PFC Throttle issues

[ErichB 3,642]

I have had this throttle unit and separate yoke system for about two years now and am really happy with it. (I have the twin jet quadrant attachment with speed brake and reverse)

Recently and incrementally, I have noticed an issue with the No1 throttle.  I calibrate the unit using fsuipc.  The No1 throttle is erratic during calibration (the numbers jump around somewhat) and I always seem to have an asymmetry in VC thrust at any given equal position of the two physical throttles.  The no 1 throttle sets a much higher N1 thrust in the VC when at exactly the same physical unit position as No2.  I have had to set a slope of 7 for the No. 1 in fsuipc so that they maintain relative symmetry in position in the VC.  This has become a progressively worse problem over time.

I have spoken to a servicing agent in the UK about it and he recommends replacing one of the boards in the unit with a Windows 10 compatible board.  He has suggested, based on my description and history of similar issues with the unit in the past, that this might be the problem.  I originally started out using the unit with W7 and it was only after W10 installation that these issues have occurred - although the unit has been fine for quite some time with W10.  I'm just not sure whether constant windows updates my have aggravated the situation over time.

Installing a W10 compatible board does sound sensible, but reluctant to pay for that unless i have eliminated all other options (usb resets, problems) etc.

Has anyone else had issues with PFC throttle units under W10?

Erich

 

[LRBS 947]

Eric,

I'm using their products for the last 15 years, unfortunately for the last 5 years or more their quality went down and I noticed different issues.

One of them was the one you experience right now, the issue is a bit more complicated and I'm afraid is a combination between WIN10, P3D (if using P3D), FSUPIC and PFC.

This is what I did and I hope will work for you.

Make sure that in Control Panel under power options you on High performance and under USB settings USB selective suspend setting is disabled.

Unplug  the USB throttle unit and try to erase all traces of USB, I used a freeware called USBOblivion.

Delete the FSUPIC module directory from flight simulator but don't empty the Recycle Bin or just cut and paste that module on desktop.

Calibrate now in Windows your device.

Start your simulator and recalibrate your throttle and see how it works, without FSUPIC and see what's going on.

If it works you can paste back the fsupic and test again and see if there are any issues at all.

Clearing usb traces and taking out fsupic you can determin now if is the board or the pots on your throttle quadrant.

If after you put back the fsupic and your problem is back I'm afraid somebodyelse with more knowledge needs to step in and help you.

I hope will work for you, I know how frustrating it can be.

Keep us posted please.

 

[ErichB 3,642]

27 minutes ago, killthespam said:

under USB settings USB selective suspend setting is disabled.

Hi Alex

That sounds like a good trouble shoot routine.  I'll try it.

Where do I find the USB setting options above?

 

[LRBS 947]

Search windows for power plan

 open change advanced power settings and you will see USB settings and make sure that USB selective suspend setting is disabled.

If you have issues please let me know and I will take some screed shots for you.

 

 

[ErichB 3,642]

11 minutes ago, killthespam said:

Search windows for power plan

 open change advanced power settings and you will see USB settings and make sure that USB selective suspend setting is disabled.

If you have issues please let me know and I will take some screed shots for you.

 

 

Okay, I found it thx.  Selected 'disabled'.

I've also used the USBOblivion utility - same results.

I remember having this problem once before - although slightly different.  W10 then didn't recognise any movement of the throttle unit at all.  It was dead..  I had to reinstall W10 to fix the issue.

I'm dreading having to do that again.

I've actually installed XP 11 just to see whether the throttle issues persisted.  I cannot calibrate the throttle unit at all in XP.  The axes are all over the show - jumpy - erratic .

So I disconnected the throttle unit..  For some reason, the throttle axes on the Yoke system CAN be calibrated in the calibration window of XP11 - no issue in the calibration UI - but it keeps going to the centre position (about 1500RPM in the 172)  in the VC - no matter where the physical lever is set to.  This usually indicates a conflict with another controller or throttle assignment, but I can't see that I've set a throttle assignment anywhere else.  All other controllers are disabled.

I think I'm giving up for today. :)

Thanks for your help Alex.

[LRBS 947]

Erich

Now you are more specific regarding the sim. I had the same issue with XP11. I think that's an issue with 172 or perhaps PFC moduels, it took me a long time before I got it kind of sorted out, it still jumps a little bit but I can adjust the power.

Something interesting to mention, when I used the 737, MD80, that twin (baron?) or the 747, throttle 1 will not jump. Unfortunatelly I uninstalled the XP11 from my system.

So what I did is I calibrated my controls initially in windows environment, search for Control Panel and enter Devices and Printers, you will find your PFC Throttle Qadrant Console. Please pay attention to where there is a statement as to put your controls in the middle before you finish calibration. It  makes no sense (at least for me), and finish the calibration there.

Star the XP and go again with the full calibration, that long process again.

Other than that I have no clue, sorry.

Regards

Alex

[Rossco 23]

G'day Erich,

I also have a PFC Throttle Controller plus a number of throttle units which I purchased in October 2016.

Last year whilst the unit was still under warranty fortunately my #2 lever (same as yours?) started behaving oddly & was difficult to calibrate & align with either of the levers to the side of it.

When checking in the Windows calibration window I could see the #2 lever advancing ahead of #1 & also jumping as it did so.

I contacted PFC directly as I'm in Australia & they sent me a new pot slider unit which I easily installed myself. The throttle has been fine since.

I have used the unit with W7 previously & now with W10. I would think that if your's is only a couple of years old it shouldn't need a W10 board as it should be compatible already.

I suggest maybe contacting service @ PFC directly for some advice.

My PFC SAAB Desktop Yoke on the other hand is much older & was giving me issues until I plugged it into my USB 3.0 port. It has worked perfectly since doing so otherwise I would have had to upgrade to a W10 board for it.

[Bob Scott 7,720]

With regular use, I found that around 2-3 years was the expected life of the PFC linear pots used in the throttle quad unit I have.  I used to order replacements from PFC and keep spares on hand for the purpose.  I have since engineered a replacement of the pots with HE sensors, which proved to be a really complicated task, but the results made it worth the aggravation--precision, smooth axes that have worked without a hitch for over seven years now. 

I see that PFC added HE transducers as an option for their yokes some years ago...that they haven't produced a similar option on their quadrant units is disappointing, because for fine control like one needs for good engine controls when using short-throw levers, HE sensors are awesome.

Regards

 

[ErichB 3,642]

12 hours ago, killthespam said:

Please pay attention to where there is a statement as to put your controls in the middle before you finish calibration. It  makes no sense (at least for me), and finish the calibration there.

Yup.  I've seen that too.  And I'm still confused as to whether it applies to the throttle levers.  Makes no sense to me at all.  I actually thought that was the reason for my VC throttle centering itself at 1500RPM.  But I've tried the calibration position centered and uncentered.  Thanks for your help.

 

10 hours ago, Rossco said:

contacted PFC directly as I'm in Australia & they sent me a new pot slider unit which I easily installed myself. The throttle has been fine since

Apart from replacing the board, I'm expecting my UK service agent to inspect that as well - as part of a general service of the unit.  It's just annoying that I did the same thing about a year ago and am faced with a similar problem.   It probably is something as simple as the pots, but I wouldn;t know how to accurately make that assessment.

 

7 hours ago, w6kd said:

I used to order replacements from PFC and keep spares on hand for the purpose

Good idea Bob.  I think I should do the same and teach myself how to do that.  If anyone is brave enough to do a Youtube video of how do replace pots in this unit, I'd be most grateful - as well as many in the community.  I wish someone would.

 

7 hours ago, w6kd said:

I see that PFC added HE transducers as an option for their yokes some years ago...that they haven't produced a similar option on their quadrant units is disappointing, because for fine control like one needs for good engine controls when using short-throw levers, HE sensors are awesome.

I particularly ordered the Beech Yoke with Hall Sensors at the time of purchase and I have never had a problem with the yoke since day 1.  

[Rossco 23]

Hi Erich,

Replacing pots is simple as they come as a complete unit (all six) so they all get changed at once. You don't change them individually.

All you do is open the case, unclip one end of the return springs & the pot unit wire connector from the main board, undo four screws & remove it. Replacement is the reverse. You will find the brass pusher rods will need to be removed also however that is just a case of sliding them out through the front of the case. They can come out whenever the throttle unit is removed from the case as you have no doubt discovered.

Open the case & you will get a better understanding of what I'm talking about & you will see how simple it is to change.

[ErichB 3,642]

11 hours ago, Rossco said:

Hi Erich,

Replacing pots is simple as they come as a complete unit (all six) so they all get changed at once. You don't change them individually.

All you do is open the case, unclip one end of the return springs & the pot unit wire connector from the main board, undo four screws & remove it. Replacement is the reverse. You will find the brass pusher rods will need to be removed also however that is just a case of sliding them out through the front of the case. They can come out whenever the throttle unit is removed from the case as you have no doubt discovered.

Open the case & you will get a better understanding of what I'm talking about & you will see how simple it is to change.

Thanks for your help Ross.  

I'll take a peek tonight.

[ErichB 3,642]

On 4/3/2018 at 9:49 PM, Rossco said:

Hi Erich,

Replacing pots is simple as they come as a complete unit (all six) so they all get changed at once. You don't change them individually.

All you do is open the case, unclip one end of the return springs & the pot unit wire connector from the main board, undo four screws & remove it. Replacement is the reverse. You will find the brass pusher rods will need to be removed also however that is just a case of sliding them out through the front of the case. They can come out whenever the throttle unit is removed from the case as you have no doubt discovered.

Open the case & you will get a better understanding of what I'm talking about & you will see how simple it is to change.

I ended up sending this to a local flightsim  company to do for me.  Got it sorted and all is well now.   The ended up ordering and replacing the potentiometer unit you referenced.

[Rossco 23]

Good to hear you got it sorted.