Just Flight Traffic Global (Early Access) Available

[sfgiants13 83]

I was waiting for this to come out before I decided between UTL and this one to replace MT6. I’ll likely wait a few weeks to see where this goes and if UTL has any updates before I decide.

[fluffyflops 1,856]

1 hour ago, sfgiants13 said:

I was waiting for this to come out before I decided between UTL and this one to replace MT6. I’ll likely wait a few weeks to see where this goes and if UTL has any updates before I decide.

id wager UT Live isnt going to update.  The developer will do the same as hes done twice before, abandon the product then suddenly change the name of his company to rebrand the product (blue mountain or whatever is was called when UT2 was around to Arhues designs which is UT Live)   This is what he did with UT2 and UT Live. when he rehashed UT2 and came out with a new rehashed version and called it UT Live (theres nothing "live about it". Bit like PSS/BSS and wilco.  Same old story.  

Edited May 13, 2018 by tooting

[fluffyflops 1,856]

On 5/12/2018 at 2:25 PM, JustFlightScott said:

Just so you know, a new build of Traffic Global is now available. To download it, please go to the Orders section of your account at justflight.com

Change log:

Potential fixes for crash on startup issues
Missing FSX traffic bug fixed
Type-flooding bug fixed
SAS flight plans added
United Airlines flight plans added
Southwest Airlines flight plans added
Traffic app will now run at the end of installation
AI aircraft sounds fixed
Regenerated .inf files
Map provider settings now saved between sessions

Please remember to uninstall the previous version before uninstalling the new one.

Really hope this helps with some of those teething problem, thanks for your patience.

hi scott.  Nice quick and simple couple of questions.

a.What season is the schedules based on please.

b "early access" im presuming this is your companies buzz word for "Beta" ?

 

 

Edited May 13, 2018 by tooting

[Dereksmalls 36]

1 hour ago, tooting said:

 

b "early access" im presuming this is your companies buzz word for "Beta" ?

 

 

The term has been in common usage from some years. It probably originated on Steam. 

I think they said the schedules are from March 2018. 

[fluffyflops 1,856]

11 minutes ago, Dereksmalls said:

The term has been in common usage from some years. It probably originated on Steam. 

I think they said the schedules are from March 2018. 

thanks Derek.  Its a pay to beta test product to generate some more sales. I know that, we all know that. 

I want to see if Scotts answer which will show his, and just flights companies integrity and honesty here. This question is known as a Paxman.   

March 2018 would be Winter 2017 then... Can someone load up in LGIR and tell me which airlines are sitting on the deck please.  

Edited May 13, 2018 by tooting

[Dereksmalls 36]

20 minutes ago, tooting said:

I want to see if Scotts answer which will show his, and just flights companies integrity and honesty here. This question is known as a Paxman.   

It sounds more like a "Have you stopped beating your wife?" than a "Paxman"
Presumably the only way to demonstrate 'integrity and honesty' would be to answer that one was being dishonest by describing a beta version of a product as Early Access? I should imagine DTG would have been discarding their microphones and storming out of your Newsnight studio over FSW. 
 

[Dave_YVR 970]

7 hours ago, Dreamflight767 said:

-I am also getting a few cargo aircraft parked at terminals.  Like in SEA & MEX there were DLH MD-11s parked at gates. 

 

 

Check your MD11 folder and notice the parking code and type is set wrong. 

atc_parking_codes=DLH
atc_parking_types=GATE
 

it should be

atc_parking_codes=GEC
atc_parking_types=CARGO
 

Also while in there you could set it's wing_span to a more accurate 161 feet so that it will occupy a proper sized parking spot.

[fluffyflops 1,856]

2 hours ago, Dereksmalls said:

It sounds more like a "Have you stopped beating your wife?" than a "Paxman"
Presumably the only way to demonstrate 'integrity and honesty' would be to answer that one was being dishonest by describing a beta version of a product as Early Access? I should imagine DTG would have been discarding their microphones and storming out of your Newsnight studio over FSW. 
 

Derek, hes got a million ways to answer the question.  But bearing in mind we all know its a beta plain and simple.

The devil is in the way as to how he answers it, does it straight up lie and say no which he knows looks bad.  (a kim jong un)

Or does it come straight out and say yes its a beta which also looks bad, but at least hes 100 honest and straight  (a farrage) 

Or does he put some spin on it, some nice buzzwords and polishes hes lie and tries to bs me. (a Blair)

Or does he do what a lot of developers (including LM) do and ignore topics / posts they cant or dont want to answer because of the above (a corbyn/abbot) 

That is why its a Paxman.  I want to see how he answers it.

Edited May 14, 2018 by tooting

[Dreamflight767 312]

4 hours ago, Dave_YVR said:

Check your MD11 folder and notice the parking code and type is set wrong. 

atc_parking_codes=DLH
atc_parking_types=GATE
 

it should be

atc_parking_codes=GEC
atc_parking_types=CARGO
 

Also while in there you could set it's wing_span to a more accurate 161 feet so that it will occupy a proper sized parking spot.

Thank you.  I'll do that. 

I feel like this most recent version that came out yesterday is much better.  There is room for growth but it appears to be stable on my computer and I don't notice a performance issue - knock on wood.

[Dereksmalls 36]

5 hours ago, tooting said:

Derek, hes got a million ways to answer the question.  But bearing in mind we all know its a beta plain and simple.

The devil is in the way as to how he answers it, does it straight up lie and say no which he knows looks bad.  (a kim jong un)

Or does it come straight out and say yes its a beta which also looks bad, but at least hes 100 honest and straight  (a farrage) 

Or does he put some spin on it, some nice buzzwords and polishes hes lie and tries to bs me. (a Blair)

Or does he do what a lot of developers (including LM) do and ignore topics / posts they cant or dont want to answer because of the above (a corbyn/abbot) 

That is why its a Paxman.  I want to see how he answers it.

You are aware that 'Early Access' is a common term used in the world of computer games (which, like it or not, is the world you are in)? 

https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/275719/7_successful_Early_Access_games_that_all_developers_should_study.php

Or, are you saying that Traffic Global is being mis-described and is not an Early Access product? As you don't seem to have bought it I am not sure how you presume to know the difference in this case?

You said "your companies (sic) buzz word" - do you mean you think it's a word(s) invented by JF? Or that, despite not owning the product, you think it is mis-described? 

There is a well recognised difference between Early Access and a beta. As the article says:

"Far and away the biggest lesson to take away from Early Access games is to take advantage of the user feedback as a plumbline gauging the progress of a game, allowing it to blossom to its fullest potential. To what degree and extent may depend on the strength of your original idea, but be sure to establish some form of self-sufficiency, come in with a strong playable build, make regular substantial updates with marketable themes, and manage player's expectations as you go."

Chucking around words like 'integrity' and 'lie' at this stage of an EA release seems a little mean. If your idea of 'honest and straight' is Mr Farage, I would hope that Scott ignores you. Or maybe he could deliver his answer to you via the Ecuadorian Embassy on a flash drive and then deny it? 

[G-RFRY 1,709]

Yes it is early access or beta if you like but no ones forced us to buy it, wait till it`s out of beta and pay full price the choice is yours, they could have waited longer to release the product then released the updates (patches) to fix the bugs like other developers do.

[Dereksmalls 36]

21 minutes ago, rjfry said:

Yes it is early access or beta if you like but no ones forced us to buy it, wait till it`s out of beta and pay full price the choice is yours, they could have waited longer to release the product then released the updates (patches) to fix the bugs like other developers do.

As you can see from some posts, AI traffic programs are a fairly subjective thing and, generally, compromises are made. It's impossible to simply replicate the World's air traffic 100% as it is in real life in any of the mainstream PC flight sims. However, in the case of an airport or an aircraft, there is much less subjectivity. People can have endless debates about flight modelling, but, otherwise, where everything is, how it works and what it looks like are pretty objective. Early Access would be no use (IMHO) for an airliner. The only option there would be maybe to release it in modular form and then fix bugs as normal. The main difference should be that in a beta the developer knows what the final product should be like and their beta candidate shouldn't require any major changes - just bug fixes. An Early Access product, on the other hand, should require some feedback from the users to help shape the final release. It may well have bugs, but the buyers are supposed to be helping with development, not just testing it. That was Valve's original concept and, although there have been some notable Mickey-takers in the EA category, I think JF seem genuine in wanting to model the product to suit the customer. 

Early Access is well suited to a traffic product - and to something like Air Hauler 2, which is also in Early Access. The feedback from those with a vested interest (because they've bought it) can help shape the final release and get the best compromise. One can be cynical and suggest it's simply a way of raising cash for an unfinished title, but the proof of that is how much the end product is shaped by the process or how much the user feedback is ignored. There is one very recent example of an Early Access title that didn't go so well, but I think the reasons for that prove the point. 

As you so rightly say, no-one is forcing us to buy it - although you'd think otherwise from some posts :-)

[JoeFackel 760]

11 hours ago, tooting said:

id wager UT Live isnt going to update.  The developer will do the same as hes done twice before, abandon the product then suddenly change the name of his company to rebrand the product (blue mountain or whatever is was called when UT2 was around to Arhues designs which is UT Live)   This is what he did with UT2 and UT Live. when he rehashed UT2 and came out with a new rehashed version and called it UT Live (theres nothing "live about it". Bit like PSS/BSS and wilco.  Same old story.  

As info from Jeff Smith in  the UTL Forum:

"Hello all,

We wanted to give a roadmap of the current development of UTLive.

The PowerPack is very well along, and we have a list of other issues that we plan to address or are in the process of addressing.

As some of you may already know, if you know Tom Main personally, he unfortunately has had very limited time over the last several months. His wife is dealing with a cancer diagnosis and Tom has had to wear all hats which includes taking care of his wife while she is undergoing treatments, and also take care of 2 middle-school kids which include 1.5 hours a day of driving to their school.

Tom said that after the kids start Summer vacation later in May he will have much more time to devote to development.

We felt we had to post the above so folks know the status of things. Watch for further updates here."

Edited May 14, 2018 by JoeFackel

[fluffyflops 1,856]

3 hours ago, rjfry said:

Yes it is early access or beta if you like but no ones forced us to buy it, wait till it`s out of beta and pay full price the choice is yours, they could have waited longer to release the product then released the updates (patches) to fix the bugs like other developers do.

 

3 hours ago, Dereksmalls said:

As you can see from some posts, AI traffic programs are a fairly subjective thing and, generally, compromises are made. It's impossible to simply replicate the World's air traffic 100% as it is in real life in any of the mainstream PC flight sims. However, in the case of an airport or an aircraft, there is much less subjectivity. People can have endless debates about flight modelling, but, otherwise, where everything is, how it works and what it looks like are pretty objective. Early Access would be no use (IMHO) for an airliner. The only option there would be maybe to release it in modular form and then fix bugs as normal. The main difference should be that in a beta the developer knows what the final product should be like and their beta candidate shouldn't require any major changes - just bug fixes. An Early Access product, on the other hand, should require some feedback from the users to help shape the final release. It may well have bugs, but the buyers are supposed to be helping with development, not just testing it. That was Valve's original concept and, although there have been some notable Mickey-takers in the EA category, I think JF seem genuine in wanting to model the product to suit the customer. 

Early Access is well suited to a traffic product - and to something like Air Hauler 2, which is also in Early Access. The feedback from those with a vested interest (because they've bought it) can help shape the final release and get the best compromise. One can be cynical and suggest it's simply a way of raising cash for an unfinished title, but the proof of that is how much the end product is shaped by the process or how much the user feedback is ignored. There is one very recent example of an Early Access title that didn't go so well, but I think the reasons for that prove the point. 

As you so rightly say, no-one is forcing us to buy it - although you'd think otherwise from some posts 🙂

problem is not many programs make it out of this pay to beta, backer,prologue, early access, presale stuff.  Sure chaseplane is a fantastic product, im sure air hauler is too (i dont own it)  but look at how many times the community has been stitched up before with this beta malarkey. The flight sim community is just to small , so comparing it to the mainline games industry is madness.

Look at Elite dangerous and Sky Citizen, they have millions of people participating in their "betas" , so lots of money and interest coming in.The FS community is tiny.  

The problem with "you dont have to buy it do you" is it does 2 things,

1.even before someone buys it they have a negative perception of the company

2. when you have bought a beta and you find it terrible, you have a even more negative perception of the company.

  

 

Edited May 14, 2018 by tooting

[JustFlightScott 901]

3 hours ago, tooting said:

 

problem is not many programs make it out of this pay to beta, backer,prologue, early access, presale stuff.  Sure chaseplane is a fantastic product, im sure air hauler is too (i dont own it)  but look at how many times the community has been stitched up before with this beta malarkey. The flight sim community is just to small , so comparing it to the mainline games industry is madness.

Look at Elite dangerous and Sky Citizen, they have millions of people participating in their "betas" , so lots of money and interest coming in.The FS community is tiny.  

The problem with "you dont have to buy it do you" is it does 2 things,

1.even before someone buys it they have a negative perception of the company

2. when you have bought a beta and you find it terrible, you have a even more negative perception of the company.

  

 

Sorry, I've not ignored your original posts, truth is I was having issues accessing the latter pages of this thread.  Anyway, some simple answers for the simple questions you originally posted.

1. Seasons - Winter/Spring - schedules taken as of March 2018

2. Early Access - No it's most certainly not our buzz-word for Beta.  It's Early access, which love it or loathe it has been a commonly used term for quite a long time now.  We discussed, thought about it a lot and then decided to release Traffic Global as an Early access release because we thought it ideally suited to such a platform. It's probably not something we'd consider for other types of add-ons such as aircraft or scenery products but for Traffic Global we think it's a good idea that we hope will benefit end-users and ourselves in the long run and early signs have been promising.  Via the dedicated Traffic Global forum, we have received a lot of feedback already, a lot of which will figure in future updates.  I also accept there have been criticisms of the program, some errors crept in to the initial build, most have been fixed and were sorted for the initial update which we issued 48 hours after the release.  The belief is we can now continue to fix and improve the program over the coming days, weeks and probably months.  

Be assured we'll not neglect the product and leave it hanging in Early Access mode, that's not our style and I'd hope after the 20 or so years we've been in this business our reputation precedes us (no laughing at the back!). 

Final point, we adopted the same model with Air Hauler 2 and that's been a resounding success.  The extra interest and input from the few thousand users who opted for the Early access version have resulted in an even better and richer product.  The success of this encouraged us to do the same with Traffic Global. 

Early Access might not be everyone's cup of tea, we accept that, but from my personal POV I think it works well, very well for us in fact.  Of course, like anything, if the goods within the package are damaged and remain damaged or the company in charge of the product do a runner and neglect the product and users that's where the problems may appear.  I can guarantee that's won't be happening in this case.

I hope that helps and apologies for the perhaps not that simple answers.

All the best!