4.3 - Dynamic Lighting & SSAA

[331BK 96]

1 hour ago, onurair said:

Acutally there is. I am also on 4k but get shimmering when using only MSAA.
It gets even worse at night. So 4xSSAA is the key at the moment.  

i have the same.  use 4x ssaa because it shimmers with only 8x msas

[simbol 5,767]

2 minutes ago, gboz said:

What works for a 4K laptop is not going to work for a big 4K TV/monitor.

A 4K 65" screen has a pixel density about the same as a 27" 1080p so it will need the same level of AA as that 1080 screen. Nobody uses SSAA for the fun of it but because it is necessary. My 4K 65" needs SSAA to get rid of the jaggies, so I use it.

gb.

Fair enough but you have a real reason for it.. I mean 65" inches is huge! my explanation is aiming at users with 20", 24", 27" and even 32" inches screens that are already on 4K and the usage of SSAA is pointless given the amount of performance tax you put on the system.

Regards,

S.

[331BK 96]

mine is 32 inch with g-sync and it shimmers like crazy 😞

 

[lidorx7 8]

so i guess now i know better why im using 8xSGSS on my 1366X768 screen 😂

btw, my screen works perfectly with my PlayStation4 and it shows 1080..i dont know why when im connecting it with HDMI to the PC it all looks fuzzy and blurry to hell, so im using DP(GPU side) to VGA (TV side) and the image much better, but lower resolution it support.. can someone know what can be the issue? 

i thought if i get 4K screen i will say goodbye to the SGSS but now you guys confused me totally 😶

 

[some1 65]

2 hours ago, simbol said:

I think I am going to take this opportunity to explain why you don't need xSSAA if you already have a 4K screen (...)

 

It's a bit more complex than that. The "shimmering" that people see in the simulator usually comes not from geometry, but from the textures. Things like sharp, contrasting panel lines, high resolution labels, signs and gauges, etc. The cause is partially because in the simulators we use much higher texture density than in other games, partially because of the way P3D handles textures, partially because of old developer habits from FSX. Mipmapping the textures solves most of the "shimmering" effect, but in FSX it caused textures to look extremely blurry in many situations, and it wasn't possible to use textures bigger than 1024x1024 with mipmaps without config edits. That's why many addons are shipped without mipmapped textures. 

MSAA does not "see" textures, only geometry edges, so no matter how high you set the AA, it won't fix the shimmering. The modern post-processing AA like FXAA reduces shimmering, but noticeably reduces image quality. SSAA offers the best image quality, no matter the resolution, but at a high performance cost. 

Besides, it's also a matter of personal preference. Like screen tearing due to lack of Vsync, some people barely notice it, while other people can't stand it. 

 

 

[AnkH 2,232]

2 hours ago, simbol said:

My Laptop 4k screen is 17" Inches.

You see, this results in a whopping pixeldensity of 260ppi. No wonder you hardly see any shimmering even without AA.

[captain420 3,099]

4XSSAA with DL brings my sim down to its knees. I get about 10-15fps at KSEA. I just use 8xMSAA. I'm also running on a 55" 4K TV as well.

[B777ER 2,475]

3 hours ago, simbol said:

My Laptop 4k screen is 17" inches.

Maybe certain screens are prune than others.

S.

So on my 4k 55in TV with Orbx night lights I get shimmering when  they are in the dost but not up close. You saying that even in the distance you don't get shimmering with Orbx night lights? 

[simbol 5,767]

20 minutes ago, B777ER said:

So on my 4k 55in TV with Orbx night lights I get shimmering when  they are in the dost but not up close. You saying that even in the distance you don't get shimmering with Orbx night lights? 

Correct, but as others have pointed out it seems to be dependant of the overall screen size.

Yours is quite large.

S.

Edited June 27, 2018 by simbol

[AnkH 2,232]

38 minutes ago, B777ER said:

So on my 4k 55in TV with Orbx night lights I get shimmering when  they are in the dost but not up close.

If pixel density plays a role, the explanation is easy. With 4K on 55in, you only get 80ppi, that's less than FullHD on a 23in screen.

[Sethos 4,266]

From my own observations, I've seen some nice improvements and they also seem to have improved performance of lights that might be just out of the near-vicinity. Say, sitting on the runway and having dynamic lights at nearby terminals. Sitting in the TFDi 717 with all lights in in 4.2 would tank my 1080 Ti at 4xSSAA. Now I'm maintaining my locked 30. Can even sit on the runway at OrbX's ESSA at night, a very DL heavy airport, and maintain 30. However, once I move back over to the terminal, the FPS starts to take a dive. So we're getting closer but I will maintain my 2xSSAA + FXAA + ReShade's excellent filmic sharpening to counteract the FXAA blurring.

[Gabe777 132]

On 6/27/2018 at 8:40 AM, simbol said:

I did it looks like 4K, I just want to confirm he is actually playing P3D at 4K because if he is there is no point in using SSAA anti aliasing.

He is taxing his system with Super Sampling when it is absolutely unnecessary.

Regards,
Simbol

 

 

Way to simplistic to say this.

If you have a 27 inch 4K monitor and sit 4 foot from monitor, graphics will look a lot different compared to a 50 inch TV, sat 2 foot away.

Comments like "a 4K monitor makes SSAA unnecessary", are simply without logic or validity.

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

3 hours ago, Gabe777 said:

Comments like "a 4K monitor makes SSAA unnecessary", are simply without logic or validity.

The only reason for using any AA at 4K is to reduce shimmering, if indeed one has that issue. I sit 2 feet away from a 27" 4K monitor and I can barely tell the difference between having AA either on or off. Like Simbol, I guess I must be without either logic or validity (or maybe my eyesight is poor).

[Ryback 0]

On 9/23/2018 at 1:10 AM, jabloomf1230 said:

The only reason for using any AA at 4K is to reduce shimmering, if indeed one has that issue. I sit 2 feet away from a 27" 4K monitor and I can barely tell the difference between having AA either on or off. Like Simbol, I guess I must be without either logic or validity (or maybe my eyesight is poor).

Its easy make a screen record , then we can see of their is No shimmering on your setup. I was the first one who bought a 4K 34inch about 3 years ago , couldnt believe that someone was saying aa was not needed.. Hell yes its awfull at night without aa. It Will be fairly oké with 8xmssa , but 4x ssa at night is a lot better. I can even see the difference with 8xssa mostly in far distance with lot of objects. 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Ryback

[Rocky_53 1,566]

On 9/22/2018 at 8:57 PM, Gabe777 said:

Way to simplistic to say this.

If you have a 27 inch 4K monitor and sit 4 foot from monitor, graphics will look a lot different compared to a 50 inch TV, sat 2 foot away.

Comments like "a 4K monitor makes SSAA unnecessary", are simply without logic or validity.

I was just about to post the very same! Exactly, shimmering and aliasing will be present on any monitor, regardless. It will be more noticeable or less, depending upon the monitor's resolution, the AA settings and the big one... the distance the monitor is being viewed from. I agree, a 4K 27" monitor will have far less visible shimmering than say, a 55" 4K monitor viewed at the same distance. I have a 4K 43" monitor and view it at the same distance as when I had a 30" 2K monitor, but I still see aliasing/jaggies/shimmering at 4xSSAA, however at 8xSSAA I see virtually none. If I was to view the monitor from say, 6 feet, then I'd probably not see any shimmering even at 4xSSAA. It's all about viewing distances.

/