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Kai Tak in fs9?

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Guest Paragon

That looks sweet, got any more pictures...let me know if you need any help. I would give an arm and a leg to fly the 747 into this airport. Perhaps we could scare up some volunteers to help out.

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>>>I remember finding some dynamic AI that would simulate the actual >>>IGS13 approach! I would sit at the runway threshold and stare at >>>the planes coming in...it's just so fascinating.That was for FS2000, Mikkel, yes ... the only AI that has ever been designed to date that follows the correct IGS approach to R13 with the 47' turn on short final. FS9 AI can't do that ... yet.The file is at www.swiremariners.com/flysma.html for anyone who wants to try it.MarkMark "Dark Moment" BeaumontVP Fleet, DC-3 AirwaysTeam Member, MAAM-SIM[a href=http://www.swiremariners.com/cathayhk.html" target="_blank]http://www.paxship.com/maamlogo2.jpg[/a]


_________________________

 

Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumont

VP Fleet, DC-3 Airways

Team Member, MAAM-SIM

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Guest Darren Howie

Loved that vid especially the flashes from realoty to the sim.Oh to dream!!DArren

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Guest yarvelling

Looks really good so far Clutch Cargo :) Excellent! Thank you.....very much :)

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>>>the only AI that has ever been designed to date that follows the correct IGS approach to R13 with the 47' turn on short final. FS9 AI can't do that ... yet.This is not true. There are many complex approaches in the default FS9 database that AI traffic/planes will be vectored to when on a IFR FP. Consider the LDA LOC/DME 26L approach at PHNL. When weather is less then 3 mile visibilty AI Planes track inbound on a 315 degree heading (base leg) then turn to a 270 degree True Heading (259 degree Mag Heading) within 1 mile from the runway threshold. Another unique FS9 default approach for AI Traffic is PADU in Alaska. That airport has one hard surface runway 12/30 but the AI Planes fly a very complex approach to a non exsistant "GPS" runway="36" suffix="E" baseleg to land. The FS9 default database reads as follows.I have been developing both ILS and curved approaches for different airports since June of 2004. Unlike FS9 my approaches are written for both VMC and IMC airport conditions.Example, You can download KLAS, PHNL, LOWI which all use a different approach scheme for AI Planes that I have here on AVSIM.KLAS have curved offset (base leg real world) approaches to both runways 19R and 7RLOWI have the approaches for AI Aircraft coming down the valley and then a turn to short final. I wrote these approaches for high terrain avoidance. I included all the approach charts so the user aircraft can select the AI Traffic Approach or Published Approaches.PHNL (also for terrain avoidance) has the most offset (curved) approaches of all the airports that I have done. All 4 runways (26L, 26R, 22L, 22R) fly over CKH (Koko Head VOR) on a heading of 300 degrees and then a short left turn to final for each of the runways. Runway 26L, AI Traffic fly the default LDA approach both VMC and IMCRunway 26R, AI Traffic fly down the beach on an extened base leg and then a short left turn to final.Runway 22L and 22R, AI Traffic fly extended parallel base legs between downtown and the mountain ridge and then make a shallow left turn of 60 degrees to final within 1 mile from the runway thresholds.I have completed the Kai Tak IGS 13 approach for the AI Traffic but have not uploaded yet. Here is the problem.MSN made sure all their default planes can double as AI Traffic type planes also. That means even the B777 and B747 FS9 defaults are tweaked with proper FD's so they have no problem executing a LDA or IGS type offset approach when I write it in the database. It's all the other AI Planes designed by developers that can't turn on short final at low altitudes and align properly to the runway. It appears that 3rd party AI planes are only tweak for straight in type approaches because a lot of user's think that is all that FS9 can do. As stated above there needs to be a frame rate friendly VHHX designed. FPS also effect AI traffic behavior and any type FS9 curved approach to landing must be fluid.My next version (upload) for Atlanta (KATL) will actually have the four STAR arrivals that both AI Planes and User Aircraft will be vectored to. These include MACEY2, ROME2, SINCA3 and LAGRANGE1. This is still being tested but all AI Traffic is immediately vectored to MACEY2 and SINCA3 STAR arrivals when landing west once they enter the visual AI Zone (108NM).Same applies when landing East. ATC vectors AI Traffic using a heading that places all AI Planes onto the ROME2 and LAGRANGE1 Arrival then a turn to final at 9 miles from the runways. No more extended downwinds to any runway at KATL.Do a search at AVSIM using Matthew Ministry (Authors Name) for additional curved approaches that he has done. I believe he already did one for Ronald Reagan rwy 19 so AI Traffic fly down the Potomac River with a right turn to short final.Again be reminded that your 3rd party AI Plane may miss a curved approach runway and that is a designer FD issue not a FS9 issue.

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Guest Paragon

>That was for FS2000, Mikkel, yes ... the only AI that has ever>been designed to date that follows the correct IGS approach to>R13 with the 47' turn on short final. FS9 AI can't do that>... yet.>>The file is at www.swiremariners.com/flysma.html for anyone>who wants to try it.>>Mark>>Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumont>VP Fleet, DC-3 Airways>Team Member, MAAM-SIMIs was for fs2000, true, but it works fine in fs9 as well. It looks spectacular I think. :D

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Yes, it works fine, Mikkel. I use it in FS9 also, together with static aircraft for Kai Tak.Jim, thanks for posting, that's a real education and excellent news that you are working on one for Kai Tak. I have your LOWI work, yes, I knew about the offset of course but did not take on board that aircraft could curve on final approach. And it's good to hear MS vindicated for once, rather than trashed! I'd be quite happy to see ANY aircraft that could make the correct IGS approach and curve into R13 ... forget the third party applications, just set it up for the default 737 and 747, perhaps. There are plenty of appropriate paints for the default aircraft and if you do that, maybe we'll make a few more!MarkMark "Dark Moment" BeaumontVP Fleet, DC-3 AirwaysTeam Member, MAAM-SIM[a href=http://www.swiremariners.com/cathayhk.html" target="_blank]http://www.paxship.com/maamlogo2.jpg[/a]


_________________________

 

Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumont

VP Fleet, DC-3 Airways

Team Member, MAAM-SIM

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Guest Knikolaes

>Well maybe he's the chap to ask ... his email is at the end>of the video. Incidentally, I could have done without the>real-world crash shot in the middle of it; that clip is>nothing to do with Kai Tak, so that is a little annoying. >Maybe that's what put people off joining his team.>>>Mark>I dunno . . . I wasn't put off by the crash at all. To me that is actually one of the things Kai Tak was famous for -- crashes. And before you go aff and call me morbid or start flaming me, lemme explain . . . I caught the purpose of that shot -- showing the challenge of the landing and what can happen if you do not do the landing with utmost skill and attention. To me the Kai Tak crashes are a reminder to keep myself in gear and pay attention to what the heck I am doing.But then again i could be biased. I am constantly watching crash videos here at home -- learing from mistakes . . . so I do not end up making myself one of those balls of fire.Awesome looking project. I hope they finish it. I have the Hong Kong 2004 mentioned in the first reply and had it installed for a mere 15 minutes before UNinstalling it. Not only did it not blend well, but there was apparently a conflict with my Flight Environment that made water textures "flash" between default and HK2k4's . . . making it sem like a flatten switch issue or effect issue. VERY distracting for this addon. If they would have just done the land and not the water, it still would have sucked -- but at last it would have been tolerable.Ont hat note, if anyone has any idea if the water is in it's own BGL's, and if so which ones -- I might give HK2k4 another try . . . Any ideas?

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MarkI have tested the AI Aardvark and PAI Heavies (good FD's) for my IGS 13 approach into VHHX and they seek the runway pretty good on close turn to final (at the checkerboard or at least where it would be). A couple planes look like that real world video (I think is on your web site) where the B747 lands almost sideways.I wanted to wait until there is a good scenery that's Frame friendly from the people that some here have posted on. Don't know if they will ever finish it because like some say "their site is down".

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Guest jgreth123

Mark, There have been numerous engine strikes and touching down with huge crabs to the point of ripping tires off. The fireball that is shown in the video didn't appear to be the entire plane in flames, just an engine strike that could have ripped the engine off and the fuel from that fuel valve caught on fire. I didn't see the fire spread to the other side.... but the image was kinda low quality so it was tough to really tell.

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Guest Paragon

>I dunno . . . I wasn't put off by the crash at all. To me>that is actually one of the things Kai Tak was famous for -->crashes. And before you go aff and call me morbid or start>flaming me, lemme explain . . . Actually, as far as I know there have never been a crash at Kai Tak...only some hard landings and a couple of planes that went off the edge of the runway. Go check airliners.net and see if you can find a crash photo.

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Hi all... no, our site is not down (at least at the moment ;)) Sometimes we go over our monthly bandwidth quota.We had plan to release this in 2005 (a nice Xmas present), but alas, the moment you state a release date ya just know things will go wrong (I call it not Murphy's Law but Flightsim's Law). This is not only our first major addon project (so you modelers know how much involement that takes), but we are also actually learning the process for the very first time as we move along. Aaaagh! And then to make it with quality so people will want it on their systems AND to make it a version that is framerate friendly... well, you get the idea. Oh, and by the way it is a freeware project.As an FYI regarding the video's crash segment:"I caught the purpose of that shot -- showing the challenge of the landing and what can happen if you do not do the landing with utmost skill and attention. To me the Kai Tak crashes are a reminder to keep myself in gear and pay attention to what the heck I am doing."Christopher caught my intention of the purpose of crash shot I used. It was not meant to be historical fact, merely a director's freedom to get prospective modelers exited about coming on board. Some luv the shot - others hate it... just like any other addon ;)There were "accidents" or one might call them crashes at Kai Tak. On August 24, 1965 A US Marine Hercules C-130 taking troops back to Vietnam burst into flames seconds after lifting off from Runway 13. Only 12 of the 71 military personnel on board could be rescued before the aircraft sunk in the harbour. This was the worst accident in history of Kai Tak. But overall Kai Tak actually a very safely run airport, challenging yes, but safe. So again the actual reason for closing the airport was really due to capacity (and noise as stated above). Just before the big move ATC was handling an average of 30 movements per hour with peaks of 38! That's moving 28,000,000 passengers a year on one runway! (VATSIM... we have a challenge for ya!)I have attracted some very good modelers to the project but we definately could use more to help lesson the load. Of course if you've done 3-d modeling we are interested but even if you just have a certain specialty or interest, ie; textures, photoreal groundwork, PDF work, manuals, taking photos, etc., and wanna jump in - email me keep flyin'Clutch Cargo"alias ponyboy""alias socalmarcus"(yes a new nickname to represent my new fledging bush cargo service, "Clutch Cargo... when your Cargo's in a Clutch")


simwestFOTOREAL series
Photoreal scenery you'll want to fly thru, not over

 

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<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>OK, the full details:China Airlines Flight 642 was a flight that flew from Bangkok International Airport in Bangkok to Hong Kong International Airport in Hong Kong operated by China Airlines' subsidiary Mandarin Airlines. The flight was supposed to fly onward to Taipei after the stop at Hong Kong. Due to severe weather situation at Hong Kong, the flight crew had prepared to divert the flight to fly directly to Taipei if the situation at Hong Kong was deemed unsuitable for landing. However, approaching Hong Kong and after initial weather and wind check being passed from the airport, the crew believed that it could land there and thus decided against a diversion. Before the arrival of flight 642 four flights carried out missed approaches, five planes diverted and 12 planes landed successfully.At about 6:43 P.M. on 22 August 1999, B-150, the MD-11 was making a final approach when a severe Tropical Storm Sam was 50km NE of the airport. At an altitude of 700 feet prior to touchdown a further wind check was passed to the crew: 320deg/28 knots gusting to 36 knots. It should be noted that maximum crosswind component limit for the aircraft was 24 knots. However, the crew neglected this and continued the landing. During the final flare to land, the plane banked on its right, landed hard on its right main gear and the no.3 engine touched the runway. The right main gear separated and the right wing separated. The plane rolled upside down and skidded off the runway in flames. When it stopped, it was on its back and the rear of the plane was on fire, coming to rest on a grass area next to the runway, 1100m from the runway threshold. The right wing was found on a taxiway 90m from the nose of the plane. The fuselage of the aircraft was burned completely in the accident. However, heavy rain during the time and quick response from rescue teams in the airport put out the fire quickly.Incredibly, only 3 of the 300 passengers died. No crew were killed.http://forums.avsim.net/user_files/133379.jpgThe final report of the accident blamed it mainly on pilot error.In conclusion, and staying on subject, that is the only reason I found it inappropriate in Ponyboys' video, that's all. It's nothing to do with Kai Tak, although it was in Hong Kong, yes.MarkMark "Dark Moment" BeaumontVP Fleet, DC-3 AirwaysTeam Member, MAAM-SIM[a href=http://www.swiremariners.com/cathayhk.html" target="_blank]http://www.paxship.com/maamlogo2.jpg[/a]


_________________________

 

Mark "Dark Moment" Beaumont

VP Fleet, DC-3 Airways

Team Member, MAAM-SIM

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