Not Again - DLC Simulator

[dtrjones 356]

On 15/09/2017 at 5:39 AM, pmanhart said:

I really wanted to believe that FSW was not going to be another Train Simulator. I did, until today.

If FSW is still in Early Access, that means it's not complete. If it's not complete, you would generally have the entire development team working to finish the development process. If you are producing and selling DLC, then you are no longer in the Early Access stage. No, I will not accept some excuse about developing DLC alongside the title, the title is not complete. No, I will not support this terrible business model, and no, I will no longer support FSW or Dovetail Games.

My positive review on Steam has been edited and changed to a Not Recommended along with an exact explanation why.

No, just no.

So you don't like it because Dovetail have allowed DLC before going live with there product. Dovetail are damned if they do and damned if they don't. I don't agree with what you are saying but I respect an opinion so it's fine. For me it's about the quality and bringing something new to the table which Dovetail are accomplishing on both accounts.

After reading your post over and over I'm still not exactly sure why you are upset. It sounds like you've got wrapped up in what some people have said about Train Simulator DLC - you do know the internet can be a toxic community. A lot of people get a lot of joy from Train Simulator as well and the quality of TSW is undeniable.

It would be really good for you to expand on why you think selling DLC is bad during early access and maybe we can then put some points together for a balanced discussion but right now reading the comments here I don't think too many of the community are overly concerned that DLC is being offered before a full release and I would go as far to say that many of the community would encourage it.

[Chock 17,769]

17 hours ago, dtrjones said:

So you don't like it because Dovetail have allowed DLC before going live with there product. Dovetail are damned if they do and damned if they don't. I don't agree with what you are saying but I respect an opinion so it's fine. For me it's about the quality and bringing something new to the table which Dovetail are accomplishing on both accounts.

After reading your post over and over I'm still not exactly sure why you are upset. It sounds like you've got wrapped up in what some people have said about Train Simulator DLC - you do know the internet can be a toxic community. A lot of people get a lot of joy from Train Simulator as well and the quality of TSW is undeniable.

It would be really good for you to expand on why you think selling DLC is bad during early access and maybe we can then put some points together for a balanced discussion but right now reading the comments here I don't think too many of the community are overly concerned that DLC is being offered before a full release and I would go as far to say that many of the community would encourage it.

Precisely. I just don't get why anyone would be up in arms over more things being available. A large number of people got FSW for 'free' by dint of having had Flight School, or if not, then they got it for not a great deal of money, and any DLC is not compulsory, so what has the availability of some DLC cost anyone? Nothing, unless they choose to buy it.

Now if DTG were churning out tons of poor quality add ons concentrating on quantity rather than quality, I could see why one might complain, but DTG have literally only done one DLC thing themselves - Epic Approaches - and that was probably more a case of having something of that ilk to be able to test with the GUI as much as anything. Sure, Epic Approaches was not show stopping 'must have' content, but it's alright and wasn't expensive, and nobody was forcing us to buy it anyway.

As far as I'm aware, all the other DLC has been by third parties, and nobody is forcing us to buy that either although it has, in all cases, certainly been of a very high quality. This model is absolutely consistent with what DTG said was going to be the case right from before FSW was even available, i.e. they would leave the specialised add-ons to the specialists, and concentrate mainly on developing the platform, and that is exactly what they have done with FSW.

And as far as their train sim stuff goes, I think that's great, and all the same things apply where that is concerned too.

[in2tech 588]

Ya'll do know he left the building with Elvis right :)

[Vinny002 2]

Hi, guys! I really enjoy playing Dovetail flight sim world!! Dovetail flight sim world is way better than the 11 year old FSX which was released on October 17th of 2006!! Keep up the excellent work Dovetail!!

                       Cheers,

                Vincent Majerowicz

[Colin Ware 2]

On 9/15/2017 at 3:49 AM, AOB said:

Seriously I remember an add on for a version of Microsft Flight Sim that let users select paint jobs for their Cessna's. Something similar to that would be nice for FSW. But not too expensive please.

You mean, like all the included liveries in the base package?

[AOB 78]

You just picked a colour from a pallette and clicked on it to get a new paint job. Basic but very simple. 

[udidwht 133]

On 9/14/2017 at 11:31 PM, ca_metal said:

Yeah, you are truly right, we should all move to Prepar3d, a sim with no DLCs and is right now completely functional... Oh wait...

Jokes aside, I don't see the point creating a thread to say you are leaving. I'm sorry to read that, but it makes no difference to Dovetail. And the sad thing is we don't have an excelent sim to go to out there(p3d has it's issues, x-plane too). I will stick with DTG as long I feel they have something to me. 

Just to be clear, I don't like this missions package, but that's just me, I saw some people that really liked. I would prefer if DTG was using all it's very limited resources building the core sim, but I cannot say how they have to use their resources. 

 

Depends on which version of P3D?

With version 3...no

[ca_metal 2,015]

4 hours ago, udidwht said:

Depends on which version of P3D?

With version 3...no

All versions of P3D need a lot of add-ons (weather, shaders, navigation). All versions of P3D have their flaws (blurry textures, ugly night enviroment etc). 

My point was no sim right now is excellent. Each simulator is better in some feature and worse in others.

[AOB 78]

Why is needing lots of add ons necessarily a weakness? Surely an open sim that enables improvements is better than a closed one? 

[fs4fun 366]

The premise that developing a mission pack somehow takes away from core sim engine development is pretty bogus. DTG has content teams that make 3D models, textures, missions etc and it's unlikely they have much to do with developing weather engines, FDE's, terrain engine, shader code, SDK tools or other core functions. In fact, in-house development of content helps to test and improve the core functionality more quickly. Usually finding issues in-house results in much faster and low-cost problem resolution.

[udidwht 133]

53 minutes ago, ca_metal said:

All versions of P3D need a lot of add-ons (weather, shaders, navigation). All versions of P3D have their flaws (blurry textures, ugly night enviroment etc). 

My point was no sim right now is excellent. Each simulator is better in some feature and worse in others.

And if one has items as such for FSX, FSX-SE they can add much of that without having to purchase it.

[G-RFRY 1,710]

16 minutes ago, udidwht said:

And if one has items as such for FSX, FSX-SE they can add much of that without having to purchase it.

And I've have added much of that to FSW from FSX:SE and P3Dv4. 

[ca_metal 2,015]

8 hours ago, AOB said:

Why is needing lots of add ons necessarily a weakness? Surely an open sim that enables improvements is better than a closed one? 

It's a weakness when your sim looks and feels terrible without add-ons. Those add-ons are suposed to bring more features to the sim, not to fix something the developer can't do right. If DTG will follow this same way of doing things, I think we will keep having "just ok" sims on the market. My confidence on DTG stands for the fact they are getting rid of the features and rebuilding new ones and Stephen Hood already said they want to deliver a sim with every core feature a sim is supposed to have, and I hope those features will have the same grade of improvements the clouds, the aircrafts and the cold and dark had.

E.G. DTG did it right when they decided to get rid of all FSX aircrafts and built from the ground the new ones. Now we have 7 good GA aicrafts. What can we say about P3D ones? Do you see my point?

Just to be clear, I fly P3D, it's still a good platform, but I want much more than that. Dovetail is the only developer that have clear plans to bring the things I want to a sim, but to be honest, right now, the sim is in a raw state and can't compete with the big ones. I hope DTG can bring to life everything Stephen is envisioning.

[Heimi 91]

10 hours ago, ca_metal said:

It's a weakness when your sim looks and feels terrible without add-ons. Those add-ons are suposed to bring more features to the sim, not to fix something the developer can't do right.

Well said!

This is my biggest hope and at the same time my biggest fear for FSW!