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Louis8

Questions on 737-200

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I just bought the Capt. Sim 737-200 yesterday Feb 9 2017--base pack . Is there any thing to do to it cause i'm almost regretting buying it . i just put in the csx737.air file and i'll see how that goes . I had the Milviz one and the CWS worked like a charm in it (Sperry 77 )and this one is not the same at all  the trim setting is sure not right . and I can't shut off number one engine -when i mouse the lever to the  shut off position it only goes 1/2 way and won't shut down. If i set the trim to the V-one gauge in the green say 5.0 the plane lifts off by it self before V1. Tried searching for these problems but nothing really to fix them .And i did install it as Admin. Maybe there's some updates that i dont know about is why i'm posting cause if this is as good as it gets i'l chock it up to more money wasted .

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Hello Louis,

 

CS recommend to install as admin (checked) and with all antivirus software off.

 

Do you start your sim with a pre defined flight? Perhaps you should create a new flight with the default 737, safe as standard, restart and then select the CS 737 in the aircraft dialogue. I own the CS 737 for years and had no problems so far.

 

Matthias

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Thanks Matt, i spent about 2 days, on this  i reinstalled  like you said and i had to delete the .ini FUIPC file and recalibrate every thing. It's not to bad now  but is there a trim fix cause its not right , what the V-gauge says to set it at ,it will fly off the runwy by itself before rotation and yes i hace the load centr of gravity right. This guy named Paul Tally in the Avsim libray has a lot of fixes but they are for thr ADV -- will they work in this on cause i only have the basic package . I came across some tweaks on changing the parisite scolar setting and a few more but they are dated 2012 so i'm not too sure if they were maodified.  

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Mhhh Louis,

 

i have to check when i am at home. For sure i can say, that i don't use the trim suggestion of the v-gauge, only the speed callouts. I think, i have the trim somewhere between 4 and 4.5, somewhere at the beginning of the green bar for takeoff trim, depending on fuel and pax.

There have been a lot of problems with the first version, is was more a "rocket boeing". So there have been a lot of fixes and tweaks dealing with the overpowered plane, i think you found those at the library.

But as far as i remember, the latest version was very close to the real plane.

In the CS forum there are some discussions to that topic, did you sign in there and had a look?

 

Matthias

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Ok, did a quick check.

 

V-gauge suggested trim 4.5, i used 3.5. Easy takeoff with little pull, v speeds as calculated. Had to trim down after gear up, but I think that is ok.

So you are right, trim settings are not on the spot. But I am not aware of modified configs for the plane, but you really should check the CS forum, perhaps I have missed something.

 

Matthias

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Thanks Matt, for some crazy reason i can't post any thing at the site even though i'm logged in .I agree with some pull for take off and the troim settings .My frien flew these for about 6,000 hr.so i called him and asked for some info . Allthey had was the Sperry (CWS) auto  pilot and no fmc . With the graval kit they had to lower the gear at 180 knots.He said they never flew or hardly  at 30,000 ft. When he 1st started on these 200's they were using .78 but then in the 70's if you remember with the fuel crises ---then they cut it back to .74   now here's the kicker,  i also have the Milviz  and the formula is-- to fly ay M.74 let's say your at flight level 29,000 take 29 X2 you get 58 , now add20 gives you 78 so you would set you ERP at 1.78 to get M.74 , In the Milviz it's bang on  and in this one it's way off some thing like 1.50 ERP and i'm constantly fiddling with the throttles to to get it to stay   -try it and let me know . I read to start with the default Cessna shut every thing off save and go cold -dark is what  'i'm doing for now. 

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Hi Louis,

 

inside the CS Forum, you must have 10 posts before you are allowed to start a new topic. Did you try to add a post to an existing topic or did you start a new one? Perhaps that's the reason?!

 

Mh, to be honest, i know only pilots around my age, most of them are Airbus'sers :)

But as far as i know the story, 727 and 737 pilots of the early days did not calculate EPRs for cruise. They just set certain fuel flow. Same do i. I only check the EPR for takeoff, after that i just trim for an adequate speed and adjust the levers so that i "stay in the green" on the N1 gauge. You have to push the levers a little bit forward every 5000 ft or so. At cruise, i set fuel flow a little bit over 3000 pounds/hour at FL 300-FL 320, and a little bit less than 3000 when at FL 350. The 737 will maintain 0.76-0.78 depending on load and headwind. Sometimes you are a little bit faster, sometimes slower. But there is no need of touching the levers during the entire cruise. For the 727, there are other rules of thumb, but it works the same way. That's the reason i like the old beauties, no autothrust, no FMS, a lot of flying with fingertips and some kind of instinct.

 

Matthias

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What you have to bear in mind when trying to use EPR on the Captain Sim 737 to set the thrust, is that CS basically tweaked the simulation of the engine power settings on their flight model for FS, in order for them to be a 'reasonable average' which would work for all the 737 variants they made. This includes three (in real life) quite significantly different aeroplanes: the 100, 200 and the 200ADV, plus a freighter variant as well.

 

The (real) 100 and 200 versions essentially had little difference as far as systems go, so other than the 200 being a bit longer and heavier, it was basically the same as the 100 with a more usable payload, but the 200ADV had improved aerodynamics, more fuel capacity, an automated wheel brake system and more powerful engines. This means that all three (four if you include the freighters and combis, which all differ in weight too) versions would perform differently because of weight, aerodynamic efficiency and engine power output, notably the 200ADV. But of course in going for a bit of a 'shotgun' approach to engine modeling in order to have that suit all variants they simulate, it means that EPR settings will be off for all three of them in comparison to the real aeroplane, and this is compounded further by many FS aeroplanes having to have their engine power settings tweaked a bit so that they aren't either ridiculously under or overpowered when taxying because of the notorious dodgy ground friction modeling of FS. This is one of the reasons why PMDG, FSL and a few other developers have received praise for the way their recent efforts taxy, but they've tended to achieve that by using custom routines rather than tweaking default flight model and engine modeling parameters in the main sim.

 

Note that I go into a bit of detail into that and how to workaround it in my Avsim reviews of the CS 727 and the CS 707. Of course the 737 and the 727 use the same engines (Pratt and Whitney JT8Ds, so the simulation of them by CS is essentially the same for both aeroplanes, and to be honest, it's also quite similar on their 707 too, even though the 707 has Pratt and Whitney JT3s. Anyway, if you read the section of that 727 review titled 'Under Pressure', it has a bit more info about how to get EPR settings reasonably correct in CS airliners:

 

http://avsim.com/pages/0710/JFCS/727.htm

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Thanks a bunch Matt and Chock, yes my friend did tell me they used also  fuel pressure and the Epr's combined . My kid is an airline Captain here in Canada on the 737-700 and 800 for West Jet and he just shakes his head when he sees me in this ol' thing ha . How you  guys doing  with with the CWR ?, i find its pretty good .Anyway ,all things  aside i'm really sloppy flying this thing so far. I was gonna private messge you from the PMDG post i made on this Chock cause i was a little cranky when i posted it but i see your here so i won't bother. 

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On 2/10/2017 at 9:09 AM, Louis8 said:

If i set the trim to the V-one gauge in the green say 5.0 the plane lifts off by it self before V1. 

I haven't been on this forum in quite some time! Totally missed this post.

I wrote the V-One gauge for the 737-200 just about 5 years ago and the trim setting may have been correct for ver 1.0 release but certainly is not now!

The good news is there is a variable you can change that will effect the take-off trim value. The bad news is the trim wheel indicator is nowhere near the green band. Oh well.

To change:

Find the 'V-One.xml' file located in the '..\pane\V-One' folder and open in a text editor. 

Towards the end of the file, locate the entry on line 520, 3.0 (>L:CgOffset,number) and change the 3.0 to 15.0 to end up with 15.0 (>L:CgOffset,number) then save. My recent testing indicates this is a good starting point to achieve good rotation and hold approximately 15° climb out angle. This is with a payload of 27,000 lbs and 21,000 lbs of fuel, the take-off trim value will be 1.8 units. 

Hope this helps,

Paul

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2 hours ago, fsxpaul said:

I haven't been on this forum in quite some time! Totally missed this post.

I wrote the V-One gauge for the 737-200 just about 5 years ago and the trim setting may have been correct for ver 1.0 release but certainly is not now!

Paul

Paul- Just a quick thanks for your awesome gauges.   Just saw you posted a new 732 FMS ISG addon.  While i love the 732 without an FMS,  I will definitely be adding this since your addons are top notch and i have the ISG package. 

Probably a great tip of the cap when the developer adds your gauges to their updates for their aircraft. 

Thanks again! 

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21 hours ago, jason99vmi said:

Paul- Just a quick thanks for your awesome gauges.   Just saw you posted a new 732 FMS ISG addon.  While i love the 732 without an FMS,  I will definitely be adding this since your addons are top notch and i have the ISG package. 

Probably a great tip of the cap when the developer adds your gauges to their updates for their aircraft. 

Thanks again! 

Thank you for the praise!

I believe having another navigation option other than the standard GPS is useful, especially with having the ability to use current AIRAC cycles if one wants.

I was quite pleased my V-One gauge was added to one of their aircraft updates!

Paul

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On 3/15/2017 at 10:14 AM, fsxpaul said:

I believe having another navigation option other than the standard GPS is useful, especially with having the ability to use current AIRAC cycles if one wants.

Paul,

Thanks for the great job on the B732.  I was able to do a similar install on the B707, but it was not nearly as nice yours.  I also enjoy your V1 gauges. :smile:

blaustern

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