Reposition Feature?

[silentsage 19]

Any chance PMDG might implement a "Reposition" feature similar to that in the Quality Wings 787?  The 747 and 777 are largely intended for long routes, and such a feature would avoid extended periods of time with the sim accelerated and waiting for TOD near the destination. 

[harvester21 34]

Do you mean to cut out cruise flight all together?

[Ephedrin 418]

then where is the sense in doing that flight? 

you can cut 8h down to 2 easily using the standard time acceleration, or even to 1h, not sure atm if PMDG aircraft can handle this... 

But you can't seriously simulate a cut in space and still call it realism... there are so many things going on inside the PMDG systems, accurate fuel calculation and consumption depending on the experienced wind/weather situation en route is just one of many. I really doubt that PMDG would do sth like that. I don't want to downgrade the QW 787, I really like to fly it... but it's really far from PMDG quality and accuracy.

Edited July 2, 2018 by Ephedrin

[silentsage 19]

The interesting parts of the flights are hand-flying the take-off and climb to cruise altitude, and hand flying from TOD to touchdown.  Sitting and watching clouds go by at 8x while the autopilot drives the airplane is unrealistic and just isn't interesting to me.  It's an optional feature, and no one is forced to use it.  I do find that it allows me to fly a lot more departures and approaches in the limited time I have for simming. 

[FalconAF 213]

You do realize that a real world B777 pilot will be turning on the autopilot shortly after takeoff, and using it during the descent from TOD until (normally) established on the final approach to the runway?  In almost all cases, they will never be hand-flying the aircraft all the way to the cruising altitude, nor all the way from the TOD to the landing itself.

What you want to do with the PMDG $100+ study sim level aircraft is not what is realistic at all.  If you can do it with a different developer's aircraft, and that makes you happy, go for it.

And no one is forcing you to fly a long haul flight plan to begin with.  If you want to do an "up and immediately back down" flight, just do one.  In a B777, that might be something like KJFK to KBWI.  Heck, you could hand fly that all the way to cruise altitude then immediately start a TOD without having any "boring 8 hours of watching clouds pass by cruise" at all If you wanted to.

Just sayin'...…... 

Edited July 2, 2018 by FalconAF

[scandinavian13 5,192]

I'm gonna step in here, just to steer the thread a bit.

I won't knock the request. I don't fully understand it, given my penchant to fly in real time (I have plenty of work to be doing on the GFO as it cruises along), but I don't find it an unreasonable request. Technically feasible? Different story. Be careful what you all call "easy" unless you've done it.

[Ephedrin 418]

1 hour ago, FalconAF said:

they will never be hand-flying the aircraft all the way to the cruising altitude,

 

I could easily post 3 or 4 videos showing the opposite 😄 

 

Dave,

what I mean is that as soon as you click on this feature the system has to do something that is completely off from everything PMDG stands for... you have to estimate.. 

PMDG is a bit like Mister Spock.. Data, Calculating, I'd say lack of humour but Kyle and Robert would probably beat me down immediately   

[mtrainer 136]

Like Rick said, just choose shorter hops.  It's all "pretend" anyhow so just pretend it was a longer flight.  Fill it up with less fuel.  I flew the Caribbean livery from Miami across ORBX South America one 60 minute or so hop at a time, and actually landed at what may be the only dirt airstrip on Antarctica once I ran out of "South" in South America.  Did the same thing getting it back to the Bahamas.

I LOVE flying the Hawaii Island chain with the 737, if you stop at each major island you'll have your hands full the whole time and never spend more than 60 minutes at cruise altitude.

To make it more of a challenge, I've slowly reduced the initial fuel load to what is barely achievable to make all the hops from the Northern Hawaii Islands to the South Islands with all major airports (well one per island) between landed at, so if I make a mistake....I'm sweating bullets on that last leg.   I have actually ran out of gas on the runway right after setting it down on the final leg.  In the real world this might be a career ender, but for me it was quite rewarding because that particular flight was full of toddlers from Burma.

Mark Trainer

 

 

[silentsage 19]

I don't want to start a flaming war here, so please take what I say in a constructive spirit.

I've been a pilot for 41 years, and I know many captains who will hand fly the aircraft to reasonably high altitudes (maybe not TOC, but close), and from TOD (or thereabounts) to landing.  The older captains tend to do it so they have a feel for the aircraft if the automation fails.  The FAA claims that the younger population of captains rely too much on the automation, and encourages them to hand fly the aircraft enough to be able to handle it if the automation fails, or can't cope with a situation.  I'll let you read the FAA studies and some of the accident reports and let you draw your own conclusions.  They're encouraged to do this in the simulators before doing it in the aircraft.

I think some folks in this thread (and I'm not criticising anyone, just making an observation) are missing the purpose of simulators in aviation.  They're used to let pilots practice whatever phase of flight they need to practice.  In the real world, simulators are used for segments of flights, not entire flights. Off-hand, I can't think of a time when I have seen anyone conduct a simulator flight in real-time from take-off to landing.  I'm not saying it isn't done, but simulator time is expensive, and flying at cruise on autopilot in the absence of aircraft failures is usually not something that needs to be practiced. 

And if folks want to simulate a complete flight from beginning to end, that's fine, we all have our reasons for doing this.  In my case I find it enjoyable to practice IFR departures and landings.  I spent a long time learning and honing those skills. And it's nice to be able to practice them all over the world.  It's not a question of distance, but variety.  The PMDG aircraft are far and away the best available for P3D when it comes to fidelity of the aircraft systems, flight dynamics, and procedures for IFR.  That's why I asked the question of PMDG.

My original post was directed to PMDG, and I'll circle back to that.  If it is possible, and economically feasible (from a business standpoint), to add a reposition feature, doing so would allow some of us to use the PMDG aircraft in a manner closer to the way simulators are used in the real world - that is, having a better opportunity to select the phases of flight to be practiced.  No doubt there are technical challenges in translating the aircraft state vector from one location  to another, while making appropriate adjustments for fuel and other consumables, environmental conditions, changes in system states, and other factors.  This is in the "nice to have" category, not an absolute requirement.

This is my last post in this thread. So, everyone, please have fun with this hobby, no matter how you fly. Just understand that some of us have different objectives than you.   

 

 

 

 

Edited July 3, 2018 by silentsage

[joona_ 30]

On 7/3/2018 at 4:20 AM, silentsage said:

I think some folks in this thread (and I'm not criticising anyone, just making an observation) are missing the purpose of simulators in aviation.  They're used to let pilots practice whatever phase of flight they need to practice.  In the real world, simulators are used for segments of flights, not entire flights. Off-hand, I can't think of a time when I have seen anyone conduct a simulator flight in real-time from take-off to landing.  I'm not saying it isn't done, but simulator time is expensive, and flying at cruise on autopilot in the absence of aircraft failures is usually not something that needs to be practiced. 

What you're saying, is true. But this chapter I must comment on.

I don't think anyone is missing the purpose of simulators. I'm sure everyone here (well almost everyone) knows how simulators are used in the real world. Yes, no one sits 12 hours in a $100 million simulator drinking coffee. But here, people are mostly using this for entertaiment. People like to simulate real flights. I like to fly the 12+ hour flights in real time. Yes it's boring and there's really not much to do yet I like to do it. And many others like it too. Sometimes I like to just fire up the 777, head over to runway and take off and fly VFR with full manual control, maybe turn off PFC and see what tricks you can do, or do touch and gos at 1000ft runways in the middle of corn field. Sometimes I'll do the 12 hour flights as realistically as possible. The choice is mine.

I understand your point of view but I want to remind you that we are not all pilots here.

[30K 72]

I don't know the feature exactly but placing my A/C 20 NM before touchdown would be a great training feature.

[mtrainer 136]

In the "old days"....w/ FS9 and such, I'd save scenarios say 10 miles out from landing, 20 miles out, or just before takeoff....is there something stopping anyone from essentially doing the same?   (With P3D and PDMG I don't bother so much, almost always a full flight, but usually less than 300 miles flight distance in the 737 to keep the long stretches at a minimum).  

As someone who was watched a KC-10 Singer-Link system in action and had the opportunity to fly it twice from the captains seat at Barksdale AFB, I can attest they throw you into various scenarios and don't waste time on the boring segments of flight.  That sim ran nearly 24/7.  Sadly, they moved the entire KC-10 training facilities to another base since then.  But the KC-135s are still there.

Mark Trainer

 

[Patco Lch 1,464]

There's also the map click and drag method. Just drag the aircraft to the waypoint you want, let it stablelize itself then adjust the fuel and time to match. Takes a little planning but works.

FEDEX has a lot of short flights with MD11' s. Just substitute your T7 on some of those.

Edited July 7, 2018 by PATCO LCH

[ps1flyer 9]

From my point of view, the question is more then valid. l concur that having an instructor station inside the simulation would increase the abilty of the product to use it as a training tool. True, probably not everyone will make good use of this but some will for sure.

Just to show how it looks on a Level D sim or most other Fixed Bases Sims / FTDs, this is a photo I found on the net. It shows the multiple options on how to position the sim in various locations. (Source: https://blog.jartweb.net/?page_id=4288 )

Actually, I have built myself a fixed based sim (747-400) and yes, it has an instructors stations. 😘

Markus.

[andreh 125]

May I recommend FSIPanel? It allows you to directly set up your aircraft for different scenarios including finals. It may not be exactly what the OP is looking for, but useful and fun nevertheless.