Q400 startup problems

[kevinfirth 1,392]

1. This is what I'm greeted by when I load the Majestic Q400

Anyone know why my displays are all whacked out?  Oil indicators flicker and show multiple values, the hydraulic pressure indicators are jumping around like nobodys business :S

Short video below showing how it looks....  Tried making the a/c cold and dark, starts up just the same, reinstalled the 1.018e patch...no joy :(

PRO edition, updated to the 1.018e patch...

SOLVED: Damned Windows 10 Creators edition GRRR!  Reinstalled and all OK

[Amir Khouzam 5]

LOL  I drove myself crazy for the last 2 hours trying to figure out what the issue was, until I figured out the same, then stumbled across your post.  I hadn't flown the Q400 since Creator's Update as I was busy at work, gardening, taxes, etc.  Downloading now and hopefully a reinstall will work. :)

[Agent X20 1]

I couldn't get any clicks to register, and there were no sounds, combined with the plane being in a half started state. A quick search on the Majestic forum and a reinstall was the answer here as well. Note this is also Win 10 Creator's edition.

[Guest]

Winblows 10 ... you folks are lucky, the Win 10 1703 (aka Creators) for Enterprise edition just gets stuck in a perpetual Windows Check for updates loop ... reported issue (even with video) to Microslop and the response was ... drum roll (I think everyone knows already) ... wipe my PC and install Winblows 10 1703 Enterprise from scratch.  Where have I heard that before ... oh wait, I know ... anytime I show Microslop engineers a bug.

Sorry, I've lost all respect for Microsoft and Winblows 10 flavors ... Microsoft stopped caring about their "desktop" OS a long long long time ago.  I use Winblows 10 simply because I have to for testing and work and it has DX12 ... beyond that it's the most bug filled OS I've ever seen and I'm pretty sure Microsoft are never going to making it right.

But just curious, are you suggesting the Q400 issue is a result of Win 10 creators edition?  If so, was this an "upgrade" or a clean install of Creator's edition (Build 1703).  Also, was the Q400 installed prior to the upgrade to 1703?

Cheers, Rob.

[Bobsk8 12,489]

43 minutes ago, Rob Ainscough said:

Winblows 10 ... you folks are lucky, the Win 10 1703 (aka Creators) for Enterprise edition just gets stuck in a perpetual Windows Check for updates loop ... reported issue (even with video) to Microslop and the response was ... drum roll (I think everyone knows already) ... wipe my PC and install Winblows 10 1703 Enterprise from scratch.  Where have I heard that before ... oh wait, I know ... anytime I show Microslop engineers a bug.

Sorry, I've lost all respect for Microsoft and Winblows 10 flavors ... Microsoft stopped caring about their "desktop" OS a long long long time ago.  I use Winblows 10 simply because I have to for testing and work and it has DX12 ... beyond that it's the most bug filled OS I've ever seen and I'm pretty sure Microsoft are never going to making it right.

But just curious, are you suggesting the Q400 issue is a result of Win 10 creators edition?  If so, was this an "upgrade" or a clean install of Creator's edition (Build 1703).  Also, was the Q400 installed prior to the upgrade to 1703?

Cheers, Rob.

When windows 10 was offered for free, and I read about MSs new protocol of updates whether you wanted them or not, I figured that for simming, this would be a recipe for disaster sooner or later. I took a great deal of flack for my opinion, and was called old fashioned, stuck in the  past, yada yada..... I stuck with my perfectly working, bug free, Windows 7, and guess what, the issues that I had predicted back then are starting to surface. You get up in the morning, start your Flight sim, and it is broken, and you find that Microsoft decided to break something in your OS, and their attitude is , If they blow up your PC, you get to keep all the pieces you can find....  This is what happens when you take an OS that was basically designed for a Tablet and a phone and try to run a desktop with it. 

[jimcarrel 688]

I run win 10 and surely you know it's main purpose now? I think its mostly for tracking your browsing data and delving out the info for sales ads. They just throw in "great for gamers" for more attention. Oh there are some enhancements you can list on part of one hand, but you got to take off shoes and socks to finish counting out the new "bad stuff". Will it get better? No idea.

[kevinfirth 1,392]

5 hours ago, Rob Ainscough said:

But just curious, are you suggesting the Q400 issue is a result of Win 10 creators edition?  If so, was this an "upgrade" or a clean install of Creator's edition (Build 1703).  Also, was the Q400 installed prior to the upgrade to 1703?

Cheers, Rob.

My problem only appeared after the update.  A reinstall of the Q440 solved the issue so no biggie.

A reinstall into both an updated win10 and a clean 1703 install both rendered the Q400 flyable no problems, the only problem encountered was a Q400 install followed by the win10 update.

[johnnycrockett 43]

Kevin,

Funnily enough, I too had this problem with the Q400, however it was using FSX. It only started happening after the update but not sure if that was the cause. A reinstall of the Q400 fixed it for me but never actually found out what caused it.

[ZKOKQ 984]

I always thought it was not possible to revert to W7 after the 30 days try. But you can if you have the Retail Disks. Very tempted.

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/613682/returning-to-w7-outside-30-day-limit/

[Cruachan 705]

9 hours ago, Rob Ainscough said:

Sorry, I've lost all respect for Microsoft and Winblows 10 flavors ... Microsoft stopped caring about their "desktop" OS a long long long time ago.  I use Winblows 10 simply because I have to for testing and work and it has DX12 ... beyond that it's the most bug filled OS I've ever seen and I'm pretty sure Microsoft are never going to making it right.

I feel for you, Rob, I really do! Windows 7 is still proving to be MS's high point, of that I am now convinced. I've lost count of the number of folk bemoaning the abomination they call Windows 10, but few listen when I encourage them to return to Windows 7. There never has been a pressing need for the vast majority of users to make the switch to Windows 10. Windows 7 is still good for another few years. Perhaps by then they will have sorted out 10...or are we kidding ourselves? Perhaps they have bitten off more than they can chew this time around or maybe it's just a case of too many cooks involved in the development of an O/S (development by committee..lol). These fiascos must surely be very embarrassing. Thank God I don't have to be part of it!

Regards,

Mike

[ZKOKQ 984]

8 minutes ago, Cruachan said:

I feel for you, Rob, I really do! Windows 7 is still proving to be MS's high point, of that I am now convinced. I've lost count of the number of folk bemoaning the abomination they call Windows 10, but few listen when I encourage them to return to Windows 7. There never has been a pressing need for the vast majority of users to make the switch to Windows 10. Windows 7 is still good for another few years. Perhaps by then they will have sorted out 10...or are we kidding ourselves? Perhaps they have bitten off more than they can chew or maybe it's just a case of too many cooks involved in the development of this o/s (development by committee..lol) These fiascos must surely be very embarrassing. Thank God I don't have to be part of it!

Regards,

Mike

+1 I find myself sorting W10 gremlins than actually flying. I still have my W7 DVD, so I shall be rolling back.

[kevinfirth 1,392]

ive had a few minor issues with win10 but all have been outweighed by its better performance in sim. 

with a new 7700k at 4.9ghz under win 10 im screaming along with 60fps in the ngx vc and upwards of 100fps in other a/c.  set against reinstalling my q400 once which took a few minutes whats not to like? 

[Bobsk8 12,489]

18 minutes ago, kevinfirth said:

ive had a few minor issues with win10 but all have been outweighed by its better performance in sim. 

with a new 7700k at 4.9ghz under win 10 im screaming along with 60fps in the ngx vc and upwards of 100fps in other a/c.  set against reinstalling my q400 once which took a few minutes whats not to like? 

Switch to W 10 and get fantastic FPS.   LOL.... now that's funny. 

[Cruachan 705]

7 hours ago, kevinfirth said:with a new 7700k at 4.9ghz under win 10 im screaming along with 60fps in the ngx vc and upwards of 100fps in other a/c.  set against reinstalling my q400 once which took a few minutes whats not to like? 

Hi Kevin,

With all due respect, I'm quite sure you've been in this game long enough to appreciate that such statements mean very little without appropriate qualification. I upgraded my GPU a few days ago and, as part of that upgrade, P3D was returned to default conditions by allowing a rebuild of Prepar3D.cfg and the Shaders cache. Initially I too witnessed frame rates >100 and that was before returning the overclock of my 5960X to 4.4GHz (I returned it to stock speeds before performing a clean graphic driver update - probably completely unnecessary, but I regard it as being safer). 

However, I was under no illusions as I knew this would change once I started piling on the settings, including SGSSAA 4x along with MSAA x4 Samples. I was hoping that the GTX 1080Ti would allow this without the same degree of performance penalty as witnessed under my 2 GTX 980Ti in SLI. This has proven to be the case. Now, I can achieve much higher frame rates than before in very demanding situations, including a 5 cloud layer configuration in AS 2016/ASCA. Furthermore, and of far more importance, this improves the overhead while restricting GPU workload by pegging in-sim rates at 31fps (VSync and Triple Buffering OFF) without any significant dipping into the low - mid 20s as seen on occasions with my previous setup.

To give you some idea,  I was seeing >100fps at KVPS with everything at default whereas now frame rates have dropped to 60-70fps (fair weather with light cloud) which, all things considered, is not too shabby and now the sim seems butter smooth all of the time. Whether or not this will continue to apply in every situation and with increasing a/c complexity remains to be seen, but I am optimistic.

i very much doubt that the choice of O/S has much bearing on achievable frame rates. More likely a fresh install has tidied things up and unleashed the true potential of the sim.

Regards,

Mike

 

[kevinfirth 1,392]

1 hour ago, Cruachan said:

Hi Kevin,

With all due respect, I'm quite sure you've been in this game long enough to appreciate that such statements mean very little without appropriate qualification. I upgraded my GPU a few days ago and, as part of that upgrade, P3D was returned to default conditions by allowing a rebuild of Prepar3D.cfg and the Shaders cache. Initially I too witnessed frame rates >100 and that was before returning the overclock of my 5960X to 4.4GHz (I returned it to stock speeds before performing a clean graphic driver update - probably completely unnecessary, but I regard it as being safer). 

However, I was under no illusions as I knew this would change once I started piling on the settings, including SGSSAA 4x along with MSAA x4 Samples. I was hoping that the GTX 1080Ti would allow this without the same degree of performance penalty as witnessed under my 2 GTX 980Ti in SLI. This has proven to be the case. Now, I can achieve much higher frame rates than before in very demanding situations, including a 5 cloud layer configuration in AS 2016/ASCA. Furthermore, and of far more importance, this improves the overhead while restricting GPU workload by pegging in-sim rates at 31fps (VSync and Triple Buffering OFF) without any significant dipping into the low - mid 20s as seen on occasions with my previous setup.

To give you some idea,  I was seeing >100fps at KVPS with everything at default whereas now frame rates have dropped to 60-70fps (fair weather with light cloud) which, all things considered, is not too shabby and now the sim seems butter smooth all of the time. Whether or not this will continue to apply in every situation and with increasing a/c complexity remains to be seen, but I am optimistic.

i very much doubt that the choice of O/S has much bearing on achievable frame rates. More likely a fresh install has tidied things up and unleashed the true potential of the sim.

Regards,

Mike

 

Mike I agree I am cautious too.  The fact remains I am getting obscene frame rates all settings maxed with heavy addons. 

Is that due to Win10? I don't know.

Is that due to a medium overclocked 7700K? I don't know.

I am not attributing the cause of my comfort to anything in any particular measure, just telling it how it is.

To be honest, I don't have the time to exhaustively test to find out, renovating a house and working full time with 2 children under 3 does not lend itself to technological experimentation ;)

All I can say is that when I upgraded to Win10 on my old 2500K rig, I saw a noticeable performance increase.  I subsequently had to reinstall Win10 clean in January this year when my SSD died (moments silence!), and after a complete reinstall performance was pretty much the same as under the upgraded OS.  I saw an order of magnitude increase again when I moved to the 7700K.  Similarly, a long story but MS messed me around and I have run P3D under both a pre-existing OS install with the new hardware, and with a fresh Win10 installation, and the performance in both condition was near indistinguishable.

Without empirical evidence that I don't have the time to collect, I think its not unreasonable to draw a preliminary conclusion that both OS and hardware are a factor, much more so than a fresh OS install, but I'd suspect that the biggest influence is the new CPU and RAM.

Cheers K