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Intel i9 9900k to hit 5GHZ - Do you have one Rob?!

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5 hours ago, zmak said:

Is delidding worth it ? conclusion here says its not

 

 

And of course it's Linus.

His conclusions are wrong, because he performed the procedure incorrectly.  I posted in their forums and told them as much when the video came out.

I made a thorough guide on delidding that's hosted right here at Avsim - it's been in my signature for 6 years.  Sadly, the pics are no longer available (because its that old).

Anyway, delidding works.

Don't believe me?  My 7700k is delidded and runs at 5.2GHz with load temps in the 70s during stress testing on pretty standard water cooling (i.e. not using a chiller).

Still don't believe me?  Do it yourself and measure the before and after temperatures.  Don't do it like Linus did though - you need to use liquid metal and you should not reseal the lid with epoxy, as it is unnecessary and negates one of the primary benefits of delidding (reducing the lid height).

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Posted (edited)

Guru3D.com have just put up a list from ASUS showing the soon to be released Z390 motherboards all 19 of them for the new Intel CPUs.

 

 

Edited by rjfry

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11 hours ago, Purr said:

If the 9 series can’t be delidded because it’s soldered on, doesn’t that make it a lesser prospect for overclocking? From that perspective I’m wondering if the i8700k would be a better option? You can delid and oc and maybe it will have a price drop as the i9 series shows up. 

What do you guys think? I’m considering an upgrade soon.

 

If they use solder you won’t need to delid. That’s the whole point. No crappy thermal compound to replace, 

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On 7/27/2018 at 6:43 AM, dmiannay said:

Sounds like a reasonable plan, Bruce.  A minor restocking hit, but a more attractive performance payoff with the 9XXX series CPUs.  With the 9900k you'd have 8 cores and 6 cores for the 9700k.  Rumors are that the 9xxx series may have a soldered IHS (integrated heatspreader) versus the previous inferior thermal compound Intel have been using (link).  This would lend far better cooling capability, hence higher O/C potential.  These are good times on the hardware front.

9700k is 8 core but no HT

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2 hours ago, GHarrall said:

If they use solder you won’t need to delid. That’s the whole point. No crappy thermal compound to replace, 

Exactly!

Bruceb

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Posted (edited)

So soldering is as effective as using the liquid metal on the ihs then? Good news then to not have to worry about the delidding. 

If HT is not available will that still be superior to an i8700k with fewer cores but the ability to run HT (talking in term of performance specifically with P3D here)? I think I’ve used both HT on and off with my i7 2600k and disnt find one to be particularly better or standing out.

Edited by Purr

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17 hours ago, Purr said:

If the 9 series can’t be delidded because it’s soldered on, doesn’t that make it a lesser prospect for overclocking? From that perspective I’m wondering if the i8700k would be a better option? You can delid and oc and maybe it will have a price drop as the i9 series shows up. 

What do you guys think? I’m considering an upgrade soon.

 

 

Solder has the best thermal conductivity. Desired rather than delidding with liquid metal.

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, zmak said:

Is delidding worth it ? conclusion here says its not

 

 

 

As Max rightly said. His delidding was garbage, he didn't even use liquid metal.  I also commented on this, on his YouTube channel. Along with many others. 

My 8700K I only reduced temps by just over 10 degrees, but my daughters 7600K dropped 15 degrees. Yes it works, yes it's worth it. Someone on the forum I assisted with the process, dropped 20 degrees.

Where I would "slightly" disagree with Max is in regard to gluing the IHS back on. You can get away with this. I did with one of my delids. A very slight smear of silicone, not enough to increase the height between IHS and die. I notice der8auer glues his back on too. 

 

 

Edited by martin-w

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8 hours ago, GHarrall said:

9700k is 8 core but no HT

Yes, you're correct, Glenn.  I originally read it on Guru3D, but they since corrected their reporting (link).

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It's the Internet, so the world will forever be stuck with that video by Linus.  I can't stand to watch how he assaulted that CPU!

12 hours ago, martin-w said:

A very slight smear of silicone, not enough to increase the height between IHS and die. I notice der8auer glues his back on too.

+1  After delidding I grind each IHS to fit the die, leaving about .4mm between the two that is filled with a very small bead of silicone sealer.  If any of the sealer squishes out I know I've applied too much.

Greg

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Posted (edited)

Has anyone read anything more solid on whether or not I9-9900K will sport soldered IHS?  Everything I read is based on a single source (golem.de) so seems pretty much like rumor run amok.   If it does, and I7-9700K doesn't, I'll happily pay the difference in cost.

Edited by Noel

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Well I have taken a punt and RMA'd my just purchased 8086K in anticipation of a soldered 9900K or 9700K becoming available over the next 3 months or so.  Hope it all works out.

Bruceb

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Posted (edited)

I would rma the z370 motherboard as well and get a z390, but that’s just me. I understand a bios will make the new cpu compatible but still.

fly safe

 

Edited by mokeiko

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Posted (edited)
59 minutes ago, mokeiko said:

I would rma the z370 motherboard as well and get a z390, but that’s just me. I understand a bios will make the new cpu compatible but still.

fly safe

 

Agreed. the z370 bios upgrade is sort of a mild hack in my brain anyway . If something dies down the road there is always the niggling feeling, did the z370 bios upgrade ok??

Edited by zmak
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40 minutes ago, zmak said:

Agreed. the z370 bios upgrade is sort of a mild hack in my brain anyway . If something dies down the road there is always the niggling feeling, did the z370 bios upgrade ok??

Exactly.

fly safe

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I just got Fractal R6 chassis, preparing for a new build with 9900k :)

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2 hours ago, Johnny19 said:

I just got Fractal R6 chassis, preparing for a new build with 9900k 🙂

Good choice, my friend... the best case I've ever used.

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3 hours ago, dmiannay said:

Good choice, my friend... the best case I've ever used.

It'll be used first with my current build 🙂 thnx

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So guys if I9-9900K indeed sports solder I think I'll finally do the upgrade.  I'm still using a 6 y/o SB-E that works well but I wouldn't mind getting up to speed as it were.

If you will, what is a good motherboard from Asus for me.  I will likely only use one GPU but would like room for two if that's still happening!  I plan to use my old Coolermaster HAF-X case, my Sammy SSDs, but will replace my power supply and pick up 32G of whatever memory will work w/ this CPU.

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Posted (edited)

Noel - I, along with many others here at Avsim, have been very happy with the ASUS Maximus X Hero with our 8700k CPUs, which is the Z370 chipset.  The equivalent is likely the soon-to-be-released Maximus XI Hero (assumption) sporting the newer Z390 chipset.  The new 9xxx series CPUs are supposedly compatible with the Z370 chipset, but you're better off waiting for release of the Z390 chipset MBs, which will give you much better OC support with the 9xxx CPUs.

Edited by dmiannay
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3 minutes ago, dmiannay said:

Noel - I, along with many others here at Avsim, have been very happy with the ASUS Maximus X Hero with our 8700k CPUs, which is the Z370 chipset.  The equivalent is likely the soon-to-be-released Maximus XI Hero (assumption) sporting the newer Z390 chipset.  The new 9xxx series CPUs are supposedly compatible with the Z370 chipset, but you're better off waiting for release of the Z390 chipset MBs, which will give you much better OC support with the 9xxx CPUs.

Thanks for that!  While we're here, how about cooling methods for these new CPUs. I've used a Noctua D14 for my SB-E chip which has been great for that CPU.  I would consider water cooling as long as it's really reliable and can't leak!  

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7 minutes ago, Noel said:

...how about cooling methods for these new CPUs. I've used a Noctua D14 for my SB-E chip which has been great for that CPU.  I would consider water cooling as long as it's really reliable and can't leak!  

With your current cooling solution (the air conditioner) you really don't need water cooling.  Might think about upgrading to something like a NH-D15, though, if your case can handle it.

For those interested in the tech differences between the Z370 and Z390:

http://hexus.net/tech/news/mainboard/119525-intel-z390-chipset-expected-z370-rebrand/

https://techstunt.com/heres-how-intel-z390-is-better-than-the-z370-chipset/

Greg

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Thank you I think you are right because air cooler efficacy will probably benefit from low incoming ambient air temp a little more than a water cooled might.  Plus, I'm not after maximum clockspeed, instead somewhere just under that.

Also, for an ASUS motherboard I can see doing the Z390 when it arrives but what I want is something pretty simple but w/ great overclockability and durability overclocked.   I'm just going to be using one video card but would like room for 2 potentially, 32Gb of good ram, and I am going to be using SATA 3 SSDs.  Thanks Greg et al!

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2 hours ago, Noel said:

Thank you I think you are right because air cooler efficacy will probably benefit from low incoming ambient air temp a little more than a water cooled might.

No, water cooled will always perform better provided sufficient radiator specification for task at hand.  BUT, some air coolers can get close like the NH-D15 ... see 7:40 min mark in video below.  I have no idea what "Custom loop" was used when testing, hopefully spec'd correclty.

However, I would still always opt for water cooling or water chiller setup because it's expandable, flexible, doesn't require lots of room around the CPU, radiators can be placed just about anywhere (even externally) in a variety of sizes.  I've never had a single leak since my first Koolance unit going back to 2001 ... lost count of how many water cooled builds I've done since then (from servers to desktops).  Secret to leak free is tubing choice and fitting choice (avoid hardline as that more difficult to get a correct seal that will stand the test of time).  I prefer custom loops because I'm the "quality control" in their setup/build and not some "acceptable" level of failures like you'd see on an assembly line process.  Water cooling has really come a long way since 2001.

Cheers, Rob.

 

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Posted (edited)
35 minutes ago, Rob Ainscough said:

No, water cooled will always perform better provided sufficient radiator specification for task at hand.

Cheers, Rob.

 

But...what if...one has 44F air blowing gently directly into that air cooler, which when I do this now w/ my DH-14 peak core temps can drop into the low 40Cs on my SB-E @ 4.42Ghz w/ HT enabled whereas w/o this A/C augmentation would be running around 66-68C w/ the DH-14 at my typical 79F ambient house temp.  I don't need to run my A/C unit at full output so I adjust t to maintain core temps for P3D around 56C or so.  Given the information just provided, how much better w/ going to water cooling could I expect to get?  I'm thinking my temps now are probably better than what the average AIO water cooler can do, no?    

I can appreciate what your main point is, that given identical context water cooling with sufficient radiator will outperform air, but my situation is a little different, and I don't think the payoff would be worth it, though it is attractive to get rid of the bulky Noctua.   Can you recommend a model of complete water cooler w/ adequate radiator for my needs?  I'm aiming now at I9-9900K if it's soldered, or 9700K if that is soldered.

Edited by Noel

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