Arg! KB4043961 Has Trashed my Sim.. Help!

[bursco 14]

Shutup 10 works for me.

[vortex681 806]

2 hours ago, Rob Ainscough said:

 

 

Just for accuracy, in the thread linked above they managed to resolve the problem by reinstalling the Dash whilst retaining the Windows update. This would seem to imply that there was no fundamental problem with the update.

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

This would seem to imply that there was no fundamental problem with the update.

I don't follow your logic?  If the only change to one's system was the successful installation of an OS update (no errors reported) and then any existing already installed product/app no longer worked, then I would suggest there is a problem with the OS update.  If something was working fine, then stops working after OS update, then how could it be anything other than a problem with the OS update?

The windows registry is a messy place with a myriad of dependencies and security context.  If Microsoft makes changes to elements of the registry it could impact just about any application/product installed on one's computer.  It's VERY easy to make mistakes in the registry, look back on what the Aerosoft Split X uninstaller did from a few months back (or was it a year ago - now fixed by Aerosoft), wiped out an entire branch of the registry so that many other installed applications that had nothing to do with Split X were no longer accessible via "Add and Remove programs" with a very simple tiny error in the Split X uninstaller.

Microsoft have admitted to their Win10 OS update problems, so we just have to wait and hope they can fix the issues they caused.

Cheers, Rob.

[vortex681 806]

9 minutes ago, Rob Ainscough said:

I don't follow your logic?  If the only change to one's system was the successful installation of an OS update (no errors reported) and then any existing already installed product/app no longer worked, then I would suggest there is a problem with the OS update.  If something was working fine, then stops working after OS update, then how could it be anything other than a problem with the OS update?

But, as I said earlier, if there was a fundamental problem with the update then why isn't everyone affected? I acknowledge that the update seems to have affected some people, but even amongst those affected there have been some who have been able to fix the problems without having to roll back the update - surely that wouldn't be possible if the update had some basic flaw? It seems to be very system/software-specific rather than a global problem. I'm sure if I had a problem I would feel as aggrieved as you but I appear to be amongst the majority who are not affected.

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

But, as I said earlier, if there was a fundamental problem with the update then why isn't everyone affected?

Many reason why it wouldn't impact everyone, so many I couldn't list them all here, but here are a few:

1.  One's user Account (True Admin, Admin, standard user) all work under a different security context
2.  OS Versions (Home, Pro, Enterprise)
3.  Any existing runtimes already installed VC++, .NET, DX, etc. 
4.  Other software or drivers installed that requires elevated privileges or operate services and/or at a lower level 
5.  Apps and/or add-ons used that have a dependency of the various runtimes (these could be installed at a later date and then the OS issue might surface)
6.  Installation location (again under different security context)
7.  OS specific features enabled/disabled

There are so many potential differences and dependencies between end user computers it's a wonder this stuff works at all ... but again, Microsoft have admitted the mistake and have indicated a fix is coming.  Majority or minority, doesn't really play a part in the existences of the issue.

Most software engineering bugs/issues (don't really want to use the word "flaw" as that's a bit sweeping in scope) are a result of assumptions.  Programmers/testers are human (for now) and mistakes happen.  Perhaps when AI computers take over the world with their own set of code, we'll be bug free :)

Cheers, Rob.

[vortex681 806]

20 minutes ago, Rob Ainscough said:

There are so many potential differences and dependencies between end user computers it's a wonder this stuff works at all ...

I agree completely. That's why I said that it seems to be very system/software-specific rather than a global problem. It's very similar to issues you see with drivers - some people say they're unusable whilst others think that they're the best thing ever. It's not necessarily a problem with the driver itself, but rather how it interacts with the rest of the individual's system and associated software. Perhaps I've been lucky in having no significant problems since installing Windows 10 - I had just one minor issue with my webcam which was quickly resolved.

People rave about Windows 7 but seem to forget that it had it's fair share of problems over the years but as it matured it got better. Relatively speaking, it's still early days for Windows 10 but I prefer it to what's gone before - I probably wouldn't if I'd had your problems.

[G-RFRY 1,712]

Through the control panel you can view installed updates and you can click on an update and remove it uninstall.

Judging by the anti Microsoft users in flight sim if someone builds a new sim that will run only on a mac they could clean up.

[Jim Young 2,356]

On 11/10/2017 at 4:13 PM, rjfry said:

Through the control panel you can view installed updates and you can click on an update and remove it uninstall.

The best way to go back to a previous version is to go to Windows Update screen, look on the left column and click on Recover.  This will allow you to revert to a previous version.  Microsoft has a couple of questions first before they do it but they do it because you are the boss... the King of your computer.  I know of no way in the Add/Remove Program (unless you know the specific KB).  I upgraded to the latest and greatest Windows a couple of weeks ago and saw issues (not sure if it was Windows 10 or P3DV4.1) and clicked on the Recover button and they reverted me back to my previous version and all is well again.  My P3DV4.1 is now in the most stable condition I have ever had any sim so I might try to update again just to see if it really is Windows 10 at fault.  I do have some minor stuttering with FTX SoCal installed but it is really minor.  I had some StackHash and kernelbase.dll errors after first using P3DV4.1 but I found the solution and I will never ever get another crash.

Edited November 13, 2017 by Jim Young
Removed foolish and inaccurate comments. As soon as I posted, I started up P3DV4 at LVFR KSAN and sim immediately closed w/o explanation. Found solution(s) which I will post in CTD Forum. Comments were accurate at the time though!

[Guest]

Well that is fine and dandy.  But what if your version of Windows 10 does not have the option to revert back as mine doesn't?  Windows 10 Home.

[regis9 4,014]

I’m starting to think that paying for an upgrade from windows 10 home to pro may be a worthwhile investment.

[odourboy 1,289]

18 hours ago, abschwartzjr said:

Well that is fine and dandy.  But what if your version of Windows 10 does not have the option to revert back as mine doesn't?  Windows 10 Home.

I have Windows 10 Home. Currently, I have the option to 'Uninstall' (not 'Recover') in the left hand column when I select the offending update. It is my understanding that this option will expire after a month, after which the files necessary to go back are deleted by windows. I'm sure I don't have the whole story here and I don't know if the Pro version retains images required to uninstall updates for an indefinite period. Note also that Microsoft can designate an update as uninstallable so you won't be offered the option no matter what.

If, for some reason, you don't have this option you may still be able to uninstall a specific update from the command prompt. I do not know if this works for Windows 10 home or not. This page describes that method (method 3):

https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/5486-uninstall-windows-update-windows-10-a.html

I also found this post on the answers.microsoft site which claims to allow you to unlock updates that Microsoft has decided should be designated as uninstallable. Sounds risky and I certainly haven't tried it, but here you go:

This site shows how to make Updates uninstallable (but warns it might corrupt the installation of future updates).

This is the english version of the site:
http://borncity.com/win/2016/10/21/windows-updates-fehlende-deinstallation-erzwingen/

SUMMARY:

In the C:\Windows\servicing\Packages directory, find all .MUM files for the KB you want to uninstall.

Change permanence="permanent" to permanence="removable" in all of these files, then it will be uninstallable.

[odourboy 1,289]

20 hours ago, Jim Young said:

The best way to go back to a previous version is to go to Windows Update screen, look on the left column and click on Recover.  This will allow you to revert to a previous version.  Microsoft has a couple of questions first before they do it but they do it because you are the boss... the King of your computer.  I know of no way in the Add/Remove Program (unless you know the specific KB).  I upgraded to the latest and greatest Windows a couple of weeks ago and saw issues (not sure if it was Windows 10 or P3DV4.1) and clicked on the Recover button and they reverted me back to my previous version and all is well again.  My P3DV4.1 is now in the most stable condition I have ever had any sim so I might try to update again just to see if it really is Windows 10 at fault.  I do have some minor stuttering with FTX SoCal installed but it is really minor.  I had some StackHash and kernelbase.dll errors after first using P3DV4.1 but I found the solution and I will never ever get another crash.

If you remove an update as you've described, where does that leave you with respect to future updates that might rely on the one you've removed and/or re-applying the one you removed at a later date?

[Jim Young 2,356]

3 minutes ago, odourboy said:

If you remove an update as you've described, where does that leave you with respect to future updates that might rely on the one you've removed and/or re-applying the one you removed at a later date?

All I'm saying is that the Recover option is another option that I found works well as it updated me to the latest version of Windows 10 - 1709 (currently have 1703).  It took me from 1709 back to 1703.  Windows Update will try again to install it but, if it does and I see issues that I cannot fix, then I will move back to the earlier version.

[Guest]

Just an FYI, since it's Wednesday Nov 15th, 2017, I went ahead and re-enabled all my Win10 updates all the way thru to 1709 and then more after 1709 to get myself current on updates.  

Tested:

1.  Visual Studio - all good, no more CTD when accessing a xaml or aspx file
2.  P3D V4.x - all good now (DX shader compiler seems fixed now, note this does NOT impact OpenGL apps like XP11 since issue was DX only)
3.  Adobe PP 2017 doesn't CTD any more all good

So, it looks like Microsoft held good to their promise for a "fix for the fix" with patch Tuesday Nov 14th updates.

I would still recommend you Create a Restore point prior to the doing the updates.  Important that also disable any AntiVirus software (leave Windows Defender running as it doesn't seem to interfer), and any other software you might have running (check your SysTray and quit as many items there as you can).  Also be aware the updates (even on a fast PC with high ISP bandwidth) took approximately 2.5 hours to complete in my case (keeping in mind I had to run older updates before I got to 1709 and then more updates after 1709) ... so give yourself some free time to get this done.

Cheers, Rob.

[theitcrowd 2]

Hello All,

Just an update for people lost like me.

Microsoft told P3D that the patch from yesterday was only for those who had the Windows 10 1703 installed and NOT the 1709.

I don't understand why they didn't release both of them together in one update but hey! So probably we wait another month (or less I hope!) to fix this.

Meanwhile can some of you with FSX SE edition write to Dovetail games as they need to work with Microsoft about this issue.  Here is the link we need them to know. I've sent many already http://dovetailgames.kayako.com/