Noel

Best 6+ core CPU for P3D/XP going forward next 4-5y?

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I'm reading articles stating Skylake-X CPUs are drawing large current when you put all cores to 4.5 or 4.6Ghz and run full load w/ wattage up to 293 and so even simple closed loop cooling isn't going to cut it well.  The case isn't quite as bad for I7-7800X or 7820X.  My 3930K during P3DV3 would be around 130W or so, and air cooled w/ a Noctua plus some cooler ambient air and core temps never go over 60C.

Anyway, I'd like to have at least 6 cores but best overclocked single core performance for a 6+ core processor.  What's my best bet now?  My current 4.3y/o build has died and I'm not sure which part died but it could be time to do a new build.

 

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Intel's upcoming Coffee Lake will definitely be the sweet spot I reckon. Refined 14 nm process, core sweet spot and it'll be on LGA 1151, so you won't need to buy into an overpriced platform either. I wouldn't be surprised if we'd see a solid 'average' overclock of 4.7 - 4.8GHz. Though like all of Intel's cheapskate CPUs, it'll probably need a quick delidding to truly shine. 

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Why the heck is Intel doing this for with their 'enthusiast' chips?  From what i read my SB-E CPU used a liquid solder not the TIM that makes people need to de-lid.   I can see it for mainstream desktop and other CPUs, but for high performance CPUs?  Seems like I'm going backwards to go from a rock solid 4.42 Ghz, HT enabled processor cooled on air (Noctua DH-14) and now need to go to water based cooling 5y later?  It's all a bit discouraging!

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2 hours ago, Noel said:

Why the heck is Intel doing this for with their 'enthusiast' chips?  From what i read my SB-E CPU used a liquid solder not the TIM that makes people need to de-lid.   I can see it for mainstream desktop and other CPUs, but for high performance CPUs?  Seems like I'm going backwards to go from a rock solid 4.42 Ghz, HT enabled processor cooled on air (Noctua DH-14) and now need to go to water based cooling 5y later?  It's all a bit discouraging!

Not sure what their deal is. Apparently, soldering is more problem prone during production, which could lead to more failed units off the production line. Plus it's marginally more expensive. So they definitely seem to be going for the easy / cheap solution with the highest yield off the line, despite it being a poor move for the consumer. It seems like there's so much wasted potential doing it this way. Maybe that's their grand plan, artificially gimp their CPUs to make them fit within a specific performance range and then when they need a new, improved chip, they can just change the process and get better thermals / better overclocks without actually producing anything new?

Regardless, I might go for the "more money than sense" route and buy one of Caseking's pretested and delidded units next time. One of those world famous overclockers test each unit, delids them and some of them also gets a new fancy silver housing that improves thermals even further. So you are 100% sure to get a crackin' CPU that runs cool. You also maintain your warranty as they offer 2 years on the units. Then you can buy a CPU and know exactly what frequency it can hit. They are right now selling 7700k CPUs that are good for 5.2GHz.

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Interesting Michael.   This does beg a relevant question:  if de-lidding gets you 5.2Ghz, how much more is that than non-delidded?  10%?  That seems meaningful, but 5 or 6% starts getting iffy depending on what you pay for this.  If you're struggling at a complex scenario in P3D let's say can't muster more than a frame rate of 24, then +5% gets you all of 25.

Thank you I will check out Caseking and see if they are doing this yet w/ SkylakeX parts.

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Am I reading something wrong on this caseking site? 750 euro for 7700 k ultra? What the???? It's 310 euro here in Canada for one. I'm not gonna pay over double the amount! Now again,  maybe I'm reading something wrong on their site because their English version site isn't really English

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i would be careful buying an x299 motherbaord for a couple months, intel shoved the new product line out the front door 2 months early and now the vrm's on the motherboards are all overheating, lousy thermal paste from intel and overheating motherboards, so expensive, and for what?

 

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20 hours ago, Noel said:

Interesting Michael.   This does beg a relevant question:  if de-lidding gets you 5.2Ghz, how much more is that than non-delidded?  10%?  That seems meaningful, but 5 or 6% starts getting iffy depending on what you pay for this.  If you're struggling at a complex scenario in P3D let's say can't muster more than a frame rate of 24, then +5% gets you all of 25.

Thank you I will check out Caseking and see if they are doing this yet w/ SkylakeX parts.

Oh no, delidding won't net you 5.2GHz. Hitting 5.2GHz with a 7700k requires you to hit the jackpot in the silicone lottery. You can go out and buy a 7700k and it might only sit comfortably at 4.7 - 4.8GHz (You might even get a dumpster-tier chip that can barely get above its boost clock). Delidding is 'just' to make the CPU run a lot cooler, so that won't have an impact on how far the silicone will go (Unless you move beyond safe voltages of course, way beyond normal use purposes), only if you are thermal limited in the first place. 

That's why they are so expensive on Caseking and other places, because you are paying to avoid the whole lottery situation, which is worth it to some people. Especially if you'll be running a chip for many years. I'd gladly pay a premium price and know that a chip can hit certain specific numbers, and I don't have to sit there and delid it myself, and I still retain my warranty.

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2 hours ago, Sethos1988 said:

Oh no, delidding won't net you 5.2GHz. Hitting 5.2GHz with a 7700k requires you to hit the jackpot in the silicone lottery.

Yes I realize chips vary, and also that more heat is harder on chips and increases voltage requirements thru higher resistance at some point cooler does equate to more overclock potential and of course adds to longevity to the degree safe voltages are involved, etc.   There is so little practical difference between 4.5 and 5.0 it's hardly worth the effort IMO.  In the end learning how to modulate sliders correctly matters way more than 0.5Ghz.  This being said, it could be worth buying a tested/guaranteed chip for me w/ the delidding if there is no real downside to delidding (that is, after it's been successfully done).  At the moment caseking isn't doing SkylakeX chips. 

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8 hours ago, Patriot3810 said:

i would be careful buying an x299 motherbaord for a couple months, intel shoved the new product line out the front door 2 months early and now the vrm's on the motherboards are all overheating, lousy thermal paste from intel and overheating motherboards, so expensive, and for what?

 

Thanks Bret that's great to know.  I contacted Asus yesterday to start an RMA so they will evaluate my old P9X79 WS and see if it's repairable.  If it is and I can resuscitate my machine this could buy me some serious time for the dust to clear on X299.  

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i see some of this videos and wonder if anyone has ever worked at a production line where the boards are built and tested . it also amassed me that so many boards with overhead and design problems made it out to the public already .... I only mention this cause i worked at places like this for foxconn for some years and the minute a batch of boards goes bad in the pretest face a recall its placed and things get adjusted in the spot but every company has different ways of taking on problems i assume ...

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