troyboy66

Newest Nvidia driver 398.82 issues

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2 hours ago, dmiannay said:

I updated to the same drivers (398.36) and have not experienced any stutters or decreased performance.  Not saying there isn't a problem with the drivers, just that I haven't experienced any with my setup.  Just flew PMDG 737NGX and all was smooth.

Did you mean 398.82, their latest driver? 398.36 is what I rolled back to and it what works perfect for me.

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46 minutes ago, pracines said:

All this talk of not updating drivers is almost always contrary to developers recommendations so.

Where do you consistently see devs recommending monthly GPU driver updates?

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I just finished a session with the new 398.82 driver without any drama.  Ran DDU in Windows safe mode, deleted Shader cache, reset the NVidia colors adjustment to suit my taste and so far all is well.

I do not update with every driver; rather, I probably do it once every six months or so.  This time the update was precipitated by an unexplained CTD of P3D following the pressing of the S key to change from VC to Spot view.  Very unusual so I figured the easy first thing to do was update driver.  Never know what changes are made to accommodate Windows Weirdness.

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Posted (edited)

Scenario that has been taking place for over 30 years of home computer flight sim users:

User 1 updates to the newest video drivers, then reports "a problem" with them.  Other users reply that they updated same drivers and don't have the same "problem" on their computer(s).  Other-Other users subsequently report they updated the drivers and do experience the same problem reported by User 1.  Entire community begins a discussion thread about the new driver that will end up being 20+ pages long and not solve most of the end-users problems they are having.

Real Solution:  The driver ALWAYS comes with "Release Notes" which can even be reviewed by the user BEFORE downloading the new driver.  In this case, the link is on the nVidia download page for the driver.  It's called, "Game Ready Driver Release Notes (v398.82)" and is approximately 33 pages long.  I just reviewed it for fun and found no references in the updates that would improve performance in FSX, P3D, or any other flight sim product.  I also found at least SIX references to updates in the driver that MIGHT cause "stutters" or "frame rate" issues (and those words are used BY THE DRIVER MANUFACTURER).

Bottom Line:  The end user needs to read these Release Notes PRIOR to installing the updated drivers.  The plethora of hardware configurations and Operating System updates on computers will NEVER allow a driver update to work on EVERY possible computer configuration out there.  Some people will experience NO issues with the driver update, while others WILL have "problems" after installing it.  The best TWO PRACTICES you can have are.....

1.  NEVER do a driver update without having a way to GET BACK to the previous driver you were using that didn't cause problems for you.  

2.  DON'T do a driver update if the Release Notes don't indicate YOUR computer configuration actually NEEDS the update.  This requires a level of knowledge by the end user about what works and won't work on their OWN computer.

I did Network Ops on computer systems for over 3 decades.  An IT department KNOWS what will work and won't work on it's end user computers connected to the network.  We can update hundreds or thousands of computer drivers all at the same time and cause NO problems 'cos we control what is allowed (hardware and software) on EVERY end user's computer.  Home computer users need to know themselves whether a driver update may or may not "hose" their own computer.  So if you aren't sure, use the TWO PRACTICES above.  You can TRY Number 2 if you want to, but ONLY if you are SURE you could do Number 1 if it craps out your computer.  And regardless, expect the driver to work for SOME or even MOST users, but NEVER for ALL users because of the wide range of different computer configurations in home user computers.

Edited by FalconAF
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18 minutes ago, Greggy_D said:

Where do you consistently see devs recommending monthly GPU driver updates?

Well specifically Lockheed Martins general debugging steps, since the topic is P3D https://www.prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6312&t=123246

Quoting the specific: 

2) Fully update your system. This should include running Windows Update and updating any drivers to the newest version. It is critical that the newest graphics card drivers are installed on your system.
 

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1 minute ago, pracines said:

Well specifically Lockheed Martins general debugging steps

What if there is nothing to debug?  You know that is only for people having issues.

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, Greggy_D said:

What if there is nothing to debug?  You know that is only for people having issues.

^^^^^^^^^

What Greggy said.  LM's recommendation is for DEBUGGING an EXISTING problem.  It shouldn't be (and I hope isn't) a generic recommendation that EVERY computer user of their product should ALWAYS update to a new GPU driver "just because it was released".  For some users, THAT is what will put them in a "debugging my computer that doesn't work now" scenario. 

Case in point:  The LM recommendation ALSO says the user should install ALL Windows Updates along with updating the GPU driver.  But we all know there are users here who still refuse to install Windows Updates for whatever "personal" reasons they may have.  Well, in that case, updating to a new GPU driver that EXPECTS the user to have the latest Windows Updates installed MAY actually trash your graphics display.  READ THE RELEASE NOTES for the driver.  Sometimes they will tell you what version of the OS you need to have FIRST before trying to use the updated driver.

Edited by FalconAF

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20 minutes ago, FalconAF said:

^^^^^^^^^

What Greggy said.  LM's recommendation is for DEBUGGING an EXISTING problem.  It shouldn't be (and I hope isn't) a generic recommendation that EVERY computer user of their product should ALWAYS update to a new GPU driver "just because it was released".  For some users, THAT is what will put them in a "debugging my computer that doesn't work now" scenario. 

Case in point:  The LM recommendation ALSO says the user should install ALL Windows Updates along with updating the GPU driver.  But we all know there are users here who still refuse to install Windows Updates for whatever "personal" reasons they may have.  Well, in that case, updating to a new GPU driver that EXPECTS the user to have the latest Windows Updates installed MAY actually trash your graphics display.  READ THE RELEASE NOTES for the driver.  Sometimes they will tell you what version of the OS you need to have FIRST before trying to use the updated driver.

In other words LM disagrees with you. I do too 🙂

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41 minutes ago, Greggy_D said:

What if there is nothing to debug?  You know that is only for people having issues.

We could go in circles about this. Lets not.

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Posted (edited)

 

Quote

UPDATE: I have since uninstall/reinstall older driver and all is back to normal.

Just for informational purposes, what version drivers did you revert back to??

mike

PS — never mind,, I just spotted your subsequent post re: 398.36

Edited by orbmis

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The bottom line is if you are a simmer and you want to be a beta tester for the brand new driver, on your sim, go for it. Let us know how it works out. 

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, troyboy66 said:

Did you mean 398.82, their latest driver? 398.36 is what I rolled back to and it what works perfect for me.

Yes, my mistake.  I updated to 398.82 and all is well with P3D.

Edited by dmiannay

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7 hours ago, FalconAF said:

... "Game Ready Driver Release Notes (v398.82)" and is approximately 33 pages long.  I just reviewed it for fun and found no references in the updates that would improve performance in FSX, P3D, or any other flight sim product.  I also found at least SIX references to updates in the driver that MIGHT cause "stutters" or "frame rate" issues (and those words are used BY THE DRIVER MANUFACTURER). ...

FSX and P3D are not in the focus of NV driver architects and you won't find it mentioned in many driver release notes if at all. Does this mean that P3D/FSX cannot profit from any new NV driver?  IMO there is nothing wrong to install new drivers as long as I know how to roll back.

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The problem not yet mentioned here: nasty Little bloatware like Geforce Experience will annoy you daily as soon as a new driver is out and you do not update. Either by a explicit message or by adding a mark in your taskbar. So yes, you do not NEED to update to the newest driver, but sometimes it gets annoying not to. And yes, Geforce Experience is needed for certain aspects such as Shadowplay.

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I assume that is only if you have Windows 10 installed. I am using Windows 7 Home Premium with the 368.22 drivers, and I do not get any annoying messages about anything.

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