What do you think about BAV?

[Kosta 122]

Doesn't matter if BAV (British Airways Virtual) member or not, I'd like to know your opinion!Thanks!

[aerdt 0]

I have been a BAV member for a few months. I would consider it to be a "nice, average" VA. Initially, I was disappointed and expected a little bit more realism, because of the level of detail of the layout and the operations manual. In my eyes, BAV fell short of my expectations, because it is just an very average airline without a lot of depth. I tried their "assigned flight system" for one week and gave up after I got flights assigned to me that I didn't sign up for (for example, you can specify the duration of flights and the aircraft type). The "type ratings" are pretty much eye-candy only and standard (more hours = better typerating). All-in-all, just your nice, average VA with a friendly community.If they only offered some training/check-flights and a more realistic operations. I am still waiting for a VA that offers pilot training from scratch. Something to work towards, not just another stripe or star.My favorites are still the Virtual Pilots Association, which does not limit you to any VA (however you can fly for any VA and get credit at the same time at VPA), Midcontinent Airlines for their realism and Onyx (German VA) for their fun factor and realism.

[Kosta 122]

Thanks for your reply.I'm currently with both BAV and Onyx. Been with BAV for a long time, and am actually pretty satisfied with it, although some factors like TypeRatings are missing, which I also find a downside.Although, Onyx on the other hand, doesn't have what BAV does - ACARS system for online or offline flying. Which basically doesn't allow you to cheat, even if anyone would want that.....I applied right now to MidConAir to check their system and realism.I hope I don't get disappointed :)

[aerdt 0]

You'll be happy with Midcon. They're by far the more realistic VA that I have come across. Initially you will have to pass a theoretical exam and test flight. All flights will be dispatched to you on a regular basis and are extremely realistic. Also you'll have to provide flight recorder logs in certain intervals to stay FAA-compliant. Is it really a lot of fun and informative as well.Onyx is a great VA as well. Yes, the lack of a good Pirep/ACARS system is disappointing, but it is still pretty realistic, because you can only depart from your current location (same as Midcon) and their new X6 booking system is great!Let me know what you think. If you come across another good VA, let me know.

[Guest]

Who cares if you want to cheat?If you can't trust yourself not to cheat if there's noone watching over your shoulder, all you do is destroy your own longterm enjoyment...It's not as if others are hurt financially because of it.From the people I've spoken to BAV seems like a well run organisation with some nice and knowledgable people.Personally I think they're a bit too rigid in their procedures (like the ACARS system and type ratings, route assignments, etc.).Myself I like the freedom of choosing what to fly on which route and when for myself, freedom TCA gives me.It's a hobby after all, not a job, and in my job I've enough people telling me what to do :)

[Guest vrandar]

>I tried their "assigned flight system" for one week and gave up after I got flights assigned to me that I didn't sign up for (for example,>you can specify the duration of flights and the aircraft>type). There have been problems with the assigned flights for some months after a major server issue. I believe it is likely that these will be discontinued.>If they only offered some training/check-flights and a more>realistic operations. I think you perhaps have not explored BAV enough. Go to the speedbirdonline website (part of BAV) and you can have personal one-to-one or group training in all sorts of areas, from online flying to specific type training (in my case on the A320 family). No we do not do check flights but there appears to be little demand for it from our pilots. But do contact one of the Board members via the forum and feed in the request.On realism, the schedules are the real BA ones. The exception is with World Cargo where some other routes have come in. It would be hard to make the schedules any more real other than absolutely forcing the pilot to fly the type and only the type BA use on that route. Most do use the type (it is stated in the massive schedules program) but any more restriction might not be welcome.With a very active forum, superb software (ACARS, schedules, etc), good training, 1250 very professional and well-regarded pilots and formal endorsement from British Airways I think it is an outstanding VA. But in the immortal words of Mandy Rice-Davies "well he would say that wouldn't he" :)

[Guest Lobaeux4]

At first I was a little annoyed by this thread. I thought, what does a thread asking an opinion on a VA have to do with MSFS discussion. BUT, after thinking about it, it really, really is very relevant to MSFS. One of the great things about MSFS is it's ability to do what you want, ie. like an open-ended console game. For me, I unfortuanetly don't have an interest in flying around without a purpose, sight-seeing just doesn't do it for me. So, I need a purpose, a reason, and some direction. VA's do that for me.Okay, back to the reason for the thread. I'm a previous member of BAV. I had started using MSFS back in before FS98, but mainly to prepare me for pilot training. I didn't start getting into the VA portion of flying until FS2000. I looked around and after stints at Northwest VA, Continental VA, VirtualUPS, and Timberwolf (which was actually a really, really cool VA), I found BAV on the net. I was initially intrigued, especially because of their ACARS. Flying around Europe didn't interest me so much, but since BA is a world-wide airline, I didn't think that'd be a problem. PLUS, and this was a huge benefit, BA and BAV use a huge amount of different airframes. I got to try out all kinds of different aircraft. This was both a benefit and a detriment. A benefit because I could fly what I wanted, a detriment because I tended to buy too many different aircraft, and only flew them a couple of times, hence the reason I purchased the PSS 747 and 777. Reaslistic schedules, realistic routes and a really cool paint scheme was enough to get me to join. Exclusivety was also kinda cool. I think management was limiting membership to 1000 pilots, so I felt kinda special being one of those pilots with BAV. There is also a pretty good training department, as specified above through Speedbirdonline. I was pretty impressed with this facet of the airline. Finally, the forums section was very active. A big benefit and reason to join a VA is because of the people who make up that VA, being able to talk to them, especially through the forums was really cool. Being able to discuss flight sim issues, new flight sim products and just flying in general is something you can do with just about every VA, but at BAV, the forums were very active. Overall, my time spent at BAV was fun.I only had a couple of problems with BAV, and sad to say I didn't do anything about them. First, although the routes are realistic, and there is a 'dispatch' to what you're going to fly, the whole system to me seemed, and I stress 'seemed' a little unrealistic. The fact that I could fly any aircraft I wanted, without true training or any regulations (other than maybe attaining some sort of hours requirement) kinda rankled me, mainly because I know that's not how real life airlines operate. Maybe unrealistic isn't the right word, 'incomplete' might be a little better. It's hard to put down any specifics on why I say incomplete, it's been some time since I was a pilot at BAV, but looking back now, especially after my time at my present VA, it just seems that way. Secondly, there were defenite personality clashes at this VA. Not really between myself and anyone, but there was always the underlying current of personality problems throughout the VA. Guys who seemed to be 'cheating' on hours flown and the allegations about them were somewhat of a problem. Guys who were ate up with jealousy about the success of the VA, who tried smear campaigns against the BAV management. The egotistical response to these guys also seemed to bother me. This was only from a small portion of the pilots, but enough that it kinda spoiled the sense of "family" I like to see in a VA.I guess my overall impression of BAV was favorable. A VA that's very active, offers a true-to-life airline name, and provides a purpose in flying, but just didn't quite satisfy my need for realism, I always felt like I was just barely missing that sense of accomplishment I was looking for.As someone said above, MidContinent is easily the most realistic VA available, I haven't seen a VA that comes close to matching the realism we have at MidCon. Not to act like a commercial here for MidCon, just wanted to reiterate what was already said.

[aerdt 0]

Lobeaux, I totally agree with your impressions. I demand the most possible realism from a VA, because that what makes it fun. However, I do agree that a lot of pilots just want to "start up FS and fly". We do have the payware planes available that provide us ultra-realism and then we only fly them in an not-so-realistic environment. Is just doesn't make sense to me.I do have yet to find the perfect VA that offers me training and a type rating that truly means something. I want to learn and progress and a passed checkride would give me probably more satisfaction than selecting one flight out of a few hundred. I am ticked off that most VAs seem to follow the approach that more hours on a plane would make the perfect pilot. It resembles more playing Everquest than reality.MidCon is the most realistic VA around, yes, but the training stops as soon as you have passed your initial checkride. Sure, you can do the Airbus, ETOPS and ILS CAT II/III checkrides, but that's about it. However, the MidCon dispatch is the best around.The perfect VA in my eyes would guide the new pilot through a very detailed ground school, simulator rides and then "real" flying lessons, before the newbie pilot can even carry passengers.Especially BAV would have a GREAT potential, if it was just a tad more realistic with a good dispatch system a la MidCon and a improved training opportunities. I want to fly legs like pilots in real life. Offer us a daily "real life" schedule in a pilot's life that needs to be "virtually" flown within, let's say a week or even at the VA pilots leisure.

[Guest]

Try GlobeCargo (Atlas Air Virtual).They mimmick realworld Atlas operations closely.No checkrides or stuff, but in an airline operating only a single type and hiring only typerated crew for that type such aren't needed :)Dispatch is realistic. Pilots bid for routes and get assignments based on seniority. Acars system for reporting.Assignments are for a single route for a set period at set days and times. Unassigned flights are not allowed to be logged (so are effectively not flown as far as the VA is concerned).After assignments are flown pilots can bid on charters and other routes as available.I left because it was too restrictive for me. But it seems you may well like it as you seem to want such a restrictive environment.

[Kosta 122]

Lobeaux,I see you are a Assistant Chief Pilot at MidCon.I've been trying to contact you guys for like a day, and trying to send my checkride. The website is giving me only erros when I attempt to send the checkride? Is there something wrong? It's kinda weird that such a popular VA has such a buggy website?

[Guest Lobaeux]

Hiya, sorry about the website. Right now it is a little buggy, something to do with the ISP switching servers and such, without alerting our website guy, way above my head. Should be fixed before too long. For now you can email your checkride to me at acp@midconair.comWe'll handle the checkride quickly.As for the training bit, it's true, MidCon's training department was a little lax. An employment checkride, then the CATII/III, ETOPS, and ILS/PRM checkride/tests and then that was about it. The training department though has gone through a total overhaul. They have released operations manuals for all fleets, and the training will be much more extensive. MidCon will no longer be a checkride to get in the door and that's it. There will be much more to do as things become situated. I hate to try and recommend a VA in these forums, but what I will say: If you're looking for the most realistic VA, MidContinent is your only choice, I just add one caveat. Just like was said earlier, MidCon isn't a VA that you can just "hop in and fly", it does take a bit of preflight work, knowing your regulations (sometimes you get a dispatch that you actually can't accept for one reason or another, be it because of equipment, weather, or your qualifications, WOE be to the guy who does accept an improper dispatch), and you have to realise that just like in real life, you're only type-rated for one type of aircraft. MidCon flies A320/A330, 737, and 757/767, you only fly one fleet and you can't hop around between fleets without losing seniority and having to pass a checkride in the new type. Guys that become disappointed with MidCon, this is usually their biggest problem.It really is at the top of the class as far as VA's go!

[Guest Gordius]

WHY HASN'T THIS THREAD BEEN MOVED TO VA WORLD. DOESN'T LOOK LIKE GENERAL DISCUSSION ABOUT MSFS TO ME!Andrew BrownRoaring Thirtieshttp://www.gordiusfs.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/

[Guest]

It's long since changed from a discussion about a specific VA to a discussion about the merits of different business models for VAs :)

[Guest Groundcrew]

I've been with BAV for nearly two years and am very satified. There have been times when I haven't been able to fly enough due to work and a dead motherboard, I e-mailed HR and was promptly replied to and given extra time.Other VA's may offer more training and other bells and whistles, but for my purposes, BAV suits me well.http://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/ng_driver.jpghttp://www.precisionmanuals.com/images/forum/747400.jpgSemper en excretum, solo profundum variat!