StefanA

Lights Penalty with FSPassengers, B737NGX/B747

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Hello together,

it was discussed several times, but I couldn't find an appropriate solution and a deep analysis I didn't find as well. Disabling the penalty isn't really what I want. That's because I'm using FSPassengers, it's to be forced to proceed with the realistic procedures.

For investigation I logged all events with FSUIPC and found following:

B737:
Beacon -> TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS event appears, which is absolutely right. Basically it works with PMDG addon aircraft.
NAV (Steady) - Off - NAV + Strobe (Strobe & Steady) -> in every case there's a TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS. What is missing is STROBES_TOGGLE. Best solution to have correct state in every case would be sending following events:
Steady: TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS + STROBES_OFF
OFF: TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS + STROBES_OFF
Strobe & Steady: TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS + STROBES_ON

B747 V2:
Beacon every change (OFF, Lower, Both) -> TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS -> correct
NAV -> TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS -> correct
Strobes -> STROBE_TOGGLE not appearing -> reason for problems with 3rd party like FSPassengers detecting this state.

B747 V1:
Beacon every change (OFF, Both) -> TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS -> correct
NAV -> TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS -> correct
Strobes -> STROBES_SET -> that's correct too because it's similar to STROBES_TOGGLE

It's really only a couple of additional code lines to be added. Would appreciate if there will be a PATCH for the B747-V2 and the B737NGX to correct this small issue causing problems with 3rd party addons detecting these variables.

Regards,
Stefan

 

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Hi,

As your request is made towards PMDG staff I would advise you submit a ticket directly to the support. The forum is merely a user-to-user support.

However it is nice of you also to post it here as it may help some other users of FSPassengers to understand the reasons for some penalties if they need.
Support here:

http://support.precisionmanuals.com/Main/

Be aware that you need a different account that the one used for purchasing.

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17 minutes ago, Budbud said:

Hi,

As your request is made towards PMDG staff I would advise you submit a ticket directly to the support. The forum is merely a user-to-user support.

However it is nice of you also to post it here as it may help some other users of FSPassengers to understand the reasons for some penalties if they need.
Support here:

http://support.precisionmanuals.com/Main/

Be aware that you need a different account that the one used for purchasing.

Thank's for the hint. I was at this site, but I didn't see the register button at once. So I followed from the support to the forum instead. Now I found it. You are right, I'll open a ticket there and I agree that the description should help others to understand why they get the penalties.

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4 hours ago, StefanA said:

Disabling the penalty isn't really what I want. That's because I'm using FSPassengers, it's to be forced to proceed with the realistic procedures.

I know this isn't the answer you're looking for, but that isn't what FSPassengers is for. FSPassengers is for randomly subscribing to a non-pilot developer's understanding of airline flying is, which is largely incorrect. Penalties for not turning lights on at specific times? The only time you're required to use any light is the nav lights from dusk to dawn, basically. The rest have generic rules of thumb, but those vary by airline SOP. Landing lights may come on at any time, prescribed by the SOP of that airline. 10,000 is a common one, but it's neither a hard rule, nor is it something that you would be penalized for. FSP also yells at you for breaking the 250 knots "rule," without understanding all parts of the rule (specifically the exceptions to it). Another random one it will yell at you for is climbing/descending too quickly (high v/s) on the assumption that it scares the passengers. The problem, rooted here in physics, is that humans don't feel speed - they feel rate (the pitch over into or pull out of the descent, etc.).

Basically, it's a way to add a little 'fun' or 'gaminess' into the sim, but apart from that, you're not doing yourself any realistic favors. It isn't based in reality. It's based in the point system of a game, and those points aren't assigned by reality, either.

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On ‎5‎/‎26‎/‎2017 at 3:21 PM, StefanA said:

Hello together,

it was discussed several times, but I couldn't find an appropriate solution and a deep analysis I didn't find as well. Disabling the penalty isn't really what I want. That's because I'm using FSPassengers, it's to be forced to proceed with the realistic procedures.

For investigation I logged all events with FSUIPC and found following:

B737:
Beacon -> TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS event appears, which is absolutely right. Basically it works with PMDG addon aircraft.
NAV (Steady) - Off - NAV + Strobe (Strobe & Steady) -> in every case there's a TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS. What is missing is STROBES_TOGGLE. Best solution to have correct state in every case would be sending following events:
Steady: TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS + STROBES_OFF
OFF: TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS + STROBES_OFF
Strobe & Steady: TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS + STROBES_ON

B747 V2:
Beacon every change (OFF, Lower, Both) -> TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS -> correct
NAV -> TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS -> correct
Strobes -> STROBE_TOGGLE not appearing -> reason for problems with 3rd party like FSPassengers detecting this state.

B747 V1:
Beacon every change (OFF, Both) -> TOGGLE_BEACON_LIGHTS -> correct
NAV -> TOGGLE_NAV_LIGHTS -> correct
Strobes -> STROBES_SET -> that's correct too because it's similar to STROBES_TOGGLE

It's really only a couple of additional code lines to be added. Would appreciate if there will be a PATCH for the B747-V2 and the B737NGX to correct this small issue causing problems with 3rd party addons detecting these variables.

Regards,
Stefan

 

Hello together,

unfortunately there's still no information in the change logs, that this really small issue has been solved now. You did so much fixes now, so why is it such difficult to add some small lines to two panel switches? The workaround is awful and it would be such easy to fix this.

Regards,
Stefan

Additional information OFF-Topic: The update with operation center only worked for the B737, it didn't work for the B747.

 

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3 hours ago, StefanA said:

unfortunately there's still no information in the change logs, that this really small issue has been solved now. You did so much fixes now, so why is it such difficult to add some small lines to two panel switches? The workaround is awful and it would be such easy to fix this.

Submit a ticket. If it didn't go into support as a ticket, then it likely didn't get added to the bug tracking system.

3 hours ago, StefanA said:

Additional information OFF-Topic: The update with operation center only worked for the B737, it didn't work for the B747.

Means your 744 version is too old. Uninstall, reinstall the full installer from your account, and then try the update.

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On ‎10‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 7:11 PM, scandinavian13 said:

Submit a ticket. If it didn't go into support as a ticket, then it likely didn't get added to the bug tracking system.

Means your 744 version is too old. Uninstall, reinstall the full installer from your account, and then try the update.

Second solved!

Lights problems I'm discussing with PMDG since at least last year here and by e-mail. Can't imagine that it didn't get added. Please advice how to put it into the queue. It's really annoying and it's really easy to solve. Just look at the lines above, which were definitely in the old version one of the B747. It's missing in B737 and new B747, probably it's missing in the B747-8 too.

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