New Rig P3D V4 Poor Performance

[harryh146 0]

10 hours ago, sultanofswing said:

I have a 7820x system and a 1080ti as well. I had pretty bad performance when I was running mechanical drives. I put p3d on a 1tb SSD and it's running great now.

Hi Sean, very interesting im using mechanical drives and im convinced this could be a contributing factor, i do have 2 external 1TB drives as of a lack of funds could this work in the mean time. How much of a performance increased did you see ? Kind Regards Harry

9 hours ago, zmak said:

Make sure there is nothing eating up your CPU in the background as well. Process lasso is free and will show active processes and will also shut down background processes while gaming automatically

Im already running process lasso with recommended settings from Chilly 🙂

5 hours ago, Peter Webber said:

Have you tried unchecking "vsync" in your P3D settings? Maybe your sim is trying to keep up with the refresh rate of your monitor? This would cause frame rates to decrease when the fps cannot be maintained, in this case 144 fps.

Hi Peter yes I have unchecked "Vsync" however it made things worse, around a drop in 5 frames per sec, kind regards Harry

4 hours ago, rjfry said:

I run a 28inch 4k monitor set at 30hrz FPS locked at 30, no AM only 8.5 LOD tweak most settings at max, AVD high, 2xmssa, with all ORBX UK WALES SCOTLAND ALL US REGIONS BASE VECTOR EU OLC GERMANY N&S AND NOW NETHERLANDS REAL EARTH HD,

Try running task manager in the foreground with P3D and see what else is running that my be using CPU cycles, I use Riva Tuner to check my tweaks and performance.  

Hi Rjfry, I will take a look at Riva as ive just seen how many background processes are running right now ! I did follow this video yesterday the comments do not look good but i already followed the steps 😞 Kind Regards Harry

1 hour ago, lodestar said:

You don't need to do that, if stable and temps are ok, leave it a 4.8GHz, CPU overclocking is important for FS in my opinion. I would investigate background processes, you have 187 processes running in above screenshot. I have 39 right now, after my PC was up for a couple of hours - just to compare. Take a look here https://www.tweakhound.com/  See his tweaking guides for windows, i would highly recommend all of his guides, i'm using them for years. See his recommendations on how to manage what will startup with windows and which processes can be disabled or set to manual mode. The best thing would be to spend some time and follow all of his advice.

Also, your CPU is runing at 100%, check what is using it most in task manager. It could be due to unlimited FPS, but this causes my GPU to have a very high usage, not CPU. It could be becouse of P3D settings, but check what uses your CPU so much

Hi Lodestar, thank you for your reply ! I was watching core temp during my flight and it was not satisfactory peaking abit to high at 89 degrees so i'm going to re-over-clock this afternoon as I reset last night to prevent damage. I think i may drop to 4.6 - 4.7 but ill be happy with 4.6 after all I have plenty of cores. Thank you for noticing this, that is a lot of unnecessary processes!! I did follow the video above however the comments are not good, so I am not entirely sure weather i should reverse the process however its hard to tell with the mixed comments. I will go and have a look at tweakhound right now and get to work. I think going forward i will lower my refresh rate to 59 Hz (lowest setting) or 60 Hz which would you recommend? I am also considering P3D on my external SSD hard drive what do you think ? Kind Regards Harry

[lodestar 186]

1 hour ago, harryh146 said:

I think going forward i will lower my refresh rate to 59 Hz (lowest setting) or 60 Hz which would you recommend?

60Hz. I'm looking to buy a new monitor which can do 30Hz, this is the best thing for P3Dv4.

1 hour ago, harryh146 said:

I am also considering P3D on my external SSD hard drive what do you think ?

It is possible. Take a look here, since there are some important things to consider:

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/498171-p3d-on-external-ssd/

I would add just this - the best thing you could do is to buy a small SSD for Windows only. This would improve overall performance, even with P3D on HDD. With P3D on external SSD, Windows is still installed on HDD, and this could be a problem.

You said the lack of funds is the problem, but they are cheap now, maybe you can buy 240GB SSD, or even 120GB(should be enough). But install only windows there and keep it clean(cleaning the temporary files on regular basis).

[harryh146 0]

Hi all ive just ordered an M2 to be delivered tomorrow as i've just un-installed everything V4 i thought i may as well bite the bullet ! https://www.amazon.co.uk/Blue-NAND-SATA-Internal-Storage/dp/B073SB2MXT/ref=sr_1_20?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1524836470&sr=1-20&keywords=m.2

Kind Regards Harry

Edited April 27, 2018 by harryh146

[Airline2Sim 489]

With your specs you should be able to run things nicely. I have a 6700k and a 1080Ti and I rarely see less than 30fps anywhere even with complex aircraft. 

My two penneth:

- ORBX FTX is hard work on any system, especially around built up areas. It's really not necessary for airliner flying as once you're low enough to see all those FTX goodies you'll probably be too busy (and probably flying too fast and too high) to really notice them. There's a reason real airlines have a 'sterile cockpit' rule below a certain altitude (usually 10,000 feet), because quite simply the workload is too high to do much else other than operate the aircraft. OLC EU and Vector will do the job just fine for airliner flying. 

- The best investment I ever made was a 4k monitor that could support 30hz. You can really dial back the anti aliasing with 4k which helps with performance a lot, provided that you have a GPU powerful enough to run it. 30hz with v-sync enabled, triple buffering on and frames set to unlimited (so the sim runs at a steady 30fps) gives me absolute butter smooth performance. If I set my monitor back to 60hz then yes I get that lovely 60fps performance in places but once in the weather and frames come back down to earth to the low 30s then it becomes a horrible stuttery mess. For me the frames being in sync with the refresh rate is the golden ticket to smoothness. 

- SSD's simply help with load times and make life faster when sitting and waiting for the sim to load from a HDD. There's no evidence that SSDs make the sim smoother or perform better, but I have everything (Win, P3D, all my scenery) on SSDs. 

Hope you sort it, good luck. 

[Bob Scott 7,715]

What I see conspicuously missing from this discussion is some measure of CPU and GPU load/performance.  If I start seeing stutters or low frames, the first thing I do is look at my CPU and GPU loads...if either one is much north of 90%, that's a huge clue as to where things are getting bottlenecked. 

I have found that keeping both CPU core 0 and GPU load below 90% (with the occasional higher spike), and preferably closer to a steady state of 80-85% keeps things smooth.  That's certainly doable on the OP's system...CPU load is generally managed by limiting frame rate (VSync at 30Hz works wonders here) and keeping sliders reasonable (especially LOD and autogen), and GPU overhead is maintained by managing settings like SSAA and dynamic lighting.

Regards

 

[newtie 533]

Reset clocks to default.

No HT.

Remove everything, including processes that manage processes like Process lasso. Inspector, AV. Check the TaskManager for any running apps.

Rename Prepar3d.cfg  Prepar3d.cfg.bak and let rebuild, clear shaders.

Do NOT run CPU-Temp monitors on screen while testing.

Use default settings to obtain smooth performance with NO addons at two stock different airports. Forget about what performance you think you should be getting while doing this.

Lock frames at 30 and fly. Try unlimited/vsyc on/off, fly.

Then go from there.

The key to solving problems like this not an additive process, it's the reverse. As you go along in this crazy hobby, you become very focused and observant when you change one variable at a time and watch what happens over time. Then add one more variable and do the same thing. I see rigs at AVSIM that have far more horsepower than mine that seem to have all these problems. It's all about getting the data to move smoothly through your machine and that's going to be different for everyone.

Not sure about the 10TB thing you mentioned :>)

 

Mark

 

[lodestar 186]

Something just crossed my mind, and i don't see any mention of it - do you have any AI traffic enabled? It's a big fps killer, unless AI traffic is injected externaly - VATSIM, PSXseeconTraffic or lorby live traffic. The last two will increase CPU usage a lot, but you can run them from another networked PC to avoid this

[newtie 533]

Remove everything. 😊

[Mace 1,902]

4 hours ago, newtie said:

Remove everything. 😊

newtie is right.  I mean, if you really want to config and set it up right -- you start at the baseline.  You test and test on a completely stock sim, and a reset BIOS / no overclock rig.  Only then do you start adding things, and, one-at-a-time.   

i realize you may not have time for this -- and that's fine, but short of having someone like JetLine Systems do it for you, it's the best way I have found.  And this forum is a big time-saver.  You have the minds and experience of dozens or hundreds of FS people here.

[harryh146 0]

Hi all thank you for all your messages and advice,

I have now dropped my RR to 60 Hz that is the lowest it will go. I have un-installed everything P3D V4, all i am waiting on now is my M.2 to arrive tomorrow and i will install everything one by one. I also need to get my windows processes on a leash!  currently I am running 165 background processes & I only have opera open😮

On Lodestars recommendation I will visit the link he sent previously. As i say my M.2 will be delivered tomorrow so i will keep you all updated, thanks again for all your replies ! 

Harry

 

[harryh146 0]

Good Afternoon All ! 

I finally have P3D V4 running on my new M.2 with just my ORBX products, Global Base, Open Lc Europe, FTX Sxotland & FTX ENG dissabled.

I have "Vsync" dissabled & my frames limited to 40 Fps I can now happily fly around central London with 30 - 40 FPS, I do still see the odd drop to around 28-26 fps but on the whole its better. (RR 60Hz- Minimum)

However now my major problem is CPU usage, by looking in task manager i'm seeing 90 - 100 % usage and believe me I can hear it my cpu cooling working very hard but the temps are within range. I have looked on various other threads and it seems to me it could be an over-clock issue. So I am going to dial back from 4.6 GHz and see if I can get the CPU usage into I nice range.  

 

I'm currently doing a test in X-Plane, i'm flying over the centre of London with around 23% CPU usage and 48% GPU,Ii am aware XP is way better optimised but it should give me an idea of during gaming / sim-ming where my cpu is at and I can rule out any issues with hardware.

I may also be able to get somewhere with calculating a proper affinity mask instead of just using the auto calculator ? 

Finally I am seriously considering moving back to Windows 7 ! I have had nothing but problems with Windows 10 and despite going through all the optimisation guides i'm still running 148 background processes. I had much better performance with windows 7 on my old rig ! However the only problem that is holding me back from going back to W7 is I use an Elgato Game Capture 4K60 Pro to stream with and it reads in their specification:

"Please Note: Elgato Game Capture HD60 S and Elgato Game Capture 4K60 Pro only work with Windows 10"

However this is only mentioned about the software not the PC which is running the capture card.

Is it worth downgrading ?

Kind Regards Harry

Edited May 1, 2018 by harryh146

[exeodus 78]

High CPU usage will have nothing to do with an overclock, and having high usage is not a bad thing as long as it is stable and you are able to keep it cool enough to keep it from throttling down.  P3D will cause high CPU usage, but it should be using all resources that are available to it.  Most newer games will have that much CPU usage as well.  Even though Windows 10 may have more background resources running, I have never noticed any performance degradation with any sim or games compared to Windows 7.  If you are getting 30-40FPS with a demanding aircraft and add-on scenery in London with settings sliders more to the right, that is as good as it is going to get.

[harryh146 0]

7 hours ago, exeodus said:

High CPU usage will have nothing to do with an overclock, and having high usage is not a bad thing as long as it is stable and you are able to keep it cool enough to keep it from throttling down.  P3D will cause high CPU usage, but it should be using all resources that are available to it.  Most newer games will have that much CPU usage as well.  Even though Windows 10 may have more background resources running, I have never noticed any performance degradation with any sim or games compared to Windows 7.  If you are getting 30-40FPS with a demanding aircraft and add-on scenery in London with settings sliders more to the right, that is as good as it is going to get.

Hi exeodus, thank for your reply, something is definitely not right as soon as a load up P3D the CPU is running at 100% with no decrease as i mentioned X-Plane (high settings) is running at 23% and its the same story with all of my other games. I am aware that P3D is not as well optimised and would expect a higher CPU usage but I would not expect it to hammer the CPU at 100% constantly with no drops in % at all. My previous rig never did this even with high settings even in a densely populated area id see the low 90's at maximum. I can hear the water cooling going crazy and I do not want to damage my CPU by running at 100% every time I'm flying. I definitely saw a performance increase on W7 on my old rig however I am going to format today and see how it goes. Kind Regards Harry

[n99wb 10]

Have you excluded your P3D folder and add on folders from your anti-virus?

[harryh146 0]

1 hour ago, n99wb said:

Have you excluded your P3D folder and add on folders from your anti-virus?

Hi n99wb, I have indeed bit defender has the root folder all & P3D folders excluded including

\Program Data\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D V4

\User\AppData\Local\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D V4

& \User\AppData\Roaming\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D V4

Regards Harry