What 'they say'...and what I 'see'...not aligned...

[Michael Moe 493]

I must be missing something but I have the idea I am doing the exact same but with just the settings in the sim itself and the option to save and load cfg's. I have a cfg for GA and one for the Airbus (main difference is autogen and type of AI) and I select the cfg I want to use on the scenario screen. Seems you don't need Simstarter for this...?

 

+1 to this and

 

sceneryconfigurator and thats it for me

 

Michael Moe

[TheBoom 31]

This topic is about one slider setting right?

 

Stating that you should start with all sliders to the right is really hard Mitch.

 

Some sliders like terrain shadows and some others like dynamic reflections can really put your system to an unbalanced system in my opinion.

 

Traffic and stutter can go hand in hand on my system but road traffic is much much better than with FSX.

 

Will try airport traffic slider and report back

 

Thanks Michael Moe

 

Couldn't be better put. There are quite a few settings that will cause a drop in fps or smoothness, its been proven and still the case.

 

Furthermore there's the issue of OOMs. My rig for example can handle most settings on max without too much strain, but will inevitably OOM with those kind of settings in high density areas.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

This topic is about one slider setting right?

 

Stating that you should start with all sliders to the right is really hard Mitch.

 

Some sliders like terrain shadows and some others like dynamic reflections can really put your system to an unbalanced system in my opinion.

 

Traffic and stutter can go hand in hand on my system but road traffic is much much better than with FSX.

 

Will try airport traffic slider and report back

 

Thanks Michael Moe

No...this is about opening up the sim...NOT just the one Airport Traffic Slider.  I only used that as an example of what I find as I raise all sliders for graphic objects.  I get better performance, not lesser performance.  I have seen this for years...and have published this finding also over the years.  Throttling the sim, in my opinion and experience, causes a loss of performance, rather than smoother 'action' with a seemingly higher FPS readout.

This topic is about one slider setting right?

 

Stating that you should start with all sliders to the right is really hard Mitch.

 

Some sliders like terrain shadows and some others like dynamic reflections can really put your system to an unbalanced system in my opinion.

 

Traffic and stutter can go hand in hand on my system but road traffic is much much better than with FSX.

 

Will try airport traffic slider and report back

 

Thanks Michael Moe

Mike...my suggestion,is to leave your Shadow section as Default, or creep it up by a few placements.  The big impetus, is scenery objects.  Move all autogen (the three sliders to full right.  Place Dynamic reflection to medium or low, but on....  Run A.I. at 30-35 percent for commercial, no general A.I.,  place third slider, Airport Traffic (support vehicles, etc) to full right. Water at HIGH, with Bath on...and most reflections that you like. I have them all on, except for clouds in the water, as I do not like the look of it.  Everything else is clicked on.

All my water screenshots have that.

 

Run ASN 4.1 and REX clouds with a cloud size of .62-65  My shots all are .65 for size.

 

 Now go and fly...forget the actual FPS readouts, you might see. you will see  what you have paid for...the scenery as the developer created it, for visual density...and go fly. If you achieve better performance (sim-wide) independent of your FPS readouts...then start to adjust higher the Shadow elements, as the last thing to up-tweak.  Go, until you start to get chop or stutter. Back down those settings a notch, until your performance smooths out.  THAT is your 'burn't in' config.  Enjoy...and save a back-up.

Actually, I find the same with cloud shadows, Mitch. Traffic is usually killer, but I haven't tried it at 100%... :wink:   

Yes..same here for cloud shadows...but try the "Airport Traffic at 100 percent. Go visit again,  your paid for airports, for your jaw will drop that it will also show up airport and gate 'clutter'. You paid for it...now go and enjoy it!!!!!

 

For autogen, in that section, my suggestion is to blast all three sliders to the right. Same for special effects, etc...all right.  You will get better performance, and don't worry about the FPS readings.  I have smoothness right down to 11-13 FPS displayed. in P3D v3.2.3. That is predominately why I decided to stay with 32 bit, and dropped some major coin on scenery, on the weekend.  These were properties that I had on my wish list..but held off, with my teetering back and forth between staying with my 32 bit portfolio...or cutting losses for the sake of smooth animation,and head on over to the 64 bit side of things when Dovetail drops their sim on the table.  As to my comments over the last three weeks or so, in this forum......P3D v3.2.3 is the first 32 bit sim to give me everything that I was looking for...independent now of FPS numbers, up there at the left.  When I take a screen shot, I like to keep the numbers up there for the viewer to have as a base of what is happening up there on the screen, and what the system is stating is generating for an FPS reading.  I probably now, should change that M.O. and just shoot screen grabs for artistic composition, as now, truly FPS is so much less important with this version. The more I open up the sim, and its elements, the BETTER I have performance...and for the reasons that I feel is happening.

 

Mitch 

You are right. I have always noticed that airport traffic does not really have an effect on fps. I have it far right.

 

But can you say the same for everything else? Probably not.

 

There are some settings that don't kill fps but there are some that do.

 

Regards,

In your case, I would certainly run all 'object' sliders...your autogen and scenery density sliders at nothing less than 100 percent full right on all of them. Forget the FPS reading!  You will get better sim performance out of this, than if you start to choke back and filter the elements.  This has consistently been my finding, in usage for both FSX and P3D. Same goes for the Special effects section...open those two sliders full right as well. Leave them there!

 

 

But I am going to give Mitch's thoughts a try today.  Why not?

 

Exactly...why not...let your sim rip, Gregg....keepi it  there for a week...and fly your favorite scenarios.

 

Definitely open up your Airport Traffic to 100 percent..for it really hides a lot of scenery at 3rdP's that you paid for...I was amazed when for the first time, I cranked up that little if ever used selection in the Traffic mask.  The difference with this at 100 percent at Aerosoft's Daytona Beach...is night and day...my jaw dropped at how it transformed the gate areas....wow!

 

Cheers,

[Alpha Floor 237]

Don't bother with fps. Smoothness is king, regardless of fps. I don't care if fps is 15 or 115 as long as the sim feels smooth. And I specially don't care in small fps increments under specific circumstances I never encounter during normal use.

 

I agree Joeren, but to me smoothness is more restrictive than FPS. I can't conceive 15 FPS as being "smooth".

 

I mean, you can have all the FPS and not have enough Smoothness. But you can't have Smoothness with low FPS.

 

First get the FPS to 30 or above, then you can start talking about smoothness. My humble opinion

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

I agree Joeren, but to me smoothness is more restrictive than FPS. I can't conceive 15 FPS as being "smooth".

 

I mean, you can have all the FPS and not have enough Smoothness. But you can't have Smoothness with low FPS.

 

First get the FPS to 30 or above, then you can start talking about smoothness. My humble opinion

Oh yes you can...lol....I was amazed in seeing this particular version:  P3D v3.2.3 go on my system as LOW as 11 fps...on an approach with a thunderstorm in play..and STILL had full control and smooth animation right down to the numbers and tax to the gate.  That is exactly what I have been raving over, for the last three weeks since adding this sim to my portfolio.  

 

Even P3D v2.4 couldn't do that....and if there is one single thing for me to highlight to other v2.x users..that v3.x is NOT v2.6 with lipstick on...is its performance. Everybody (the early adopters who right away saw this...were very much right.)  I thought at the time it was the Placebo Effect in play.

 

 Nope...it was real metrics in play.  Because of seeing that I can be stutter free down to as low as 11 FPS ...is exactly what motivated me this weekend to bring my Wish List for scenery to the state of '0'.  I'm staying with 32 bit, with no chagrins about it.  I finally have a 32 bit flight sim that makes having the FPS meter readout, truly an obsession option....and nothing more.  The sim is deadly smooth now...

 

Yes..I understand that I see this on my system, with all my particular hardware in play...but I am so very happy to state that I am indeed enjoying this state-of-affairs.  Until P3D v3.2.3...it wasn't happening.  I had still micro-stutter in some scenery situations, with FSX and v2.4 and down.

[Alpha Floor 237]

 

 

11 fps...on an approach with a thunderstorm in play..and STILL had full control and smooth animation right down to the numbers and tax to the gate

 

I guess I'll have to see that to believe it!

 

Stranger things have been proven to me, so hey, I'm happy to be proven wrong in this issue

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

I guess I'll have to see that to believe it!

 

Stranger things have been proven to me, so hey, I'm happy to be proven wrong in this issue

Right, Jaime...I certainly had never had that in my prior experience. In all my past interaction with flight sims...if you got much below 18 FPS, you were into the dregs. 

 

That's what blew my mind over P3D v3.2.3...was that you COULD...well...that I COULD, go that low on my system, and still run as though it was showing an FPS of 28-33.  

 

That truly was the one push in the back to keep coming back to the this forum..with WOW posts....for Mark..it is a WOW, in a major way.

 

Yesterday I was at 13 FPS for a minute or two, as I turned onto the runway at LatinVFR Miami v3  (I must say that I have the scenery adjusted at maximum output, all features as clicked on in the set-up mask), the the sim pretty much at 95 percent, ripped...... and you know what?   It didn't matter one iota...for if I had not had the FPS meter running in the left corner...by sheer animation performance alone..I would have NEVER guessed I was sitting anywhere near 13, but to assume I was at 22 and higher.  That is the beauty of P3D v3.2.3 on my system.  Kudos to L.M. and the wow in my wow...is justified! 

 

Ses

[Guest]

I agree Joeren, but to me smoothness is more restrictive than FPS. I can't conceive 15 FPS as being "smooth".

 

I mean, you can have all the FPS and not have enough Smoothness. But you can't have Smoothness with low FPS.

 

First get the FPS to 30 or above, then you can start talking about smoothness. My humble opinion

Ah, yes, well, I didn't mean to say 15 is smooth to me. Usually things get ugly on my PC when fps drops below 20. Even low 20s can look bad depending on what I am doing. I have to add that I did have times that I got a very low fps, like below 15, during for instance an approach but didn't really notice it because I was just looking straight ahead instead of all around me with my TrackIR. Things are best above 30 IMHO.

 

My point was that fps isn't of importance: smoothness is. When I changed settings (in the time I was trying to find the sweet spot) I simply looked at what was happening around me and not at the fps counter (like I did in the past). I lowered settings until things moved smooth and that was it. I couldn't care less about winning for instance 4 fps over for instance 25 when you do 360 degree around your plane or whatever. I want my sim to look good when I am in the pilot's seat.

 

And btw I can't confirm Mitch's findings. When I raise certain settings, performance drops. As is to be expected. I am glad it works for Mitch but it doesn't work for me nor, for I am sure, most users. Setting autogen full right when flying my Airbus totally kills performance. Obviously.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Ah, yes, well, I didn't mean to say 15 is smooth to me. Usually things get ugly on my PC when fps drops below 20. Even low 20s can look bad depending on what I am doing. I have to add that I did have times that I got a very low fps, like below 15, during for instance an approach but didn't really notice it because I was just looking straight ahead instead of all around me with my TrackIR. Things are best above 30 IMHO.

 

My point was that fps isn't of importance: smoothness is. When I changed settings (in the time I was trying to find the sweet spot) I simply looked at what was happening around me and not at the fps counter (like I did in the past). I lowered settings until things moved smooth and that was it. I couldn't care less about winning for instance 4 fps over for instance 25 when you do 360 degree around your plane or whatever. I want my sim to look good when I am in the pilot's seat.

 

And btw I can't confirm Mitch's findings. When I raise certain settings, performance drops. As is to be expected. I am glad it works for Mitch but it doesn't work for me nor, for I am sure, most users. Setting autogen full right when flying my Airbus totally kills performance. Obviously.

Jeroem...

 

I was just about to come here and post to SteveW about running his AM=116 on my i7-975 Extreme series CPU at an overclock of 4.3 GHz.  Well...I guess he will read this as I post to you.  What I was about to say, (or type, lol) was that recently I decided to purchase Aerosoft's City X-Detroit (Detroit Metro KDTW),  

 

This scenery Jeroem, is quite extensive, in that it not only brings KDTW (Detroit Metro) up to virtual...but it addresses all the other regional airports near and about the G.D.A (Greater Detroit Area).  Not only that..but it redoes the Detroit River...in conjunction with Ultimate Terrain (you tell the installer, if you have U.T. USA and Canada on your system before it goes into action...) It totally remakes downtown Detroit...(and folks, if you are a Michigander...my gawd...GRAB this product...you TRULY have no idea what you are virtually missing out on in this area if you do now...and oh no...you don't...but I digress...)

 

...anyway...to SteveW, and to you Jeroem, I have the sim pretty well (except for Shadow section, where it is just slightly above sim -default, with my shadow quality slider to MEDIUM)) but all object and reflection settings except for clouds upon the water...as off).. ripped...so think of this with the following screen grabs of Aerosoft's City X-Detroit seen here.

 

SteveW....what I did differently when thinking about all you have (and thank you!) stated regarding how all the Sim Jobs play out across my H.T. (8 cores)...was to just sit at the G.A. ramp, with the FPS counter on, at the start of P3D v3.2.3 placing me into the world.  

 

My FPS at that exact moment was around 8.7 FPS.  It would fluctuate to 10-11..but then back to around 8.x FPS.  I just sat there, with your explanation of what goes on in the JOB and 'core' background...just sat there, not moving the Amphib.  At about three minutes after being injected into the virtual world...my FPS shot up instantly to 27FPS! ----and then stayed there...27...24...28...31...26...28...you get the picture...with all the A.I. plane movements starting to happen.  I then started my engine, Steve and Jeroem...and moved on out, with hitting the 'V' key along the way.  My animation (with the sim settings and the scenery settings in play...mostly at max on both fronts...) stayed between 14-32.8 FPS!!!  

 

So, here is the taxi to active of just that... to all Michiganders (and everybody else...((smile))...this scenery is KILLER!   A must have...Aerosoft has done a wonderful job of this airport and surrounding square mile highlights and landmarks for the G.D.A.  I fly out of this airport on business extensively...and again..I feel right at home!

 

So here are the shots, just before I head on out, for a flight over the Detroit River, and Lake St.Clair, towards Bad Axe, Michigan...  Performance, Jeroen, is smooth, absolutely smooth in all animation at this airport...at these FPS readouts...from low to high...and to SteveW...I now know to let the sim 'process its CORE jobs...' and allow a 3-5 minute pre-flight time period for this.

 

Steve...this is probably where the power is for having HT on...and all those cores working the job threads out.  

 

Enjoy the pics...and all FPS readings in the taxi produced smooth as cream stutter and jerk-free animation. I am home, man...I ah HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOME!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I would like to acknowledge over the years...all the very helpful insights, conjecture, personal takes, to get me to this week of simply fantastic 32 bit performance, a fantastic virtual world, where I can now run all my 3rdP scenery at max settings, and get the visuals that are there...buried there in the files..and get what I have paid for. I hope that others can work this all out too, on their systems. There is SO MUCH that is in these custom sceneries..and to have the sim filtered to not display it to you..is well...almost criminal in nature...

 

Folks, OPEN UP your sim...let it breathe....and enjoy what is in that scenery...ORBX, or other...enjoy each and every feature of the P3D itself...let the WOW factor, never go stale...

 

Now..up and over the G.D.A....and VFR to my heart's content...life is good...ah yes...life is good...

 

Cheers,!

 

Ses

[Michael Moe 493]

I dont see any improvement as well and can confirm that 3.2.3 with PMDG 777 can have memory allocation and massive stutters even with 26-29 fps even with GPU load as low as 30%. Older scenarios like FT LGAV on a 5hour trip.

 

But good for Mitch

 

Michael Moe

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

I dont see any improvement as well and can confirm that 3.2.3 with PMDG 777 can have memory allocation and massive stutters even with 26-29 fps even with GPU load as low as 30%. Older scenarios like FT LGAV on a 5hour trip.

 

But good for Mitch

 

Michael Moe

Well, Michael, all my comments and shots, are without 3rdP PMDG products, but 3rdP G.A.  That is my pref.  For Heavy Iron..I only use the ported FSX 737-800 for visuals...when I do take an FL trip.  I guess we all agree then...YMMV (Your millage may vary, system-to-system, G.A. vs. Commercial air-frames, etc)

 

Good flights..no matter how you spec' it

 

Mitch

[TheBoom 31]

Well that explains it. It's impossible to fly a well detailed tube liner at maxed settings and get smoothness at low fps let alone not OOM on a 2 hour flight.

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Well that explains it. It's impossible to fly a well detailed tube liner at maxed settings and get smoothness at low fps let alone not OOM on a 2 hour flight.

Yep Boom..I have always stated that I don't do Heavy Iron ever, in either FSX or P3D. I reserve that for FS9.  So...all my postings, are always with the proviso, that it is 3drP G.A. and of course then whatever scenery I purchase and make note of.

 

[Guest Mik75]

Mitch, please keep in mind, that all of your observations are obviously taking place in Carenado aircraft or similar types of addons, that have very light or no real system modeling.

Try these settings in an PMDG aircraft or in the Aerosoft Airbus, and things will look much worse!

GA flying is your style of simming, and that's totally cool and ok. And if cranking up the sim brings you better performance, that's even cooler!

But for the users that love to fly heavies (aircraft and system wise), things are quite different. ;-)

[Sesquashtoo 2,846]

Mitch, please keep in mind, that all of your observations are obviously taking place in Carenado aircraft or similar types of addons, that have very light or no real system modeling.

Try these settings in an PMDG aircraft or in the Aerosoft Airbus, and things will look much worse!

GA flying is your style of simming, and that's totally cool and ok. And if cranking up the sim brings you better performance, that's even cooler!

But for the users that love to fly heavies (aircraft and system wise), things are quite different. ;-)

True...but it still applies..whenever they choose to step out of the heavy..and get into G.A. VFR or IFR.  Then..my observations all stand.

 

Have a good one...have to land after tooling and buzzing over downtown Detroit...and before the F.A.A.  comes knocking at my door....LOL!

 

I highly recommend each of my weekend purchases for anybody.  Not one 'not recommended in the bunch'.  

 

Cheers,~