Why didn't DTG just stop developing instead of completely removing it from Steam?

[G-RFRY 1,655]

I don`t know why people keep going on about DLC when you see what addons cost for other sims, if one of the default aircraft in FSW was sold as an addon in another sim it would likely cost £40-£50, and you can spend as much as a thousand pounds on scenery addons.

And this is why you are unlikely to get someone bringing the sim that you would like as the established simmers will defend there sim of choice and crap on anything before it gets of the ground, making it less likely someone will put in the investment to do so.  

DTG did not lease the rites to FSX they purchased the rites to FSX and develop Microsoft Flight Simulator platform in the future.   

Edited May 2, 2018 by rjfry

[Bobsk8 11,873]

49 minutes ago, A32xx said:

When Microsoft leased the FSX licence to Dovetail Games in preference to a rival bid from a consortium of well-known flightsim developers and publishers, those developers and publishers closed ranks against Dovetail Games.
If you've ever wondered why AES Credits don't work in FSX:SE, and never will, now you know.
That's why those 'in the know' initially predicted the inevitable failure of FSW.
Those who jumped on the bandwagon added the lack of content, the business plan and anything else they could think of, but the root cause went deeper, wider, and much further back than that.

They say all's fair in love and war, but in business what goes around, comes around.

Why beat a dead horse. FSW is dead and 99% buried.  End of story. 

[chelmo 42]

12 minutes ago, rjfry said:

DTG did not lease the rites to FSX they purchased the rites to FSX and develop Microsoft Flight Simulator platform in the future.   

Love the use of "rites"......

[theohall65 64]

12 hours ago, Bobsk8 said:

DTG counted on suckering people into paying for very expensive and not well done DLC, just like they have done for years with their TrainSim. When they saw this wasn't going to happen, they bailed out. 

Dead and 99% buried thanks to uninformed opinions like this one.  DLC wasn't any higher priced than any other DLC currently on the market.  What's the price for Just Flight's Arrow III on each platform.  Show me it was higher for FSW than those others, otherwise you are completely wrong.  But - you know - keep piling on the misinformation that the other developers repeated ad nauseam which led to it's demise.

[A32xx 129]

20 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

Why beat a dead horse. FSW is dead and 99% buried.  End of story. 

Apology accepted.

[188AHC 2,129]

Come on Bob. Give it a rest. We all know how you feel as you haven't missed an opportunity to tell us. Ease up please;.

 

[torium 207]

26 minutes ago, theohall65 said:

Dead and 99% buried thanks to uninformed opinions like this one.  DLC wasn't any higher priced than any other DLC currently on the market.  What's the price for Just Flight's Arrow III on each platform.  Show me it was higher for FSW than those others, otherwise you are completely wrong.  But - you know - keep piling on the misinformation that the other developers repeated ad nauseam which led to it's demise.

Exactly.

I bought a very good DLC quality product for FSW on Steam: Piper PA-28R Arrow III (Just Flight).

I paid about $30. The FSX/P3D/X-Plane version costs $41.99. 

https://www.justflight.com/product/pa28r-arrow-iii

So why can not Bobsk8 relate to facts? He is a living proof of how parts of the flight sim community live in their own "P3D-bobble". He gladly pays $11 more - because he does not have to pay to so-called money grabbers. Does anyone understand this logic? And then they claim that DTG is greedy when it comes to FSW.

Edited May 2, 2018 by torium

[vortex681 806]

18 hours ago, Bobsk8 said:

DTG counted on suckering people into paying for very expensive and not well done DLC, just like they have done for years with their TrainSim. When they saw this wasn't going to happen, they bailed out. 

And you know this (with absolute certainty) how? As others have already pointed out, the DLC for FSW wasn't very expensive relative to the other sims. In fact, comparatively speaking, most of it was good value. There's so much rumour and opinion here stated as fact that it's no surprise that FSW failed.

Now that FSW has effectively been killed off (some would claim by a number of very vocal, high profile, critics), it'll be interesting to see if any of the "losing consortium" for the original franchise try to release their own product.

[theohall65 64]

And one of the most high profile critics happens to be a guy who was part of the consortium that lost out in the rights bidding for the Microsoft license that DTG won.  PMDG's Robert Rendazzo from his 1.6 million dollar mansion was one of the loudest claiming all this money grab, steam only (both untrue) BS.  Know your source before trusting it as being factual and not trying to destroy a competitor.

God forbid someone mess with his profits or he will do whatever it takes to destroy your business.

[Bobsk8 11,873]

13 minutes ago, theohall65 said:

And one of the most high profile critics happens to be a guy who was part of the consortium that lost out in the rights bidding for the Microsoft license that DTG won.  PMDG's Robert Rendazzo from his 1.6 million dollar mansion was one of the loudest claiming all this money grab, steam only (both untrue) BS.  Know your source before trusting it as being factual and not trying to destroy a competitor.

God forbid someone mess with his profits or he will do whatever it takes to destroy your business.

Wow!!!! ? 

Edited May 5, 2018 by Bobsk8

[A32xx 129]

14 minutes ago, Bobsk8 said:

Wow!!!! ? 

Yes Bob, Wow!!!! - this closure could have a lasting impact on flight simulation in general, because a team of developers have just been made redundant out of the blue. Why would those developers ever want to work on another flight simulation or add-on again, and what are they likely to tell their fellow developers?
"The code is ancient history, it's a dwindling market, the customer base is skeptical because the remaining development and publishing companies are territorial and hostile. Better and safer to stick with mainstream companies and their games when you have a home and family to support."

[paulopp 56]

If ceteris paribus the same exact FSW was done by PMDG (or the now legendary "consortium"), how many of DTG's most hostile critics would now praise the same product as the Second Coming? Just wondering how much criticism is just brand fetish.

I really wonder why even PMDG's Robert Randazzo had to retaliate with his long announcement which read by the way as if DTC were always the *bad guys* and they (the "consortium") were always the *good guys* defending our holy flight sim community from foul players. With all due respect for PMDG and other companies, but they are businesses, too, and their market does not live by love for the community alone. Their carefully developped public image as the top notch sim devs and the community's *good guys* is a part of their business plan too, and there's nothing wrong with it!

However to say, as others still do, DTG was just in for the quick money, after people barraged FSW so hard from day one, is a bit... little differentiated.

Edited May 6, 2018 by paulopp

[Phantoms 800]

Did the community kill Flight Sim World?

No, but some in it had a hand in it's demise along with sour competitors in the industry. 
Do you really believe all the negative reviews and posts you see were all from honest people posting there opinion or do you think that maybe some of them had alternate motives?

FSW was nearly the best at everything that it does have and that which it didn't have, was coming. Yet there was negativity out the woodwork. Some of that negativity came from people who hadn't even played the game (maybe launched it one time). No chance of alternative motives there, eh?


A couple competitors took it upon themselves to gloat just as soon as it was cancelled, does that sound like companies that you would like to do business with? Or does it sound like companies that would plot to bring down a product.

People are claiming that DTG was money grubbing and that's what caused it's demise, but were they really anymore than any other platform? Was the cost of using any other platform much cheaper or was it indeed much more expensive? FSW was free for thousands that had Flight School. And it was cheap in the store for those that didn't, with regular sales that made it and it's DLC even cheaper. To say that DTG's greed caused FSW's demise is a bunch of BS when you look around at the other choices.

Some were not happy with the pace of development, but there is no question that there was development going on. And as already pointed out, what was already there was much better than what was offered by the competition. Imagine when it would be complete how much better "everything" would be.

No, what killed FSW was some in the industry that had a grudge, some that worked with them to keep the negativity up, some that fell entitled to everything now and free, some that are opposed to change and want everything they already have to work with it and some companies that are afraid to ____ off the big players in the industry. 

That's what killed off FSW and those of us that saw what it was and what was yet to come are all worse off for it. There is greed in this genre, but it comes from many different directions and many different motives/agendas.

Edited May 6, 2018 by Phantoms

[WotanUK 289]

Seriously, this is still ongoing, it's almost becoming some weird religion like the Flagellants of Flight Sim World.

54 minutes ago, Phantoms said:

No, but some in it had a hand in it's demise along with sour competitors in the industry. 
Do you really believe all the negative reviews and posts you see were all from honest people posting there opinion or do you think that maybe some of them had alternate motives?

Really, TSW also has similar reviews on Steam, are they going to kill that off as well?  Do you also think they have "alternate motives"?

56 minutes ago, Phantoms said:

Some were not happy with the pace of development, but there is no question that there was development going on. And as already pointed out, what was already there was much better than what was offered by the competition. Imagine when it would be complete how much better "everything" would be.

Your opinion; here is mine, DCS has a better flight model and scenery, Aerofly has better scenery, X-Plane has better night lighting and P3D has is good average of all. 

I agree FSW could have been the replacement for FSX, but (hate to break this to you) but it was killed by DTG, a business that according to the FSW cultists on here and Steam, runs on getting positive vibes rather than hard numbers

..and before anybody replies with PMDG killed it, then explain why X-Plane and all the others apparently don't require PMDG to succeed and even if PMDG can decide if a product will fail why should they have supported FSW?  Isn't it up to them.  Why are other companies getting a free pass on this?  Why didn't FSL release the A320, why didn't Aerosoft release the Airbus, well if they are to be believed, the Sim couldn't support those aircraft!!!!  Ask yourselves, if FSW had been a massive success, do you think PMDG would not have produced aircraft for it, assuming that they could??? 

I am sorry for the people who lost there job, but to be honest, coders, artists etc are always going to be in demand, i am sure that they will soon find alternative employment.

[Boomer 1,619]

Just curious...how is forcing all 3d party developers to sell through steam linked to DTG not greed?  Steam takes what, 30% of the cut and DTG was going to take an additional 30%...?  Are these numbers correct?  I sincerely doubt any 3d party developer, including the likes of PMDG, are making money hand over fist to begin with and they'e expected to give up over half their sales revenue?  Just being on Steam was never going to increase sales to any point to compensate for thos, imho.

Lack of willing 3d party developer support is what killed FSW.  A poor business model killed FSW.

And many of us saw that from the beginning.

Edited May 6, 2018 by Boomer