cavaricooper

P3D v4 & the JS-41

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Not what we wanted to hear but I appreciate the update, at least it's not been binned. Being held up by the somewhat derided and distant GFO certainly does sting though. Guess we remain in limbo (or is it purgatory?) for an indefinite period.

Edited by ckyliu
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Help AVSIM continue to serve you!
Please donate today!

It is a real shame, seems a very long time since it went into beta testing (unless I am mistaken in that!).

The PC I had when I was using FSX was not really up to running the J41 and addon scenery together. Was miffed when I switched to FSX-SE that it was not compatible, then when upgrading again and taking the plunge into P3D have been looking forward to its release ever since.😕

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know absolutely nothing about software development, so my comment is just an uninformed observation not a moan.  When a product goes to Beta doesn't this mean its basically finished, but being tested by a few testers to iron out the last few remaining bugs.  If this is the case wouldn't have been more beneficial to continue this last stage of development and release the product to at least keep the cash flow coming in, then move resources to the larger more time consuming projects.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

That is actually a very complicated subject.  There are many MANY stages of testing what we know as Alpha or Beta.  There are early Alphas, in which in-house testing is starting to barely test the waters of the product in the setting for which it is being designed, in this case the simulator itself.  Then there are early Betas which the basic stuff is done, but more hands on testing is done, usually in house, to start working out the major bugs.

The next part is where a lot of confusion takes place, because a LOT of folks seem to be under some idiotic dilusion that final Beta stages are supposed to be some public event, which it is most certainly not.  In fact, I am usually completely against public betas.  Fortunately, in the flight sim world, we do not have that sort of senseless drama.  Only certain individuals or entities, and sometimes established YouTube streamers, are invited to take part in a Beta in order to bring more folks in a controlled fashion into the testing process, while maintaining control of NDA (Non Disclosure Agreements) and such to start finalizing the product. 

The problem is that when the public gets wind that products are supposedly in final Beta, they are "finished and ready to go", which is DEFINITELY not the case.  Too many people think "beta" means "Exclusive access for a bunch of elitists that get to play with it and tease the public with e-peening before letting the commoners get their hands on it."  I hate that sort of thinking and wish people like that would just get out of gaming, period.

I have seen games where a Beta lasts more than a year.  One game I followed AND Beta tested for - the Beta stages lasted a whole 2 years.  It is a great game, but it was a brand new engine and brand new tech, so there was a LOT of code and weeding out to do before release.

Having been a beta tester for various development platforms for years, I can certainly say that the word "Beta" absolutely and positively does NOT mean the product is finished or even near finished.  It merely means that the product is out of INITIAL development and at a stage where folks can test it in a live environment to start giving feedback to troubleshoot bugs, make changes to balancing issues and physics, and such.

This is why I hate public Betas.  Public Betas do nothing more than attract morons who want early access to the game then gripe and moan because something isn't perfect, as if they are supposed to have a final, polished product, and put a lot of peer pressure on developers to make unnecessary changes to other things, taking their focus of the main point of the Beta, which is finding and troubleshooting actual game breaking issues.

I am NOT the first to say this, and I will not be the last, but I am VERY glad that in the Flight Sim community we do not have Public Betas 🙂

When it comes to major projects like the JS-41, the project being in "beta" could still mean months, if not more, of development still.  I am an avid supporter of "take your time and get it right before release, no matter how long it takes" ... one of the reasons I support and respect PMDG so much, because that is precisely what they do.

Edited by Faelandaea Dravin
Grammatical Corrections. I am definitely NOT a perfect typist.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would like to think that the delay will give the PMDG guys time to find a way of getting that original GNS-XLS unit into the P3D version :wink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

That would be nice but I think it's more wishful thinking on our part. Ah well. Right now I'd just like to get my grubby mitts on the thing!

Edited by ckyliu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Yes, this plane is top of my wanted list, because I will be able to visit some nice destinations in Scotland (and elsewhere) that are not really suitable for the 737 NGX.

Edited by Christopher Low

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 4:29 AM, JRBarrett said:

I believe someone from PMDG mentioned that the FMS in the FSX version was developed by a third party who was not in a position to create a 64-bit version for the upcoming P3D version of the JS-41, thus the decision to use the GTN-750.

 

On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 6:10 AM, MatzeH84 said:

The XLS made the Jetstream unique, fun to fly, it was different, something new to learn. The use of the GTN makes it another addon which relies on a 3rd party addon to navigate properly.. sorry, but no.

The XLS is not the most complex unit in the world, I guess PMDG would be able to re-do it.. if they wanted.. but from what I read they just want to port it with minimal effort. A pity. So the Q will stay the only true complex turboprop addon there is.

The upcoming JS41 PMDG will be capable with F1 GTN. Maybe PMDG also can get arrangement to use Majestic/Qualitywings GNS-XLS in JS???

Why not? Many addons commercially use TFDI RealLight and TrueGlass...

Edited by artair

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Q doesn't use the XLS, but the far more capable Universal 1E FMS. The only other dev I know who also did a XLS was MilViz in their Boeing 737-200, but they too dropped it in P3Dv4, as the guy who programmed it also left. It also wasn't as good as the PMDG unit.

And TFDI markets these tool specificly for other devs to use (liscensed of course), while the FMS's were always integral part of the whole aircraft.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

@MatzeH84 QualityWings have a Honeywell GNS-XLS in their BAe 146 (not the Avro RJ though, which has Rockwell Collins GNLU 910). From what I recall it seems identical to the one in the PMDG J41 so I presume it was coded by the same persons.

Edited by ckyliu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, ckyliu said:

@MatzeH84 QualityWings have a Honeywell GNS-XLS in their BAe 146 (not the Avro RJ though, which has Rockwell Collins GNLU 910). From what I recall it seems identical to the one in the PMDG J41 so I presume it was coded by the same persons.

Yep.  Ernie Alston. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah ok, I must confess that I only flew the RJ, but never bothered to fly the 146.. But that makes sense. Hopefully they can find an agreement to use the XLS again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

With it being brought into P3D, will we manage to get a method of configuring the aircraft to start cold and dark every time like we can on the 737? I'm getting a little tired of having to load the tutorial flight state and then move the aircraft to where I want. And I'm guessing it will be using the same Operations Centre for livery management? How will the features such as pushback, refueling and passenger management be done without the FMS (i'm coming over from the 737 - so I don't know much of the current functions modelled in the FSX JS41) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's already been said that it's a minimum effort port, so we won't see any features. Although you don't really need to load cold and dark states for the J41, you can do it yourself within 45 seconds.

Edited by ckyliu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Happy One Year anniversary of the PMDG announcement of the JS41 coming to P3D 'very soon'*

*terms and conditions apply, very soon may not specifically mean within the next 365 days. 

In any case, I hope it's still being worked on, and I hope it will be released within the next few months. 

 

 

  • Upvote 7

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

For those that haven't seen, there was some "unofficial" insight from downssc who said they had problems getting the geared turboprop engine simulation to work in P3Dv4

On 10/4/2018 at 6:18 PM, downscc said:

It was close, until it wasn't.  PMDG has said they were willing to try to revise the FSX JS4100 for P3D only if it required minimal resources.  I presume just based on that that their market analysis didn't expect major sales of this product so they had to keep their development costs down.

We beta tested a number of builds but the testing had gone weeks longer than planned and there are still problems with stuff like getting the default dual shaft turbo engine (basically a PT-6) to behave like a single shaft gear driven Garrett. In my opinion what happened is that the window opened to try to get it done and it couldn't get done within that time window.  As far as I'm aware there is still a development effort planned but it might be unscheduled waiting for a window of opportunity to open up.

At least that is my hope.

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/543075-pmdg-baej4100/?tab=comments#comment-3907070

Edited by ckyliu

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now