Compatibility with P3D 3.x file system?

[Jimmy RFR 406]

Hello -

 

First off, because I'm not sure I've ever had cause to post in the LINDA forums before, thanks for a great addon. It's been a required part of my sim setup for a long time now.

 

Now..

 

I've recently started mucking about with P3D, and currently have 3.0 installed. I've had no issues with LINDA whatsoever, life has been good. I was able to copy in some of my aircraft modules that I normally use with great success.

 

The issue I've run into is upon installing the RealAir Legacy. Real Air has followed the recommendation put forth by LM in that they have the Legacy installed outside of the usual folder structure. Because of this, when I go to create a new module, LINDA doesn't find the Legacy folder, and therefore doesn't let me choose a proper short string.

 

Is there a workaround for this?

[ScotFlieger 280]

Hi Jimmy

 

Wherever you have installed P3D (c:/p3d) is where you need to install both FSUIPC4 and LINDA. They both reside in the modules folder (c:/p3d/modules). These cannot sit outside the main P3D folder as it is recommended for aircraft and scenery addons.

[Jimmy RFR 406]

Hi Jimmy

 

Wherever you have installed P3D (c:/p3d) is where you need to install both FSUIPC4 and LINDA. They both reside in the modules folder (c:/p3d/modules). These cannot sit outside the main P3D folder as it is recommended for aircraft and scenery addons.

 

I'm sorry, I think you may of misunderstood -

 

I have LINDA and FSUIPC functioning correctly, and installed in the proper place.  I am currently using it in P3Dv3, successfully, with a few aircraft such as the Aerosoft DA20-100 Katana.

 

However, when installing third party aircraft into P3D 3.x which comply with the recommendations set out by LM, they are not installed into the usual place.  In the case of the new Lancair Legacy, it's installed at X:\P3Dv3 Aircraft\Legacy_V2\SimObjects\Airplanes\RealAir Legacy V2.  For comparison, the default P3D aircraft are at X:\Prepar3Dv3\SimObjects\Airplanes.

 

This seems to cause a few issues - firstly, LINDA won't recognize aircraft installed outside of the usual FSX style locations, meaning that I can't create an aircraft module, because it won't let me narrow down a proper short string.

 

It also seems to cause range check errors when an aircraft such as the Legacy is loaded within the sim.

 

To test this second issue, I did a clean installation of 2.6.7 and did not add any modules. I loaded up P3D with a default aircraft - no range check error occurred. I then loaded up P3D with the Legacy.  A range check error occurred. A range check error also then occurs if I select the only available module, *FSX Default, from the module combobox within LINDA.

 

I hope this info helps.

[ScotFlieger 280]

I would recommend that all your aircraft addons and installed in one location. LINDA does not mind but FSUIPC4 may.

 

There is an error that occurs when selecting from the aircraft list is everything is not correctly installed. You say that you have several aircraft modules installed and working. If an aircraft does not have a LINDA specific module available it will only go to FSX Default. To create a new module for a new aircraft should be possible by clicking on New.

 

I am trying to pin down where the problem is that it's causing the range check errors. The more evidence I can get the better chance I have to fix it. Screenshots and console outputs are useful.

[Jimmy RFR 406]

 

 

I would recommend that all your aircraft addons and installed in one location.

 

Nope, not under P3Dv3...

 

This is a quote from the page 19 of the RealAir Lancair Legacy manual.  It mirrors the actual Prepar3d v3 specs, which I can post once I find them:

 

 

Some minor changes were necessary to make the Legacy compatible with P3D
v3. The most significant is to the installation directory - Lockheed Martin have
requested that addons made for P3D v3 be installed outside of the main P3D
v3 directory (the first time this has ever been possible with a Microsoft FS based
simulator).

[ScotFlieger 280]

I understand that LM recommends installing addons outside the main P3D folder. The point I was making its that you have your Legacy located in a different folder to your other aircraft.

 

I will need to see your /modules setup to help you further.

 

Personally I have moved all my addon scenery to a separate folder that is used by all my flight simulations (FSX/FSX-SE/P3D) and configured using scenery.cfg.

[Jimmy RFR 406]

 

 

I understand that LM recommends installing addons outside the main P3D folder. The point I was making its that you have your Legacy located in a different folder to your other aircraft.

 

Currently, I don't have any other third party aircraft installed in P3Dv3.  The other aircraft are all default. The only 3rd party aircraft I have installed in P3Dv3 at the moment is the Legacy v2, which has been installed outside of P3Dv3 as according to the prompting given by the Legacy installer.  All others have been removed.

 

I currently have a completely clean installation of LINDA.  As such, the only module I have is the FSX Default module.  LINDA is working, as I'm able to assign functions to the FSX Default module and have them operate in the sim; such as raising and lowering landing gear or flaps.

 

I cannot currently create a module for the Legacy: In the LINDA screen where you can enter a short code, the pre-populated list only includes the default installed aircraft, it does not detect the Legacy, therefore it will not let me continue.

 

I'm trying to ascertain if this issue, LINDA not being able to find the Legacy v2 aircraft folder, is something particular to my installation, or if this is a common and known result of installing a P3Dv3 aircraft outside of the main Prepar3D folder.  As well, I'm trying to establish if there's a working method to get around this.

 

I also greatly suspect that this might be one of the causes of the 'range check' error, since I only get the error on my clean LINDA installation while having the Legacy loaded, and selecting the FSX Default module from within LINDA.

 

I can attach some screenshots later tonight for you if you'd like. I realize that this program is freeware, but I'd love to help you get to the bottom of it, since it's a pretty vital item of software for many of us.

[ScotFlieger 280]

I would ask you to send me some screenshots of your /modules/linda/aircrafts folder (in explorer) and /modules/linda-cfg/aircrafts. Also the folders you have your Legacy addon installed.

 

I am assuming that you have not found a LINDA module under LINDA downloads for your Legacy aircraft and your trying to create a new one that you can code. I am also assuming that when you run LINDA 2.6.7 and FSX and load the Legacy aircraft that LINDA is sync-ing it to FSX Default module.  

 

Although I do not have your Legacy aircraft, I was able to quickly create an 'empty' module for the aircraft and the basic folder structure. This is how I did it. With just LINDA running:

1. Click on NEW beside the Aircraft Selector dropdown to open the New Aircraft Module dialog.
2. Enter the Module Name = Legacy.
3. Enter the Aircraft Search String. This should be the name of the folder where your Legacy is installed. Something like 'Legacy Mk 2'. This is where it is essential that ALL your aircraft add ons are located in ONE location. Mine are in P3D/simobjects/airplanes. For P3Dv3.1 this is defined in the simobjects.cfg file located in Windows ProgramData/Prepar3D v3 folder. As you type the search string it should list all your installed aircraft. If there is no match, the fields turn pink. This is a warning that you have not got the aircraft correctly located.
4. If you want to base the new module on an existing aircraft module, tick the Copy from existing radio button and select the appropriate a module (ie. FS Default).
5. Click on Create.

This process creates the following folder structure in /P3D/modules:

• /linda/aircrafts/legacy/ident.lua - this needs to be edited to set the sim folder to one that  matches your Legacy.
• /linda/aircrafts/legacy/actions.lua - this is where you enter the functions you plan to implement.
• /linda/aircrafts/legacy/readme.txt - this needs to be edited to design the module details that appear to the right of the Aircraft Selector dropdown.

• /linda-cfg/aircrafts/legacy/ - this will be empty until to start assigning functions to your devices.

I would caution that writing a new module is not a trivial process. They depend on the availability of a SDK for the Legacy and it is not something I have tried from scratch. Study those that already exist to learn how to do it. It is also an area I am unable to provide support on as I specialise on the core LINDA code and functionality.

 

I hope this helps. 

[Jimmy RFR 406]

For P3Dv3.1 this is defined in the simobjects.cfg file located in Windows ProgramData/Prepar3D v3 folder. As you type the search string it should list all your installed aircraft. If there is no match, the fields turn pink. This is a warning that you have not got the aircraft correctly located.

 

I'll take a closer look at this tonight - I haven't had to do anything beyond RealAir's installer to use the aircraft in the simulator, so I would assume that RealAir has it set up correctly.

 

 

 

I would caution that writing a new module is not a trivial process. They depend on the availability of a SDK for the Legacy and it is not something I have tried from scratch.

 

Compared to some of the languages I work in, Lua is quite easy.   :smile:  I'm very familiar with module creation; I've created my own for several aircraft and helicopters in the past (in FSX), as I use an extensive amount of custom hardware, and prefer to have almost every in-cockpit switch and control mapped to a hardware control.

 

By the way, I do appreciate your input and your attempt at helping me out with this!

[Jimmy RFR 406]

 

 

Enter the Aircraft Search String. This should be the name of the folder where your Legacy is installed. Something like 'Legacy Mk 2'. This is where it is essential that ALL your aircraft add ons are located in ONE location. Mine are in P3D/simobjects/airplanes. For P3Dv3.1 this is defined in the simobjects.cfg file located in Windows ProgramData/Prepar3D v3 folder.

 

I'm sorry, I've looked into this further, and I don't believe that this info you've quoted is entirely correct.

 

Following the LM recommendations, third party aircraft are encouraged to be installed outside of the default 'simobjects/airplanes' file structure. Third party developers are also allowed to modify the simobjects.cfg file, to point to the newly installed third party aircraft. In fact, in this thread:  http://www.avsim.com/topic/476713-prepar3d-v3-configuration-files-for-add-on-developers/ Fr. Bill has even shared his sample batch file where it clearly shows an example of command line parameters to show Milviz aircraft being installed in a separate Milviz specific folder.

 

After installing the Legacy v2, this is the first few entries from my simobjects.cfg file:

[Entry.0]
PATH=X:\P3Dv3 Aircraft\Legacy_V2\SimObjects\Airplanes
TITLE=RealAir Legacy V2
ACTIVE=true
REQUIRED=true
[Entry.1]
PATH=SimObjects\Airplanes
TITLE=Default Airplanes
ACTIVE=true
REQUIRED=true
[Entry.2]
PATH=SimObjects\Avatars
TITLE=Default Avatars
ACTIVE=true
REQUIRED=true
(...snipped for length)

If I had installed another, different aircraft that followed the SDK for installation, using the "Prepar3D.exe -Configure:" option, it's obvious that I might have yet another entry at the top of simobjects.cfg.

 

It's clear that this is allowed and encouraged behavior on the part of third party developers.

 

 

 

This is a warning that you have not got the aircraft correctly located.

 

It's becoming clear that LINDA is not able to read or find any 3rd party aircraft that follow these guidelines.  I hope that one day you can look into possibly adding this functionality to make LINDA fully aware of 3rd party aircraft that are installed as per the LM recommendations.

 

Until then, the workaround would seem to be to use the 'FSX Default' module for adding custom commands or actions that might be specific to an aircraft that LINDA is not able to find.

[ScotFlieger 280]

Thank you for the information about the changes made by Lockheed Martin for P3Dv3.1. I will look to add them to my list of improvement. I personally pay for 2 P3D developers licences (2.5 and 3) for this purpose.

However, I have been attempting to answer your question as to how to get LINDA working for you based on its long standing design based on the standard FSX configuration. It works for me and many other users.

[Jimmy RFR 406]

 

 

However, I have been attempting to answer your question as to how to get LINDA working for you based on its long standing design based on the standard FSX configuration. It works for me and many other users.

 

No worries - and I do appreciate your help.  I do believe that we've been approaching this from different angles. 

 

My post here was purely in regards to seeing if LINDA would work with the new P3Dv3 spec, since it's the only area where I've run into difficulties.  For regular use (standard FSX configuration), it works as intended.

 

I also realize that this is freeware, and is geared towards FSX.  If one day you are able to add the capability for LINDA to work as we've discussed, then that's great.

[ScotFlieger 280]

No worries - and I do appreciate your help.  I do believe that we've been approaching this from different angles. 

 

My post here was purely in regards to seeing if LINDA would work with the new P3Dv3 spec, since it's the only area where I've run into difficulties.  For regular use (standard FSX configuration), it works as intended.

 

I also realize that this is freeware, and is geared towards FSX.  If one day you are able to add the capability for LINDA to work as we've discussed, then that's great.

 

Thank you for highlighting the changes. I agree we were coming from totally different directions. I owe it to all LINDA users to ensure that I do not exclude any of the MS Flight Simulator versions and derivatives in use. I will investigate introducing changes to meet LM's shifted goal posts. I found it interesting that the new add on installation locations you were advocating and not what appears in the Prepar3D official website front page under Support.