REX Sky Force - Cloud Model Sync Explanation

[Nyxx 6,993]

13 minutes ago, B777ER said:

Not 3 post, 3 separate threads from multiple users. And it's my opinion only, anyone can discard it and fork over their money.

I think you feedback everyone here should take note of, your opinion are as important as anyone else's. 

Personally I think you called there support sloppy is not what I found. 

Support send REX email me back fast

All sorted

Next day a follow up email asking if everything was working.

I replied to say everything was fine.

REX emailed me back again that they was happy it was all sorted.

Sloppy! I would say very good and very thoughtful to keep replying twice even after they know it was resolved.

[Dio 8]

I agree with David, they reply fast. I don't really understand what went so terribly wrong with the release of this Software,(Looked as if there was too much pressure to proceed with the release).  I had some issues with Setup, I couldn't pass Step 2, and the map didn't work. Their Support was very fast, i admit that and replied to all my e-mails. I didn't have the time to test it like you did.So  Can any of you summarize what are the main issues with this software and what to look for?

Regards.

[jkeye 150]

6 hours ago, J van E said:

Well, obviously I quite agree with Eric's post LOL but I personally would have stopped before the refund remark. I still have hope this will be solved and I still think this can become a great addon. And yes, there are a lot of people who already enjoy the addon. (Or THINK they are enjoying it... Haha LOL Sorry, I just had to say that.  )

Which doesn't mean I don't have questions about it. After reading the last days how these cloud files work I was wondering what exactly is new about SkyForce's Sync option. There has been a lot of talk and 'misinformation' about it but it is still not clear at all how these things work.

For years and years already cloud structures (.cld files) were saved into the Weather/clouds folder and a file called CloudArtFiles.xml showed the sim which structures were available for use. When the sim needed a structure it would simply load it into the sim on the fly. Just like it would load an installed ground texture or any other model.

When ASCA was released it already came with a few hunderds of new cloud structures: they were added in the clouds folder and an updated CloudArtFiles.xml was installed into that same folder so the sim again new what was available. ASCA didn't offer a sync option for these models though and that wasn't needed because the sim new where to find them.

Now SkyForce comes along and it offers a sync option but it seems to me is simply copies some 1160 files into the cloud folder, installs a new CloudArtFiles.xml into too and... that's it? The sim simply sees that file and loads the appropriate cloud structure when needed. ASCA did the same already so what's new here? Yes, SF offers a LOT more structures but I fail to see what is revolutionary. I also seriously wonder what happens if you turn that Sync option of or even close SF completely. Will you actually see a difference...? The sim will see those 1160 cloud files and the xml anyway!

I do know that the skies of ASCA actually do get injected: they are loaded on the fly and that was something really new. But I wonder if the SF files are actually somehow injected or simply loaded... just like the sim would load a ground texture from the hard disk when it is needed, it can load a cloud structure from the hard disk. In other words: isn't that sync option just a gimmick?

In the end it doesn't matter AT ALL of course: it's great to have a lot more structures and as soon as I got SF working (still can't load any textures) I do think I like the skies it offers more than other addons but still, I am curious to how this actually works. 

Thanks very much for all your testing.

Does the product have a full uninstaller?

Which files/folder do you need to back up to do a clean reversion in case things go pear shaped?

It's a shame the rex forum issues seem restricted to paying customers

 

[SmokeDiddy 262]

If I may chime iinto this discussion, I had an issue and sent REX support a mail yesterday and they responded yesterday and my issue was resolved.  I'll also say that I have read every word of this thread and everyone's opinion who's purchased SF3 matters.  I haven't seen anything revolutionary yet with SF3, but what I will say is my skies look fuller and more accurate than what I was getting out of ASCA.  My SF3 Currently in-sim selections are accurately depicting the clouds I installed.  To definitively say what I am seeing is for sure SF3....meh....I cannot say for sure, but again, what I can say for sure is my skies look better and certainly more immersive.

I appreciate all the detailed analysis of the interworkings into trying to figure out how SF3 works and how ASP4 + SF3 works, but at the end of the day, as long as I feel like the product I purchased is working and it looks good, the rest to me is just FYI.  I'm sure there are several things REX is having to fix and adjust.  Please don't take offense to this, but one thing that will keep them away from here is being perceived as someone who thinks they know better than they do about their product.  I get it, many of us do want to understand how things work and to confirm they are working as the developers have intended.  But if I was a developer and I looked in this lions den, I'd stay away too.  Then again, I'm not a weather depiction software developer, but I have developed software in the past.

Anywho, just wanted to chime in.  I'll be seen and not heard because I want this thread to play out all the way to the end - it helps everyone.

[Drumcode 1,892]

OK, I've got everything installed and it is working as it should. AS+ENVTX+SF and I have to say I'm impressed. Overcast is finally overcast without any holes in the clouds, the ground is NOT visible. It was my pet peeve for years and it finally feels and looks like it should. Well done REX, well done.

[jkeye 150]

On 06/01/2018 at 5:34 AM, rstough said:

I would imagine this post may be immediately closed, but it appears there is A LOT of misinformation being spread about what Sky Force does.

I have seen this here, in social media, and here.

So I want to take a moment to clarify the process.

BEFORE SKY FORCE...

You had two types of processes.  Product A would inject weather and textures at the same type based upon weather conditions while in-sim.  Again let me stress the word "textures".   Product B would inject textures prior to having the sim open, but this process was one time only.  This process was limited due to the focus on textures only.

AFTER SKY FORCE...

Sky Force is not dependent upon which weather engine is in use.  You can use Product A weather engine and disable the Sky Force weather engine to still get the benefit of its Cloud Models.

Sky Force is not centralized on textures only.  The current sim basically covers 4 cloud types:  cumulus, cumulonimbus, stratus, and cirrus.   Sky Force smashes that by bringing in all cloud classifications beyond these 4 types.  All the models cover this. Because of this, the process of having to inject textures during flight is not needed.  The reason is that we have double the size of the cloud texture sheets.  Thus, the models will pull from the sheets the proper clouds so that all cloud classifications will be represented.   

This is where the 3D Cloud Sync mode comes in.  Separate from any weather engine it reads the weather ahead of the aircraft and then syncs the models.  The models read the sheets to show the appropriate cloud types - hard or soft based on the correct weather.

What's the difference between injecting and pulling?

Does AS16 + ASCA inject and SF pull?

Could those who own these shed some light?

[Guest]

Well, finally, my problems are solved! On the REX forum someone posted somewhere that he also couldn’t load any textures. However, after turning the option Enable internal logging ON it seemed to work.

Came home, enabled the option, and yes, the textures were loaded! I could see them pop up in the texture folder and the Currently in-sim list also shows what is installed now!

As a test I disabled the option again and, yes, textures didn’t install, even though SF said so, and the list wasn’t updated.

So, whatever you do: keep the option Enable internal logging on!

BTW I checked the manual again and it clearly says this option is NOT required so this probably is a bug. I posted this on the REX forum but as usual I didn’t get a response yet. BTW None of my questions there were actually answered/supported by REX. Seems mailing is the way to go here.

I didn’t have much time to fly but I did load the Building storm preset and got to see one of those new gigantic clouds. Nice. The skies looked pretty good to me. Don’t know if things are more realistic than ASCA but they are pretty at least. Though not as good as real life, I have to add. Some clouds keep on looking a bit fake.

I also tested a few cloud sets (I might makes screenshots of all cloud sets one day if I find a nice looking sky) and well, in all seriousness... the textures I tried do make a difference but it’s hardly worth it. Having 22 sets of these is a bit over the top. Yes, they looks lightly different but not completely different as that you would notice it directly. But well, maybe if I test all cloud textures one will pop up that is the best. The main difference is in the edges of the clouds, how fluffy they are. But perhaps my weather simply wasn’t interesting enough.

Anyway, what I wanted to say is that I do think that having more STRUCTURES is more important than having more TEXTURES. But well, for regular skies and weather I doubt if we need all this... For now I will certainly keep on using SF for clouds together with ASCA for ENVTEX dynamic skies. 

Wow, man, those were some hectic days... I am happy I finally got everything working now. And things are looking good!

[SmokeDiddy 262]

14 minutes ago, J van E said:

Well, finally, my problems are solved!...

Wow, man, those were some hectic days... I am happy I finally got everything working now. And things are looking good!

Hallelujah!!!!!  I thought this thread broke the internet earlier today.  I was about to reach out to Al Gore the inventor of the internet to get his thoughts. 

[gboz 157]

8 hours ago, Oliver Ooi said:

Select "Building Storms" from the default weather theme, if you see the towering cloud like in the YouTube video at 9:05, then you are seeing the SF model.

 

 

Nice video. Impressive at 13:15. 

gb.

[Nyxx 6,993]

Black box 711 is streaming tonight and he is using SF and has been pointing out what the clouds bring and has been saying how amazing SF is in what its bring that has not been there before.

He even explained that when a cloud looks like a cauliflower it is still forming and there are the ones with turbulence. He has been pointing out all the different structures and how SF bring a new level in realism. The flight he is doing the sky look stunning.

He is still on now on twitch.

[B777ER 2,484]

42 minutes ago, J van E said:

Well, finally, my problems are solved! On the REX forum someone posted somewhere that he also couldn’t load any textures. However, after turning the option Enable internal logging ON it seemed to work.

Came home, enabled the option, and yes, the textures were loaded! I could see them pop up in the texture folder and the Currently in-sim list also shows what is installed now!

As a test I disabled the option again and, yes, textures didn’t install, even though SF said so, and the list wasn’t updated.

So, whatever you do: keep the option Enable internal logging on!

BTW I checked the manual again and it clearly says this option is NOT required so this probably is a bug. I posted this on the REX forum but as usual I didn’t get a response yet. BTW None of my questions there were actually answered/supported by REX. Seems mailing is the way to go here.

I didn’t have much time to fly but I did load the Building storm preset and got to see one of those new gigantic clouds. Nice. The skies looked pretty good to me. Don’t know if things are more realistic than ASCA but they are pretty at least. Though not as good as real life, I have to add. Some clouds keep on looking a bit fake.

I also tested a few cloud sets (I might makes screenshots of all cloud sets one day if I find a nice looking sky) and well, in all seriousness... the textures I tried do make a difference but it’s hardly worth it. Having 22 sets of these is a bit over the top. Yes, they looks lightly different but not completely different as that you would notice it directly. But well, maybe if I test all cloud textures one will pop up that is the best. The main difference is in the edges of the clouds, how fluffy they are. But perhaps my weather simply wasn’t interesting enough.

Anyway, what I wanted to say is that I do think that having more STRUCTURES is more important than having more TEXTURES. But well, for regular skies and weather I doubt if we need all this... For now I will certainly keep on using SF for clouds together with ASCA for ENVTEX dynamic skies. 

Wow, man, those were some hectic days... I am happy I finally got everything working now. And things are looking good!

 I did what you did and have it working now myself. Couple concerns so far is the grid like rain pattern even with detailed clouds selected in P3D when skies are overcast. Apparently, according to one of the HiFi dev's they fixed this for their cloud structures but not anyone else so get used to seeing it with PMDG wx radar and using ASP4. Frames seemed to tank when overcast. I have deselected "enhanced overcast" in the GUI to see if that helps.

[gboz 157]

22 hours ago, B777ER said:

Default install that the installer called for. 

The rex guys must have a bit of a masochist bent. After warning users in the install instructions not to install to the programs folder they make the default location the programs folder. ??

gb.

[B777ER 2,484]

Does anyone know exactly what enhanced overcast does in the REX GUI? The manual does not explain it at all.

[vgbaron 3,496]

3 minutes ago, B777ER said:

Does anyone know exactly what enhanced overcast does in the REX GUI? The manual does not explain it at all.

Typically that means adding an extra layer to make the overcast seem more dense. Usually comes with a possible performance hit.

Vic

[Nyxx 6,993]

11 minutes ago, B777ER said:

Does anyone know exactly what enhanced overcast does in the REX GUI? The manual does not explain it at all.

Yes but before that, make sure you have textures set to DTX5 and res 512 I have no hit worth talking about even with draw at 250 nm.

"enhanced overcast" when under the overcast makes it darker like real life. Makes overcast look like overcast dark and moody From the top no different. I have it on and love the look it bring from below.