who stole the plane

[Orlaam 306]

4 hours ago, JRMurray said:

On another note, I'm curious about two comments he made. One concerned his vomiting. IIRC, at one point, he responded to ATC by telling them that he had just thrown up. I'm wondering what might have caused that: some of his (maybe) sudden control inputs, perhaps? The second comment concerns his wondering how to pressurize the Q400: he mentioned that he was feeling 'lightheaded," as he put it. From the looks of the video I've seen and from what I've heard of his interactions with ATC, it doesn't appear that he was at altitudes whereby he would need pressurization.

Well he mentioned having a beer in one distant recording.  Someone posted a YouTube link and he mentions a beer.  He says something like "I think I might have to..."  un-key Tx, then re-key "..my beer"  (Start at 3:42 to here the beer comment)

Combine the drinking, unstable flight and anxiety/stress, it's a no wonder he vomited.  He knew this was it and death was imminent. 

Edited August 12, 2018 by Orlaam

[SimSlim 5]

6 hours ago, JRMurray said:

...at one point, he responded to ATC by telling them that he had just thrown up

... how to pressurize the Q400 ... mentioned feeling 'lightheaded

I attribute both of these to his mental state.  He probably had an enormous adrenaline rush taking off and now here he was zipping about Puget Sound in a powerful and light turboprop for his first and last time. That's enough stomach turning to make someone throw up some.

And yes, he didn't have enough altitude to be deprived of oxygen but the aforementioned state of mind could easily make him feel lightheaded.

[jon b 2,041]

6 hours ago, KevinAu said:

I actually think not having any flight experience is an advantage to doing wild maneuvers in a plane. Because you won’t have any built in restraints with the controls. You just don’t know what you can’t do. The air combat experience places have said their customers with no flight experience tend to win more compared to customers who are pilots, since they dont have the same inhibitions to wildly throwing a stick around as the pilots do.

Yes, I think your probably right there.

Not being flippant with this comment, but if the poor guy had no experience he made it look easy, that was some fancy flying.

I suspect from his fuel burn comments and manoeuvres he just firewalled the power levers and left them there, probably overspending and overstressing the airframe on numerous occasions.

The FDR playback will be of great interest.

Poor guy,

[Chock 17,769]

As usual, the level of ignorance in some of the media reports about this incident is embarrassing. Among the stupid/inaccurate/just plain lazy copy I've read related to this incident includes it being described as 'a jet', the guy being described as 'a mechanic', the aeroplane having 'hovered over the water', the aeroplane being 'started up with the push of a button' and it apparently 'demonstrating how easy it would be for a terrorist to crash a plane onto a city'.

Fortunately, this sort of thing is not one of those stories which sensationalist journalists and their editors regard as having 'legs', so it'll be off their pages by tomorrow in favour of some other story they doubtless also won't bother to report accurately either.

[mwilk 1,106]

40 minutes ago, Chock said:

As usual, the level of ignorance in some of the media reports about this incident is embarrassing. Among the stupid/inaccurate/just plain lazy copy I've read related to this incident includes it being described as 'a jet', the guy being described as 'a mechanic', the aeroplane having 'hovered over the water', the aeroplane being 'started up with the push of a button' and it apparently 'demonstrating how easy it would be for a terrorist to crash a plane onto a city'.

Fortunately, this sort of thing is not one of those stories which sensationalist journalists and their editors regard as having 'legs', so it'll be off their pages by tomorrow in favour of some other story they doubtless also won't bother to report accurately either.

I've purposely avoided reading too much about this incident knowing that most of it would be ill informed. I spent my entire adult life as an airline employee with the majority of that time as a fleet service agent. Most of what has been reported about the day to day operation at an airport is utter rubbish. 

[Chock 17,769]

I've been on both sides of it myself. I worked as a writer for a newspaper for many years and I work on the ramp these days, so I'm in the relatively unique position of knowing exactly what rubbish newspapers come out with from personal experience, and how much of it will be utter nonsense in relation to this incident, this also from personal experience.

Despite what is being said, to me it's not at all surprising that someone working on the ramp was pretty clued up about aeroplanes and was able to get one going and airborne; it is the kind of job which would attract people who are into that stuff. Although I've got a pilot's license, that itself isn't common among people I work with, but having said that, several people who work with me on the ramp are undeniably very knowledgeable about aeroplanes and their systems, one or two are actually in the process of applying to fly for airlines. Not everyone I work with is like that of course, some wouldn't have the first clue about flying an airliner, but there definitely some who could get one up in the air if they wanted to.

[Adrian123 1,015]

Only thing proven is the poor state of Mental illness in America today and its just keeps getting amplified!

[Christopher Low 5,341]

Quote

I think I'm gonna try and do a barrel role, and if that goes good....I'm just gonna nose down, and call it a night

I can't know for certain exactly what he meant here, but hearing him say those words makes me sad

Edited August 12, 2018 by Christopher Low

[vgbaron 3,508]

18 minutes ago, Christopher Low said:

I can't know for certain exactly what he meant here, but hearing him say those words makes me sad

I had the same feeling Christopher.

Vic

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Christopher Low said:

I can't know for certain exactly what he meant here, but hearing him say those words makes me sad

Me too. Definitely the most poignant bit of his RT - after his apologies to his family and loved ones.

RIP.

Edited August 12, 2018 by Guest

[Orlaam 306]

8 hours ago, Adrian123 said:

Only thing proven is the poor state of Mental illness in America today and its just keeps getting amplified!

How so?  How is it any different than in previous decades?  Nothing has changed; People are just more aware due to the internet and lots of misinformation.  It's actually very aggravating when I see discussion online about mental health.  This is my field and people who have no clue are ranting about mental illness. 

These stories aren't new...

https://www.warhistoryonline.com/war-articles/a-stolen-military-plane-in-1969.html

https://www.nytimes.com/1988/05/26/us/death-ends-1600-mile-flight-of-learjet-stolen-by-mechanic.html

Plus I posted some others a page or so back. 🙄

 

Edited August 12, 2018 by Orlaam

[John_Cillis 2,406]

16 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

How so?  How is it any different than in previous decades?  Nothing has changed; People are just more aware due to the internet and lots of misinformation.  It's actually very aggravating when I see discussion online about mental health.  This is my field and people who have no clue are ranting about mental illness. 

I studied Psychology in college, had to since I was bent on becoming a teacher some day.  Early on in the course, our professor, Napa Valley College's Professor Paterson, wonderful man, told us we all are born with a few screws loose, even he claimed to have a few screws loose, it was normal.  It was a good ice breaker, to let us know he accepted we had challenges, and that is probably how he kept his students sane and focused, sly man that he was.  He had to be close to seventy, and he could run up the auditorium steps to get close to a student asking a question, and he knew us all by name.  He was a combination of professor Kingsfield from the Paper Chase, and every good teacher you could ever imagine.  Our second class each week was a smaller lab where he one on one helped us understand ourselves, others, and what hurts others.  And he reminded us that were we to become a Psychologist or Psychiatrist we would feel pain, that is a normal part of therapy and the therapist.  As an instructor I had to apply what I learned, and I was a systems instructor, I knew how business systems intimidated my students, especially the women.

What could have been going thru this poor guy's head I do not know but I suspect he felt very alone from the tone of his voice, and loneliness inside will drive people to madness and to do bizarre things.  Our technology in this world, cell phones, TV's, video games, etc can distance us from human contact, make us self center, and then we realize we are isolated, thank goodness for the forums we have so we can reach out to one another.

John

[Ident 198]

The one thing I think about aside from all the normal stuff that is being talked about is the fact of what that must of felt like to a novice person flying a plane inverted. I mean those are long barrel rolls that I see on the video links and so he must of really been strapped in. The weird feeling that must of been just blows my mind. You know you are doing something illegal, you know you are most likely not going to be able to land normally, you are most likely gonna die, you have people trying to talk sense to you and then to go and man handle a plane to get inverted and then bring it out of that only to then focus again on the fact that you might of had skills that mean nothing because you're gonna die.

Some other questions I have is what headset was he using..I mean dont pilots bring their own? So where did the headset come from? Also how did he get on the controller freq? Trying to hand fly a Dash and then work the comm to dial in the right freq on the correct radio yet doesnt know how to use the auto pilot?! You would think the last radio freq used would be GND and TWR so where or how did he get up on APP?

[188AHC 2,138]

Come on guys. No more personal attacks or retorts. This topic has been fairly civil and it is a  sensitive issue.  Please don't get it locked. 

[Orlaam 306]

55 minutes ago, Cactus521 said:

I studied Psychology in college, had to since I was bent on becoming a teacher some day.  Early on in the course, our professor, Napa Valley College's Professor Paterson, wonderful man, told us we all are born with a few screws loose, even he claimed to have a few screws loose, it was normal.  It was a good ice breaker, to let us know he accepted we had challenges, and that is probably how he kept his students sane and focused, sly man that he was.  He had to be close to seventy, and he could run up the auditorium steps to get close to a student asking a question, and he knew us all by name.  He was a combination of professor Kingsfield from the Paper Chase, and every good teacher you could ever imagine.  Our second class each week was a smaller lab where he one on one helped us understand ourselves, others, and what hurts others.  And he reminded us that were we to become a Psychologist or Psychiatrist we would feel pain, that is a normal part of therapy and the therapist.  As an instructor I had to apply what I learned, and I was a systems instructor, I knew how business systems intimidated my students, especially the women.

What could have been going thru this poor guy's head I do not know but I suspect he felt very alone from the tone of his voice, and loneliness inside will drive people to madness and to do bizarre things.  Our technology in this world, cell phones, TV's, video games, etc can distance us from human contact, make us self center, and then we realize we are isolated, thank goodness for the forums we have so we can reach out to one another.

John

Thank goodness for the forums, however, you get replies like the one below who simply chides for an avatar pic, rather than contribute to a discussion. 

I've worked in acute care mental health for over 6 years.  I have worked crisis (emergency), outpatient, inpatient (dual diagnosis and SMI).  As an RN I deal directly with patients when things are going south in the milieu.  BHTs are not usually very well trained, nor do many of them care to intervene.  The SW and therapists stay in their office.  I have seen plenty in that time, considered short or not to some.  I even worked at the state mental hospital forensic unit, where GEI (guilty expect insane) patients reside.  Most of the commentary on the web is thrown out by common laypersons with no experience or real in depth knowledge in mental health. 

You are correct, the internet has isolated people and perpetuated those who are prone to ruminating on fantasies, therefore acting on them.  The glorification of these acts leads to copycats.  From what I hear, this guy had been drinking.  He was disinhibited and possibly hypomanic.  No way to know beyond that.  The notion that mental illness is somehow worse than before is asinine.  I wish people would stop promoting that idea.