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NBouc

Selecting STAR after passing T/D results in Invalid Entry

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1 hour ago, downscc said:

Yeah, but it's unpleasant to accept something that's not right.  Hmmm... you select ILS08L then try to select GESNER.08L and you get an invalid entry message???  Hmmmm. What if you select VFR Runway 08L then GESNER.08L?  Same result?  I assume your navdata is reasonably current.  What if you change destinations.... then change back to KIAH and set up GESNER.08L to ILS08L?

Hi Dan, I was in flight on that KMSY to KIAH leg when you posted and since I was approaching AEX, it was a perfect timing to try your suggestions, but unfortunately it did not work.

I could select VFR runway 08L, but got an "Invalid entry" as soon as I tried to select GESNER.08L

I changed the destination to KLAX and Exec, changed it back to KIAH and Exec (The FMC lost all waypoints but the current active one which was FERNY). I was not able to select any STAR at all at that point (not even DOOBI), they all resulted in an Invalid entry message.

My NavData is current, AIRAC cycle 1707.


 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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well this is a strange issue indeed.

one shot-in-the-dark idea.. maybe try deleting PMDG\NAVDATA\ARPT_RWY.dat and let it rebuild next time you load the sim. i have seen in some other threads that seemed to fix some FMS quirks for other people who were having troubles with certain runways and approaches not showing up. i'm not sure if it would make any difference in this case. 

otherwise i'm out of ideas..hope you find the solution!

cheers,-andy crosby

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Thanks for the idea Andy, but I already tried it and it doesn't help :-(


 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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2 minutes ago, NBouc said:

Thanks for the idea Andy, but I already tried it and it doesn't help :-(

I would open up a support ticket and link them this thread so they can see what's been tried.

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Thank you Chris, I finally opened a support ticket with PMDG with a link to this thread.


 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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14 hours ago, NBouc said:

Thank you Chris, I finally opened a support ticket with PMDG with a link to this thread.

Be sure to let us know how this turns out.


Dan Downs KCRP

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21 hours ago, downscc said:

Be sure to let us know how this turns out.

I sure will Dan.


 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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Thought I'd weigh in...

So I tried this.  I loaded a 777 flight into ATL, routed from CRG via the ONYON1 for vectors to the ILS 27L.  Once past TOD I attempted to load another approach simulating the airport being turned around.  Or at least I tried to load the ILS 09R.  It wasn't having it.  Once I selected the approach it just reverted back to its previous state as if I'd done nothing.  Same with attempting to choose a different STAR.  No dice. 

So then I loaded a 747-400 QOTSII flight, JFK - MIA, routed from OMN via the HILEY6 for vectors to the ILS 9.  After passing TOD in the descent I changed the approach to the ILS 27 using the same arrival and transition.  It worked fine.

I suspect that the real 777's FMS allows for the crew to change arrivals, approaches and runways.  This is something that does happen in real life.  I've only flown the 747 and the 767 but in many ways "a Boeing is a Boeing is a Boeing."  I will reach out to colleagues who are flying the Triple and ask the question.  And as I know PMDG folks are active here I will yield to their judgement regarding whether I should create a support ticket as Normand already has.


David Rosenblum

Atlas Air Boeing 767 Captain; previously a Boeing 747-400/-8 First Officer

Jetline Gravity GTX | Aorus Z370 Gaming 7 motherboard | i7 8700K overclocked to 5 GHz | 32GB 3 GHz Corsair DDR4 SDRAM | 11GB GTX 1080 Ti | 1TB Samsung 960 Pro m.2 SSD | 2TB WD Black 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb/s HDD | Corsair Hydro H100i v2 Dual Stage Liquid Cooling | 3 Dell S2716DG G-Sync monitors on Jestik Arc stand | Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog | Logitech G Saitek Pro Flight Yoke System, Throttles and Pedals

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1 hour ago, FLHXRider said:

I suspect that the real 777's FMS allows for the crew to change arrivals, approaches and runways. 

The PMDG simulation does so also... as several of us in this thread reported.  The issue is why it doesn't for one or a few individuals that is the problem, agree it should and it does. 

1 hour ago, FLHXRider said:

Once I selected the approach it just reverted back to its previous state as if I'd done nothing.  Same with attempting to choose a different STAR.  No dice. 

I don't understand "reverted back to its previous state."  Did anything get added to the LEGS pages after or before the arrival  and approach that you had selected?  It is normal to have to edit the LEGS pages after making a change to the arrival or approach.


Dan Downs KCRP

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2 hours ago, FLHXRider said:

I suspect that the real 777's FMS allows for the crew to change arrivals, approaches and runways.

Hi David, good to know I am not the only one with this problem. What simulator are you using with the 777 (I am on Prepar3Dv4) ?

PMDG has confirmed to me that the 777 should allow this. They are already analyzing the problem and I have full confidence in them to either fix the issue (if there really is a bug with the aircraft system) or to provide a solution if the problem lies somewhere else. I just have to be patient.

Later tonight, I will install the latest 777 version made available yesterday (1.10.8378), but I don't expect any change (too soon after I opened a ticket on the subject).

Cheers,

 


 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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2 hours ago, NBouc said:

Hi David, good to know I am not the only one with this problem. What simulator are you using with the 777 (I am on Prepar3Dv4) ?

I too am on Prepar3D v4.

3 hours ago, downscc said:

The PMDG simulation does so also... as several of us in this thread reported.  The issue is why it doesn't for one or a few individuals that is the problem, agree it should and it does. 

I understand this.  And I also understand we're all working toward identifying and solving the problem.

3 hours ago, downscc said:

I don't understand "reverted back to its previous state."  Did anything get added to the LEGS pages after or before the arrival  and approach that you had selected?  It is normal to have to edit the LEGS pages after making a change to the arrival or approach.

Of course that's true.  When I say "reverted..." I mean it is as if nothing happened.  Nothing is added to the LEGS page after the missed approach holding point.  It is as if I hadn't line-selected the new approach at all.  I went a little further and tried a direct-to a fix further down the line.  This wasn't allowed either...same thing as before.  In essence I could not modify the route at all.  I wonder if the fact that I'm loading a saved scenario is somehow a factor?  So for the team I will start the flight from the beginning (it isn't that long) and try to recreate the condition and report.


David Rosenblum

Atlas Air Boeing 767 Captain; previously a Boeing 747-400/-8 First Officer

Jetline Gravity GTX | Aorus Z370 Gaming 7 motherboard | i7 8700K overclocked to 5 GHz | 32GB 3 GHz Corsair DDR4 SDRAM | 11GB GTX 1080 Ti | 1TB Samsung 960 Pro m.2 SSD | 2TB WD Black 7200 RPM SATA 6.0Gb/s HDD | Corsair Hydro H100i v2 Dual Stage Liquid Cooling | 3 Dell S2716DG G-Sync monitors on Jestik Arc stand | Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog | Logitech G Saitek Pro Flight Yoke System, Throttles and Pedals

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5 hours ago, FLHXRider said:

... I wonder if the fact that I'm loading a saved scenario is somehow a factor?  So for the team I will start the flight from the beginning (it isn't that long) and try to recreate the condition and report.

I tried with and without loading a scenario and had the problem in both cases. Entering the route manually or loading a saved flight plan also has no impact on the end result.


 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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26 minutes ago, NBouc said:

I tried with and without loading a scenario and had the problem in both cases. Entering the route manually or loading a saved flight plan also has no impact on the end result.

Just to rule out a navdata problem, could you reinstall the latest navdata?

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1 hour ago, PMDG777 said:

Just to rule out a navdata problem, could you reinstall the latest navdata?

Hi Chris, we can rule out the navdata. I first had the problem while using the cycle that came with the aircraft (I think it is 1509, not 100% sure but it was old). I then installed cycle 1707 and had the same problem.

Tonight, I installed the latest version of the PMDG 777-200 LR/F for Prepar3Dv4 (v1.10.8378.0), re-installed cycle 1707 just in case, and the problem is still there.

  • Upvote 1

 

Normand

Intel i7 9700K @ 4.9 GHz / Asus Prime Z390-A / 32GB DDR4 3200 MHz / MSI RTX 4080 / PSU 750 Watt / Microsoft Flight Simulator / Windows 10 Pro x64

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I cannot imagine why this would be different between different users.  I started my relationship with PMDG by composing and maintaining SIDSTAR files for all major US airports a long time ago, before Stefan joined Navigraph, so I am very familiar with the navdata and I am comfortable assuming that is not the problem.  More likely, there is a very subtle difference in how the FMS is set up and in one way it exposes a bug whereas in another all works as expected.  Sometimes beta testing will find these but they are a hit and a miss.

Regardless, there is a ticket open on it and there is nothing else we can do except work with PMDG Product Support to resolve the issue.


Dan Downs KCRP

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