From a 6700K to 7700K and... Surprise !

[Gavenger 18]

30 minutes ago, TechguyMaxC said:

There's a misunderstanding here, so I'll straighten it out as quickly as possible.

The 7700k is undoubtedly faster than a 2700k, a chip that was released in late 2011 and based on a design first released in early 2011.  It's true that no individual chip released since Sandy Bridge has been significantly faster than the immediately previous generation, we are now 5 product generations on from Sandy Bridge so it's all added up to a noticeably faster chip.  

The problem is the OP thought a 7700k would be faster than a 6700k which is only a little over a year old.  That is an unrealistic expectation.

Bottom line: 7700k is a major upgrade for you, but not for joemiller.  

Also, going from a 2700K to a 7700K means going from DDR3 to DDR4 RAM, theres just so much more being changed during this upgrade that will make the overall system THAT much better than just a simple CPU upgrade.

[TechguyMaxC 516]

42 minutes ago, torque2 said:

I recently upgraded (after 5 years, I figured it was time) from an i7 2600K to the 6700K, along with a video card upgrade from a 560ti to a 1060.  At close to the same processor speeds (4400GHz) I have roughly a 20% improvement in performance.  Noticeable for sure but not earth-shattering.

 

Speeds are too low.  Probably not using fast RAM either.  

I get 25% faster average and a whopping 35% faster minimum going from 3770k @ 4.9GHz to 7700k @ 5.2GHz.   Yeah, the average isn't "earth shattering" but no one was making that claim to begin with.  Minimum FPS increase of 35% is the difference between a slow, stuttering mess in a worst case scenario to actually flyable.  Well worth it.  

[ahsmatt7 1,199]

1 hour ago, TechguyMaxC said:

There's a misunderstanding here, so I'll straighten it out as quickly as possible.

The 7700k is undoubtedly faster than a 2700k, a chip that was released in late 2011 and based on a design first released in early 2011.  It's true that no individual chip released since Sandy Bridge has been significantly faster than the immediately previous generation, we are now 5 product generations on from Sandy Bridge so it's all added up to a noticeably faster chip.  

The problem is the OP thought a 7700k would be faster than a 6700k which is only a little over a year old.  That is an unrealistic expectation.

Bottom line: 7700k is a major upgrade for you, but not for joemiller.  

Awesome!!! now I'm excited again! Thanks for clarifying that for me!

[joemiller 269]

14 hours ago, TechguyMaxC said:

Joe, I'm sorry to say that your expectations going into this endeavor were unrealistic.  You had a fast chip before, you upgraded to one that is only slightly faster.  I'm not sure who gave you the impression that a 7700k is light years beyond a 6700k, it's rather silly considering they're the same micro-architecture.  Kaby Lake is Skylake that's been optimized for clockspeeds and that is the *only* difference between them.  Going from 4.5GHz to 5.1GHz should've netted you some frame rate gain, although nothing miraculous as let's be honest it's only a 13% difference so you really only could've seen at most a 13% gain in performance.  

I notice you're only running 2800MHz RAM though, you're definitely leaving some performance on the table by doing that but just like the CPU upgrade you've just done, don't expect miracles.  Another 10% perhaps.  It's possible that you haven't noticed any gains because the CPU is already memory-starved by using slower memory than it really wants.  I run 3600MHz RAM on my 5.2GHz 7700k and it definitely is faster than any chip I've owned previously when it comes to flight sim.  

You have provided a great idea.. I will be getting a 3600MHz RAM next week. Thank you for your advice. 

[joemiller 269]

14 hours ago, martin-w said:

 

Who on Earth told you that. Max is absolutely right. No one in their right mind would claim that an upgrade from a 6700K to a 7700K would result in miraculous improvements. The only reason I can think of to upgrade from a 6700K to a 7700K is if you happen to be desperate to obtain all the other features that came with the new platform, for example Optane. Or perhaps you have tons of money and like testing new kit.

To be honest, if you had scanned this forum after Kaby Lake was released, you would have found a plethora of posts with all the information you needed to determine that.

In fact, I don't recall any new platform that has been so incredible as to justify and upgrade from the previous platform. Don't know if Max does.

Thanks, I found out 3 days ago.  

[joemiller 269]

12 hours ago, ahsmatt7 said:

Now im worried because I planned on upgrading from my current i7 2700k to the 7700k. Am I correct in thinking that I won't get any performance boosts at all?

 

Proceed in peace. Going from 2700K  to 7000K  will (yes) see a nice and significant improvement. You are fine. Just make sure you get a good motherboard, and a good water-cooler to OC. A large well ventilated case is important as well. And as TechguyMaxc mentioned, a fast RAM will make a nice difference. 

[joemiller 269]

12 hours ago, TechguyMaxC said:

There's a misunderstanding here, so I'll straighten it out as quickly as possible.

The 7700k is undoubtedly faster than a 2700k, a chip that was released in late 2011 and based on a design first released in early 2011.  It's true that no individual chip released since Sandy Bridge has been significantly faster than the immediately previous generation, we are now 5 product generations on from Sandy Bridge so it's all added up to a noticeably faster chip.  

The problem is the OP thought a 7700k would be faster than a 6700k which is only a little over a year old.  That is an unrealistic expectation.

Bottom line: 7700k is a major upgrade for you, but not for joemiller.  

I couldn't have said it better. Sweet and simple! 

[westman 257]

Here a old tread worth to read for you, today the 2x16gb is sligtly faster.

I run 3600mhz c15 g-skill 2x8 or 4x8gb if a want go ready fast , the Maximus IX Apex with a set of galax limited edition 4266mhz c18.

[188AHC 2,138]

I'm considering a new build in the near future. Currently running I7-3770K, 8GB 2133 DDR3 ram on an MSI MB. Not sure what to do at this point

I get fairly good performance generally in FSX and am now trying X-Plane 11 (if I can ever get it to cooperate). I plan to watch this thread.

 

[martin-w 3,234]

8 hours ago, joemiller said:

Proceed in peace. Going from 2700K  to 7000K  will (yes) see a nice and significant improvement. You are fine. Just make sure you get a good motherboard, and a good water-cooler to OC. A large well ventilated case is important as well. And as TechguyMaxc mentioned, a fast RAM will make a nice difference. 

 

Just to mention, not necessarily a "good water cooler". The NH-D15/S cools the 7700K very nicely. The choice of quite a few now on this forum and very happy.

[joemiller 269]

14 hours ago, martin-w said:

 

Just to mention, not necessarily a "good water cooler". The NH-D15/S cools the 7700K very nicely. The choice of quite a few now on this forum and very happy.

Oh, ok.. I haven't used air-cooling since the early days of FS9. I guess they are better now. What I like about my Corsair H110i is that it also suck (pushes) out hot air from my Case while using two large fans to cool the radiator on top of my case.   

 

[martin-w 3,234]

10 hours ago, joemiller said:

Oh, ok.. I haven't used air-cooling since the early days of FS9. I guess they are better now.

 

 

The Noctua coolers  has been pretty much the best air coolers for years, since I think it was something like 2012. That was when the NH-D14 was released I recall. My D14 was in no less than three overclocked builds and now cools the overclocked PC I gave to my son. The latest, NH-D15S cools my overclocked 6700K at 4.6 GHz with ease, ultra quiet and very cool. Handles 4.7 without issue. Those with the 7700K have it running at 5 GHz with the D15 without issue and if delidded even higher. And obviously zero chance of leaks and apart from the fan, no moving parts to fail. There are one or two other offerings from other manufacturers that also come close.

 

Quote

What I like about my Corsair H110i is that it also suck (pushes) out hot air from my Case while using two large fans to cool the radiator on top of my case.   

 

If you have it configured so that it's exhausting out of the case, then you are cooling the rad with warm case air and thus, CPU temp is somewhat higher. The alternative is to have it ingesting cool air from outside through the rad, which then results in lowest CPU temp but all the hot air from the rad been dumped in the case. That's the dilemma of radiators.

My D15S is pretty much three fans in a row. Front case fan to 150 mm fan on the cooler, to rear case fan. All fairly close together, so yes, some heat is exhausted into the case, but most of it is exhausted by the rear case fan.

Some hate the aesthetics of big tower coolers of course and prefer the look of an AIO. And if your case isn't big enough for the cooler it's no deal. I'll be building Min-ITX system for my daughter some time, in which case I may well opt for an AIO, due to the limited space and restricted airflow. 

 

[joemiller 269]

On 4/2/2017 at 7:48 AM, martin-w said:

If you have it configured so that it's exhausting out of the case, then you are cooling the rad with warm case air and thus, CPU temp is somewhat higher. The alternative is to have it ingesting cool air from outside through the rad, which then results in lowest CPU temp but all the hot air from the rad been dumped in the case. That's the dilemma of radiators.

 

Interesting, haven't tried this in reverse. Always done the  push-pull pattern. 

[martin-w 3,234]

5 hours ago, joemiller said:

Interesting, haven't tried this in reverse. Always done the  push-pull pattern. 

 

If you check out Corsair's advice, they will always recommend ingesting cooler outside air through the rad, but then they're bound to, as it generates the lowest CPU temp. And of course, that makes their AIO cooler look better. 

Choice really, whichever you prefer. Although you may find the following video interesting. I posted it recently. Suggests that radiators at the front of the case with fans blowing in are optimal.

 

 

 

[martin-w 3,234]

Here's another video regarding this you might find of interest.