Why is It impossible to make a VFR flight plan with a VFR flight level ?

[Branech 3]

Hello,

When I create or import a VFR flight plan, Pilot2ATC refuses the altitudes + 500ft.

Example: If I indicate that I want a level of flight 065, Pilot2ATC will correct this level of flight and will impose me a level 080, 090 or even 100.

Yet in VFR the flight levels are odd levels.

Why does Pilot2ATC impose false flight levels ?

Why Pilot2ATC chooses for me the altitude at which I want to fly, whereas in VFR flight, it is the pilot who chooses his level of flight in compliance with the rule of halves circulaires ?

 

Gérard

 

[vololiberista 205]

1 hour ago, Branech said:

Hello,

When I create or import a VFR flight plan, Pilot2ATC refuses the altitudes + 500ft.

Example: If I indicate that I want a level of flight 065, Pilot2ATC will correct this level of flight and will impose me a level 080, 090 or even 100.

Yet in VFR the flight levels are odd levels.

Why does Pilot2ATC impose false flight levels ?

Why Pilot2ATC chooses for me the altitude at which I want to fly, whereas in VFR flight, it is the pilot who chooses his level of flight in compliance with the rule of halves circulaires ?

 

Gérard

 

Flight levels do not exist in VFR. You cannot ask for a FL for a VFR flight plan. Whilst you can penetrate/cross controlled airspace during a VFR flight you need either PPR (prior permission required i.e. telephone request) or by RT during your flight. You will be asked to either climb, descend or maintain altitude. But you will not be cleared to a FL.

So in your VFR fpl you must only put altitudes that are below controlled airspace.

[Branech 3]

Thanks for your answer vololiberista,

Do you fly in the real life ?

Sorry, but I have a PPL and when, in VFR, I fly in the real life (in France), I must choose a odd level
with the altimeter set to 1013.

For further explanation, I advise you to look at the documents for the preparation of the private pilot's license or the documents of  IVAO.

[Dave-Pilot2ATC 864]

There may be some rules specific to France.  However, at present, country specific rules are not supported in Pilot2ATC.  For most of the world, I believe Gerard is correct, Flight Levels are only used for IFR flights.

So, for Pilot2ATC, for VFR flights, your altitude should be an even 1000' plus 500, when your route is westbound, like 4500'.  When eastbound, it will be an odd 1000' plus 500, like 5500'.

Flight levels are always multiples of 1000' divided by 100.  So FL 130 is 13000 feet with a standard barometric setting in the altimeter (29.92 or 1013).  In t he US and Canada, Flight levels start at FL180.  In most of the rest of the world, the Transition altitude varies by region.

This may not match the rules in every country (like in Italy where the odd/even rule is North/South instead of East/West) but for now, it is how Pilot2ATC works.

Regards,

Dave

[Branech 3]

"for Pilot2ATC, for VFR flights, your altitude should be an even 1000' plus 500, when your route is westbound, like 4500'.  When eastbound, it will be an odd 1000' plus 500, like 5500'"

Yes Dave, it is exactly what I say, but in Pilot2ATC (in VFR Plan Type) I cannot put an altitude 1000 '+500 in compliance with the rule of halves circulars (East/West) . That's the problem!

I think there is a confusion with the term "flight level". In France we say "VFR flight level and IFR flight level "

 

NOTE :

"This may not match the rules in every country (like in Italy where the odd/even rule is North/South instead of East/West) but for now, it is how Pilot2ATC works."

In France the rules North/South are only applied for the IFR traffic.

 

 

[Dave-Pilot2ATC 864]

OK.  I understand now.

After some testing in Europe where the Transition altitudes are lower, I see that VFR altitudes above the Transition Altitude is not allowed.

So, for example, between LFML and LFMO, altitudes of 2500' or 4500' are accepted.  If you put in 6500', the altitude is changed to a Flight Level, which because it follows US definitions, cannot have the 500 added, so it changes to FL060. 

I will fix this in the update 2.2.1.7 because 2.2.1.6 is being released today.  The fix will allow VFR FLs with the 500' added.  So FL065 will be a legitimate value.

Thanks,

Dave

[Branech 3]

Thank you for your reply, Dave

I am pleased that this problem will be solved in the near future.

For information, VFR flights and the corresponding VFR levels are allowed in France until FL195

Pilot2ATC has become a software of quality and I am sure that it will become, in the future, a great software unavoidable.

Gérard

[vololiberista 205]

3 hours ago, Branech said:

Thanks for your answer vololiberista,

Do you fly in the real life ?

Sorry, but I have a PPL and when, in VFR, I fly in the real life (in France), I must choose a odd level
with the altimeter set to 1013.

For further explanation, I advise you to look at the documents for the preparation of the private pilot's license or the documents of  IVAO.

Yes.

If you must set your altimeter to 1013 then you are flying a Flight level and that is IFR not VFR. IFR and VFR rules apply over the whole of Europe and are standard bar minor differences. So if I have to change the altimeter from the area QNH to 1013 that is because I am flying under IFR rules and flying a FL. If you want to file a VFR fpl then you must ensure that your flight does not impact on controlled airspace and stays below controlled airspace. Often and particularly in Italy controlled airspace is down to ground level. Whilst one can penetrate controlled airspace with permission a VFR flight will not be allowed to fly at a FL. You will fly at a specified altitude at the area QNH whether in uncontrolled or controlled airspace if your flight is VFR.

In French airspace there is the added problem of what the airspace classification happens to be.

There are 2 surfaces in the French airspace which will define the VMC rules and the altimeter settings and FL you must use.

1) The first one is 3000ftASFC everywhere. Depending on your flying above or under this surface, you will set your altimeter as follow

If you fly in an airspace where there is no published Transition Altitude (usually out of TMA, in G airspace)

under 3000ft AGL you're free to choose your altitude provided that you comply with safety rules. Set your altimeter using QNH.

over 3000ft AGL you will set your altimeter to 1013hPa and follow the semicircular rule

if your magnetic route is between 0 and 179° you use odd flight levels+5 (flying VFR) : FL35, 55, 75,95...

if it is between 180 and 359° use even FL : 45, 65, 85....

BUT if you fly under a TMA whose floor is defined by an altitude, you must fly using a QNH setting in order to be able not to infringe the TMA airspace AND the semicircular rule .

In an airspace with a Transition Altitude use altitude (QNH) under the TA with the semi-circular and above the Transition Level Flight levels as usual. (You will probably be in touch with an ATC so he will tell you what to do

2) The second one is at 3000ftAMSL or 1000ft ASFC, whichever the highest.

VMC are not the same above and under this surface in F and G airspace.

under it, minimum visibility is 1500m (800 for helicopters) or the distance you fly in 30 seconds. (The highest of these 2 values). You must fly out of clouds and see the surface.

above it, VMC are the same as in B, C, D, E airspace : 5 km min vis under FL100, 8km above FL100, 1500m from the clouds horizontally and 300m (1000ft) vertically.

[Branech 3]

Thank you, vololiberista, for the lesson (despite one or two small errors), but I already know all this.

In summary, the problem with Pilot2ATC is the transition altitude. For the US and Canada, the transition altitude
is 18000ft. In France, the transition altitude may vary in some cases, but it is generally 5000ft