Panel State Load: Engines don't advance

[Doug Pelton 1]

38 minutes ago, Mike777 said:

Are you still getting the delayed engine response to the throttles?  A delayed shutdown of the APU I think you can live with, but the delayed throttle response not so much.

I'm not familiar with SimpleCam, but there other ways to navigate around the VC.  For example holding down the space bar and using the mouse. 

I would urge you to just go back to making a flight at an unmodified airport with the Trike or a Microsoft-supplied Cessna your default startup flight.  Set up that flight situation, save it, and then make that your default flight by choosing Load Flight, highlighting the flight you just saved, and clicking on the box at the bottom of the screen "Make this the Default Flight." The default 747 at startup may work OK, but the Trike and Cessna are known to set up FSX correctly for PMDG aircraft.  As Dan said, you don't want to actually load the default startup flight; you just want to see the Trike or Cessna spinning in the opening window.  With this setup you won't have to select a default FSX aircraft at startup.

Mike

 

Thanks for clarifying. Need to set up the FSX default/non-PMDG flite on startup.

VC navigation via keyboard. Simplecam lets you set up 10 views 'outside' of the FSX keyboard assignments (no conflicts). They're accessed via the numeric keypad.  Doug

[Doug Pelton 1]

57 minutes ago, Mike777 said:

Are you still getting the delayed engine response to the throttles?  A delayed shutdown of the APU I think you can live with, but the delayed throttle response not so much.

I'm not familiar with SimpleCam, but there other ways to navigate around the VC.  For example holding down the space bar and using the mouse. 

I would urge you to just go back to making a flight at an unmodified airport with the Trike or a Microsoft-supplied Cessna your default startup flight.  Set up that flight situation, save it, and then make that your default flight by choosing Load Flight, highlighting the flight you just saved, and clicking on the box at the bottom of the screen "Make this the Default Flight." The default 747 at startup may work OK, but the Trike and Cessna are known to set up FSX correctly for PMDG aircraft.  As Dan said, you don't want to actually load the default startup flight; you just want to see the Trike or Cessna spinning in the opening window.  With this setup you won't have to select a default FSX aircraft at startup.

Mike

 

...forgot to answer:  Yes, the Thrustmaster moves the VC throttles without advancing N1....until the APU shuts down. Weird. Unless I'm entirely missing something else.  Doug

[Mike777 163]

19 minutes ago, Doug Pelton said:

Yes, the Thrustmaster moves the VC throttles without advancing N1....until the APU shuts down. Weird

I never asked, but have you checked to see that you have the latest version?  Open the Operations Center and check that the version of the NGX is 1.10.6461.

Just try to eliminate any variables that could be causing the problem.  Make sure your startup is a default Trike or Cessna (not switching to one of these after FSX starts -- that can have unknown consequences).  Disable SimpleCam.  Make sure the NGX is set to start up with a default, PMDG-supplied panel state, "NGX Short" for example.   If one PMDG-supplied panel state does not work, try another, "NGX CLDDRK" for example.  It would also be useful to see if the problem goes away by setting "NGX Default" as startup panel state, as this should make the NGX start with engines on and APU off.  Don't use a saved flight - set up a new situation each time.  Also, use the same aircraft each time -- I recommend one of the PMDG house livery NGXs.

Mike

Edited May 3, 2017 by Mike777
Added two lines at the end.

[Doug Pelton 1]

1 hour ago, Mike777 said:

I never asked, but have you checked to see that you have the latest version?  Open the Operations Center and check that the version of the NGX is 1.10.6461.

Just try to eliminate any variables that could be causing the problem.  Make sure your startup is a default Trike or Cessna (not switching to one of these after FSX starts -- that can have unknown consequences).  Disable SimpleCam.  Make sure the NGX is set to start up with a default, PMDG-supplied panel state, "NGX Short" for example.   If one PMDG-supplied panel state does not work, try another, "NGX CLDDRK" for example.  It would also be useful to see if the problem goes away by setting "NGX Default" as startup panel state, as this should make the NGX start with engines on and APU off.  Don't use a saved flight - set up a new situation each time.  Also, use the same aircraft each time -- I recommend one of the PMDG house livery NGXs.

Mike

 

Mike, I've not always used a PMDG panel state when loading up the sim. I think I've gone to it more in trying to resolve this problem. I take it that one MUST always load a panel vs starting from a saved flight.

Yes, I just did update during this scenario.

I'll let you know what happens. Away from sim until latter part of May,.

Thanks much.

Doug

[downscc 1,327]

16 hours ago, Doug Pelton said:

I take it that one MUST always load a panel vs starting from a saved flight.

Not true, you can ignore a panel state unless you have problems with it.  Anytime you load the aircraft from free flight it will automatically load with engines running configured as the "PMDG Default" unless you change it in the PMDG Options menu.  Anytime you load from a saved flight it will automatically load with what ever configuration you saved it, each saved flight is associated automatically with a saved panel file.

It makes no sense that you see the VC throttles moving but N1 doesn't increase unless your display is frozen.

[Doug Pelton 1]

32 minutes ago, downscc said:

Not true, you can ignore a panel state unless you have problems with it.  Anytime you load the aircraft from free flight it will automatically load with engines running configured as the "PMDG Default" unless you change it in the PMDG Options menu.  Anytime you load from a saved flight it will automatically load with what ever configuration you saved it, each saved flight is associated automatically with a saved panel file.

It makes no sense that you see the VC throttles moving but N1 doesn't increase unless your display is frozen.

Not at my sim, but after the engines both reach 56 I was advancing  the Thrustmaster throttle.....but nothing was happening with the engines. Even with F3 the VC view showed throttles move but engine N1 not advancing----none of the engine gauges were advacing. (Screen not frozen though.)  

Thanks for clarifying loading a Pmdg flite!

Doug

 

 

[Doug Pelton 1]

On 5/3/2017 at 3:48 PM, Mike777 said:

I never asked, but have you checked to see that you have the latest version?  Open the Operations Center and check that the version of the NGX is 1.10.6461.

Just try to eliminate any variables that could be causing the problem.  Make sure your startup is a default Trike or Cessna (not switching to one of these after FSX starts -- that can have unknown consequences).  Disable SimpleCam.  Make sure the NGX is set to start up with a default, PMDG-supplied panel state, "NGX Short" for example.   If one PMDG-supplied panel state does not work, try another, "NGX CLDDRK" for example.  It would also be useful to see if the problem goes away by setting "NGX Default" as startup panel state, as this should make the NGX start with engines on and APU off.  Don't use a saved flight - set up a new situation each time.  Also, use the same aircraft each time -- I recommend one of the PMDG house livery NGXs.

Mike

 

Mike, re-reading Tutorial #1: It says loading  a non-PMDG plane is not necessary; on page 6:

Start FSX and click “Free Flight” There is no need to first load the Cessna 172, or use any sort of custom saved flight when loading the PMDG 737NGX. Our programming sets up the sim environment properly as the aircraft is loading. You can safely load the airplane straight from Free Flight and it will load up with the engines running and ready to fly after a brief self-configuration

Doug Pelton

[Mike777 163]

46 minutes ago, Doug Pelton said:

Mike, re-reading Tutorial #1: It says loading  a non-PMDG plane is not necessary; on page 6:

Start FSX and click “Free Flight” There is no need to first load the Cessna 172, or use any sort of custom saved flight when loading the PMDG 737NGX. Our programming sets up the sim environment properly as the aircraft is loading. You can safely load the airplane straight from Free Flight and it will load up with the engines running and ready to fly after a brief self-configuration

However on p. 36 of the Introduction manual, which covers installation and operation of FSX in much more detail, it says,

"There is a common misconception that when loading a complex simulation like the PMDG 737NGX that you should first load the default Cessna into the simulator, then load the PMDG 737NGX on top of it. This is not a factual conception and in fact we do not recommend the practice at all. What is required however is for a default Microsoft aircraft to be your default startup flight in FSX. The reason for this is that this flight actually loads in the background invisible to the user – if it’s set to a complex addon it can result in the inability to set certain internal variables that the 737 relies on until the simulator is restarted. [my emphasis]"

There is similar language in the manuals for the PMDG 747 and 777, and probably all other PMDG aircraft.  Everything Dan and I said is consistent with that -- don't actually load the Trike or Cessna, but have a flight with it as the startup flight -- you will see the Trike or Cessna spinning in the opening Free Flight screen.

You really need to read  the Introduction manual carefully -- it has a lot of information on proper installation and operation.

On 5/4/2017 at 11:49 AM, downscc said:

Not true, you can ignore a panel state unless you have problems with it.  Anytime you load the aircraft from free flight it will automatically load with engines running configured as the "PMDG Default" unless you change it in the PMDG Options menu.  Anytime you load from a saved flight it will automatically load with what ever configuration you saved it, each saved flight is associated automatically with a saved panel file.

To address Dan's point:  He is certainly correct, and I load saved flights -- which include saved panel states particular to each flight -- all the time. Usually they are in-flight situations -- I have a couple of NGX LDA approaches to KDCA runway 19, a couple of saved 777 approaches to KJFK's Canarsie VOR approach to 13L, a 777 saved approach or two to Hong Kong Kai Tak Runway 13, etc.  However with these, I am not continually re-saving a loaded panel state -- lots of reloads but no re-saves.   

What I am saying is that sometimes saving, reloading, saving, reloading... means that you are constantly saving, and modifying the same panel state over and over.  That is known to occasionally cause corruption of the panel state.  Doug, when you have a weird situation like the one you are describing, you need to go back to square one and see if the saved panel state is causing the problem.  Dan described a practice of saving the last situation for several different liveries, and then choosing one to start with.  That entails, as I understand him, fewer saves-reloads-saves.  Personally I prefer to just start fresh when on the ground. 

Mike

 

[Doug Pelton 1]

16 hours ago, Mike777 said:

However on p. 36 of the Introduction manual, which covers installation and operation of FSX in much more detail, it says,

"There is a common misconception that when loading a complex simulation like the PMDG 737NGX that you should first load the default Cessna into the simulator, then load the PMDG 737NGX on top of it. This is not a factual conception and in fact we do not recommend the practice at all. What is required however is for a default Microsoft aircraft to be your default startup flight in FSX. The reason for this is that this flight actually loads in the background invisible to the user – if it’s set to a complex addon it can result in the inability to set certain internal variables that the 737 relies on until the simulator is restarted. [my emphasis]"

There is similar language in the manuals for the PMDG 747 and 777, and probably all other PMDG aircraft.  Everything Dan and I said is consistent with that -- don't actually load the Trike or Cessna, but have a flight with it as the startup flight -- you will see the Trike or Cessna spinning in the opening Free Flight screen.

You really need to read  the Introduction manual carefully -- it has a lot of information on proper installation and operation.

To address Dan's point:  He is certainly correct, and I load saved flights -- which include saved panel states particular to each flight -- all the time. Usually they are in-flight situations -- I have a couple of NGX LDA approaches to KDCA runway 19, a couple of saved 777 approaches to KJFK's Canarsie VOR approach to 13L, a 777 saved approach or two to Hong Kong Kai Tak Runway 13, etc.  However with these, I am not continually re-saving a loaded panel state -- lots of reloads but no re-saves.   

What I am saying is that sometimes saving, reloading, saving, reloading... means that you are constantly saving, and modifying the same panel state over and over.  That is known to occasionally cause corruption of the panel state.  Doug, when you have a weird situation like the one you are describing, you need to go back to square one and see if the saved panel state is causing the problem.  Dan described a practice of saving the last situation for several different liveries, and then choosing one to start with.  That entails, as I understand him, fewer saves-reloads-saves.  Personally I prefer to just start fresh when on the ground. 

Mike

 

 

perfect!

[Doug Pelton 1]

Dan and Mike: back at the sim. Will post results!!!

Doug Pelton

Edited May 25, 2017 by Doug Pelton

[Doug Pelton 1]

Working:

Load FSX....Tryke circling in window...select PMDG 737....Location/etc...Fly now

THEN..

Load NGX Short panel...Start Engines...

BUT...

Pushing F3 starts increases N1.u..then I use the Thrustmaster.

SO...

I will disable F3 

Again, thanks .

Doug Pelton

 

[Doug Pelton 1]

On 5/5/2017 at 5:04 PM, Mike777 said:

However on p. 36 of the Introduction manual, which covers installation and operation of FSX in much more detail, it says,

"There is a common misconception that when loading a complex simulation like the PMDG 737NGX that you should first load the default Cessna into the simulator, then load the PMDG 737NGX on top of it. This is not a factual conception and in fact we do not recommend the practice at all. What is required however is for a default Microsoft aircraft to be your default startup flight in FSX. The reason for this is that this flight actually loads in the background invisible to the user – if it’s set to a complex addon it can result in the inability to set certain internal variables that the 737 relies on until the simulator is restarted. [my emphasis]"

There is similar language in the manuals for the PMDG 747 and 777, and probably all other PMDG aircraft.  Everything Dan and I said is consistent with that -- don't actually load the Trike or Cessna, but have a flight with it as the startup flight -- you will see the Trike or Cessna spinning in the opening Free Flight screen.

You really need to read  the Introduction manual carefully -- it has a lot of information on proper installation and operation.

To address Dan's point:  He is certainly correct, and I load saved flights -- which include saved panel states particular to each flight -- all the time. Usually they are in-flight situations -- I have a couple of NGX LDA approaches to KDCA runway 19, a couple of saved 777 approaches to KJFK's Canarsie VOR approach to 13L, a 777 saved approach or two to Hong Kong Kai Tak Runway 13, etc.  However with these, I am not continually re-saving a loaded panel state -- lots of reloads but no re-saves.   

What I am saying is that sometimes saving, reloading, saving, reloading... means that you are constantly saving, and modifying the same panel state over and over.  That is known to occasionally cause corruption of the panel state.  Doug, when you have a weird situation like the one you are describing, you need to go back to square one and see if the saved panel state is causing the problem.  Dan described a practice of saving the last situation for several different liveries, and then choosing one to start with.  That entails, as I understand him, fewer saves-reloads-saves.  Personally I prefer to just start fresh when on the ground. 

Mike

 

Mike, I've 'solved' my problem. After, many many failed startup attempts as per my posts in this thread...I read that it is best to:

*Load Tryke default flite

* Shut down Tryke engine & radio

*Then, load PMDG .

Working every time. I guess FSX must be running a simple FSX (Tryke) in background---I had been starting PMDG from Tryke with the latter's engines running,; I believe that was causing my very inconsistent engine startup.

Doug