock well with good cooling. I'm looking at the 6700k with intent on overclocking to 4.5 using liquid cooling. Another option is an unlocked (k series) i5. They overclock well, but they're also clocked lower out of the box. 

 

GPU wise, I think you'd be fine with a GTX 960. The system I currently have shipped with a 660 and that was several years ago. The 660 served me very well. I upgraded last year to the 970 and have no complaints. I saw a small bump in performance in the sim, but not as much as I expected. It's awesome in other games that actually can use it to it's full potential.

 

SSD's are great. I recently installed two 850 Evo's and they're great. One holds OS and the other holds my sim. My system boots in about 25 seconds. FSX also loads pretty quick, but once you're in the sim, you wont notice a difference.  

 

Here is one of the combo's I'm considering. http://pcpartpicker.com/p/YzTkNG

 

I'll be using my two SSD drives that are currently in my system as well as my Gigabyte GTX 970. I'm tossing around the idea of running to 970's in SLI since P3D takes advantage of SLI now. 

 

My word of advice is if you go the DIY route, get one of the new Skylake processors. This will put you on the Z170 motherboards so you'd be able to upgrade your CPU for the next few years if you decided to do so. My next system will have to last me 4 or 5 years. I'm tired of buying new every 2-3 years, so I'm making sure that I can upgrade everything when the time comes until it's time for my next build. 

[malakas 0]

I hate to be THAT guy, but have you considered building? I have always been intimidated by the idea of building my own system, but after shopping parts and watching some how-to videos, I can say that I will definitely be building my next computer. After watching enough short videos and seeing how simple it is, I'm actually excited about it. 

 

Remember that FSX is written with old code and CPU clock speed is key here. I'd be looking at the 4790k or the 6700k. Out of the box they're clocked at 4.0 and they overclock well with good cooling. I'm looking at the 6700k with intent on overclocking to 4.5 using liquid cooling. Another option is an unlocked (k series) i5. They overclock well, but they're also clocked lower out of the box. 

 

GPU wise, I think you'd be fine with a GTX 960. The system I currently have shipped with a 660 and that was several years ago. The 660 served me very well. I upgraded last year to the 970 and have no complaints. I saw a small bump in performance in the sim, but not as much as I expected. It's awesome in other games that actually can use it to it's full potential.

 

SSD's are great. I recently installed two 850 Evo's and they're great. One holds OS and the other holds my sim. My system boots in about 25 seconds. FSX also loads pretty quick, but once you're in the sim, you wont notice a difference.  

 

Here is one of the combo's I'm considering. http://pcpartpicker.com/p/YzTkNG

 

I'll be using my two SSD drives that are currently in my system as well as my Gigabyte GTX 970. I'm tossing around the idea of running to 970's in SLI since P3D takes advantage of SLI now. 

 

My word of advice is if you go the DIY route, get one of the new Skylake processors. This will put you on the Z170 motherboards so you'd be able to upgrade your CPU for the next few years if you decided to do so. My next system will have to last me 4 or 5 years. I'm tired of buying new every 2-3 years, so I'm making sure that I can upgrade everything when the time comes until it's time for my next build. 

 

I surely have considered building my own, however I have come to the conclusion that I would need more time than the only Saturday afternoon that I'm off to view all the tutorials and build it myself etc...

 

Alternatively I had the boring idea of just giving my local PC store the specs I want to get and let them build it for me, however the working hours i would have to pay the staff for building it would not be worth it in the end.

 

So I continued looking and caught the attention of another custom build PC the following specs:

 

 AMD FX 8320E Octa-Core Processor

 16GB DDR3 RAM

 2000GB SATA-II HDD

 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 960 

 ASRock N68-GS4/USB3 Mainboard

 

Now what I'm looking for is basically included.

 

Is there anything else I need to be aware of and look out for before I actually finalize my purchase?