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747/777 p3d v4 Dynamic Light FPS Dropp

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Regardless whether you have 1080's and SLI, the issue with Dynamic Lights and performance impact has been noted quite widespread across multiple forums (including LM's) and also regardless whether the issue is of LM's creation (it does as it lies within the core sim), PMDG offered the legacy type lighting for Prepar3d v3, It would be a good measure to offer this legacy option for p3dv4 as it is possible as the other aircraft within the sim have both legacy and dynamic light compatibility.

 

Jonathon Ryans.

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There seems to be a coincidence, with screen resolution and bad performance using Dynamic Lighting. I haven't gotten any problems - but I run at 1080p - NOT 4K... 

Could those who are experiencing this, try setting their resolution to for instance 1080p? I also found unchecking some of the receiving/casting options of Shadows in the Lighting options, seem to help.
Some options are worse than others, apparently... but also running in super high resolution (larger than 1080p), and/or very high AA, seem to have a really heavy taxing on systems - regardless of your GPU. 

I hope, that Dynamic Lights can be optimized in time... but users also need to calm their expectations with regards to performance. This isn't really a bug or problem which needs to be fixed. It's a new (very nice) feature, which (most likely) can be optimized.

Remember, that LM also optimized the - so called issue/bug/problem - with clouds and AA... I'm fairly sure, that Dynamic Lighting can be optimized in time.


Best regards,
--Anders Bermann--
____________________
Scandinavian VA

Pilot-ID: SAS2471

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25 minutes ago, Anders Bermann said:

There seems to be a coincidence, with screen resolution and bad performance using Dynamic Lighting. I haven't gotten any problems - but I run at 1080p - NOT 4K... 

Could those who are experiencing this, try setting their resolution to for instance 1080p? I also found unchecking some of the receiving/casting options of Shadows in the Lighting options, seem to help.
Some options are worse than others, apparently... but also running in super high resolution (larger than 1080p), and/or very high AA, seem to have a really heavy taxing on systems - regardless of your GPU. 

I hope, that Dynamic Lights can be optimized in time... but users also need to calm their expectations with regards to performance. This isn't really a bug or problem which needs to be fixed. It's a new (very nice) feature, which (most likely) can be optimized.

Remember, that LM also optimized the - so called issue/bug/problem - with clouds and AA... I'm fairly sure, that Dynamic Lighting can be optimized in time.

I'm running at 1440p on a GTX775M 2GB with dynamic lights and I'm locked at 30 on the ground or in the air with the 747

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35 minutes ago, Anders Bermann said:

There seems to be a coincidence, with screen resolution and bad performance using Dynamic Lighting. I haven't gotten any problems - but I run at 1080p - NOT 4K... 

Could those who are experiencing this, try setting their resolution to for instance 1080p? I also found unchecking some of the receiving/casting options of Shadows in the Lighting options, seem to help.
Some options are worse than others, apparently... but also running in super high resolution (larger than 1080p), and/or very high AA, seem to have a really heavy taxing on systems - regardless of your GPU. 

I hope, that Dynamic Lights can be optimized in time... but users also need to calm their expectations with regards to performance. This isn't really a bug or problem which needs to be fixed. It's a new (very nice) feature, which (most likely) can be optimized.

Remember, that LM also optimized the - so called issue/bug/problem - with clouds and AA... I'm fairly sure, that Dynamic Lighting can be optimized in time.

Not particularly, I run quite good settings and GPU usage is sat at around 60%, Dynamic Lighting when switched on at the 4K resolution results in it then peaking at 100% (thats a 40% use for one setting?), Yes all being well it'll be optimised in the future but right now the legacy ability with aircraft provided by LM should also really be taken up by third party developers who already have the legacy texture/ effect that could easily be applied to the models for V4.

You knocked it on the grade, it is a 'feature' and so the option to turn off the feature is provided by LM, the issue then is that because as aforementioned there is no legacy backup textures for PMDG landing lights etc then you're left with actually losing functionality.

 

Jonathon Ryans

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1 minute ago, rdtv91 said:

Not particularly, I run quite good settings and GPU usage is sat at around 60%, Dynamic Lighting when switched on at the 4K resolution results in it then peaking at 100% (thats a 40% use for one setting?), Yes all being well it'll be optimised in the future but right now the legacy ability with aircraft provided by LM should also really be taken up by third party developers who already have the legacy texture/ effect that could easily be applied to the models for V4.

You knocked it on the grade, it is a 'feature' and so the option to turn off the feature is provided by LM, the issue then is that because as aforementioned there is no legacy backup textures for PMDG landing lights etc then you're left with actually losing functionality.

 

Jonathon Ryans

I've already said on this thread that having a legacy lighting system isn't as simple as you think it is and that PMDG did not think that the resources required to code that switch would be worth it, hence why they didn't do it. It's not just the case of a few texture files or whatever, the dynamic lighting is hard coded into the model.

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Firstly who said it was 'as simple as you think' - You are correct and having played around with the SDK for scenery development for V4, I understand precisely how the dynamic lights work.

Secondly, the older lighting effects are still supported in V4 and PMDG have already coded them into the current P3D model for V3, it wouldn't be difficult to actually have it as an installer option; the only potential issue would be 2 build types and how that would work with their 'ops centre'.

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2 minutes ago, rdtv91 said:

Firstly who said it was 'as simple as you think' - You are correct and having played around with the SDK for scenery development for V4, I understand precisely how the dynamic lights work.

Secondly, the older lighting effects are still supported in V4 and PMDG have already coded them into the current P3D model for V3, it wouldn't be difficult to actually have it as an installer option; the only potential issue would be 2 build types and how that would work with their 'ops centre'.

So you've now doubled the number of models, so your installer size has just jumped significantly, plus you have to recode the operations centre to recognise this change? Not to mention testing. Kyle would like that on his desk Monday.

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1 minute ago, rdtv91 said:

And?

 

 

Jonathon Ryans.

You're dreaming if you think that's a light workload, above getting the NGX out.

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Forget it, Chris! You won't get any further with this one... 

You've fought bravely... but sometimes, you can only explain in so many ways... :smile:
Hats off to you!

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Best regards,
--Anders Bermann--
____________________
Scandinavian VA

Pilot-ID: SAS2471

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It seems like this a 2 way issue:

- The PMDG models do not include the feature for lower graphical settings.

- P34 doesn't have the feature fully fleshed out.

 

I personally get a 50% FPS drop while I can run the sim almost maxed out otherwise. I'm sure this will be fixed by both parties soon enough.


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1 hour ago, Anders Bermann said:

Forget it, Chris! You won't get any further with this one... 

You've fought bravely... but sometimes, you can only explain in so many ways... :smile:
Hats off to you!

Fought Bravely? For what? For a developer to not solely support one feature ? As per usual though if you even say anything other than the status quo that you all seem happy to swallow you then end up with absolute nonsense from the 'fans'... there is defending a developer and then having those tinted glasses on... I am not 'attacking' PMDG, I am instead proposing they do the same as LM have done.

1 hour ago, Ioan92 said:

It seems like this a 2 way issue:

- The PMDG models do not include the feature for lower graphical settings.

- P34 doesn't have the feature fully fleshed out.

 

I personally get a 50% FPS drop while I can run the sim almost maxed out otherwise. I'm sure this will be fixed by both parties soon enough.

Agreed fully and I think *both* parties would benefit from improvements on this (i.e. LM will no doubt look to enhance this feature, PMDG potentially add a legacy effect)

 

Jonathon Ryans

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4 minutes ago, rdtv91 said:

Fought Bravely? For what? For a developer to not solely support one feature ? As per usual though if you even say anything other than the status quo that you all seem happy to swallow you then end up with absolute nonsense from the 'fans'... there is defending a developer and then having those tinted glasses on... I am not 'attacking' PMDG, I am instead proposing they do the same as LM have done.

I gave you the reasons why it's not been implemented, but you have your horse blinkers on and refuse to accept that a) the performance drop is caused by YOUR setup; and b) the work required to code the legacy light effects in would be too time consuming and not worthwhile.

4 minutes ago, rdtv91 said:

PMDG potentially add a legacy effect

PMDG have already said it's not happening, so drop it and wait for LM to fix it and PMDG to optimise their lights.

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Just now, PMDG777 said:

I gave you the reasons why it's not been implemented, but you have your horse blinkers on and refuse to accept that a) the performance drop is caused by YOUR setup; and b) the work required to code the legacy light effects in would be too time consuming and not worthwhile.

PMDG have already said it's not happening, so drop it and wait for LM to fix it and PMDG to optimise their lights.

 

Excuse me? Firstly drop the attitude problem you seem to have, it's coming across quite grinding - you're so devoted... sigh.

 

I think you'll find the performance drop has been noted by numerous users and is really because of the additional GPU load caused by dynamic lights - this is a fact.

 

The work required to code legacy lights isn't time consuming as it's already been done? Or did/do the 747/777/737 not work in p3d v3?
In fact (EULA ASIDE) I have spent the last hour and got the older model files working in v4 with the original lighting effects? By using the 64bit modules along with the v3 model/ effects... So it is possible and actually really simple once you note whats what.
I won't be writing step by step as no doubt I'll be accused of some EULA breach by a fan, however I'm sure anyone reading between the lines will know exactly what they can do (Remember it's not supported and will probably break anytime you run Operations Centre so KEEP BACKUPS if you want to play around with files).

So it's a quick proof that it is actually very simple to do and all it would need is an installation option or PMDG operations centre option.

 

Have a nice weekend.

 

 

Jonathon Ryans

 

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14 minutes ago, rdtv91 said:

 

Excuse me? Firstly drop the attitude problem you seem to have, it's coming across quite grinding - you're so devoted... sigh.

 

I think you'll find the performance drop has been noted by numerous users and is really because of the additional GPU load caused by dynamic lights - this is a fact.

 

The work required to code legacy lights isn't time consuming as it's already been done? Or did/do the 747/777/737 not work in p3d v3?
In fact (EULA ASIDE) I have spent the last hour and got the older model files working in v4 with the original lighting effects? By using the 64bit modules along with the v3 model/ effects... So it is possible and actually really simple once you note whats what.
I won't be writing step by step as no doubt I'll be accused of some EULA breach by a fan, however I'm sure anyone reading between the lines will know exactly what they can do (Remember it's not supported and will probably break anytime you run Operations Centre so KEEP BACKUPS if you want to play around with files).

So it's a quick proof that it is actually very simple to do and all it would need is an installation option or PMDG operations centre option.

 

Have a nice weekend.

 

 

Jonathon Ryans

 

Excuse me, but quite frankly I think it's you who's having an attitude problem.

You seem to be unwilling or incapable of accepting and understanding the facts @PMDG777 already stated. PMDG won't put in the legacy effects, even though you claim it's so easy to do...

So you have the following choices:

  1. Either you lower your settings so you can fly with PMDG's planes at night.
  2. You fly with PMDG's planes in P3D V4 in daylight.
  3. You don't fly with PMDG's planes. 
  4. You go back to Prepar3D V3 or FSX.

Personally I won't be participating in this debate/fight anymore, since this is getting pointless. 

P.s - a nice weekend to you too.


Best regards,
--Anders Bermann--
____________________
Scandinavian VA

Pilot-ID: SAS2471

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