who stole the plane

[John_Cillis 2,406]

28 minutes ago, Orlaam said:

Thank goodness for the forums, however, you get replies like the one below who simply chides for an avatar pic, rather than contribute to a discussion. 

I've worked in acute care mental health for over 6 years.  I have worked crisis (emergency), outpatient, inpatient (dual diagnosis and SMI).  As an RN I deal directly with patients when things are going south in the milieu.  BHTs are not usually very well trained, nor do many of them care to intervene.  The SW and therapists stay in their office.  I have seen plenty in that time, considered short or not to some.  I even worked at the state mental hospital forensic unit, where GEI (guilty expect insane) patients reside.  Most of the commentary on the web is thrown out by common laypersons with no experience or real in depth knowledge in mental health. 

You are correct, the internet has isolated people and perpetuated those who are prone to ruminating on fantasies, therefore acting on them.  The glorification of these acts leads to copycats.  From what I hear, this guy had been drinking.  He was disinhibited and possibly hypomanic.  No way to know beyond that.  The notion that mental illness is somehow worse than before is asinine.  I wish people would stop promoting that idea.

The College I went to, Napa Valley College, was across from Napa State Hospital so they had a strong nursing program, though that was not my route, I had the benefit of good instructors in Psychological and Health Education, I have never met a nurse, male or female, I did not like, they drive the hospitals, they know their patients anguish when they are ill, and I try in the few hospitalizations I have had to be a good patient, I tease them pretending they are hurting me so much with their needles, I cry for Mommy, get them to laugh and enjoy what they do.  I have stayed close to many of my former nurses.  Ask me to remember my doctors, I can only remember my childhood doctor in Chicago, Dr. Delgado, but I remember every nurse, male and female, I have ever had.

I was hospitalized with pancreatitis almost two decades ago, and discovered the male nurse was the brother of one of my hotel clients in Carlsbad New Mexico, and I had hit it off with that client as I always did, working hard for her (the hotel owner/manager).  I discovered this because the nurse, who first tried morphine on me for the pain then switched to Demerol, was walking me thru my pain and asking me questions about what I did for a living, when I told him I was a hotel business systems instructor for Best Western he told me about his sister in Carlsbad.  Small world, he treated me again when I had a heat stroke some years ago, remembered me.  God bless you all, mental and physical health workers, from the nurses to the janitors to the food delivery people to the doctors, you heal, and we remember you!

John

[JRBarrett 3,034]

1 hour ago, Ident said:

Some other questions I have is what headset was he using..I mean dont pilots bring their own? So where did the headset come from? Also how did he get on the controller freq? Trying to hand fly a Dash and then work the comm to dial in the right freq on the correct radio yet doesnt know how to use the auto pilot?! You would think the last radio freq used would be GND and TWR so where or how did he get up on APP?

Many aircraft carry at least one or two generic spare headsets to use if one of the pilots’ personal headsets fail.

As far as the radio communications — as a tow-certified ramp agent, Mr. Russell would have been fully trained in radio communications as part of his job. Anyone towing aircraft outside of a non-movement area has to be in contact with ground control, and receive a clearance to enter taxiways, cross runways etc. He was probably quite familiar with radio procedures and the frequencies in use at SEA.

Almost all airports require anyone certified to drive vehicles on the airside to undergo airport driver’s training that includes classes in taxiway and runway markings, right-of-way rules, light gun signals, radio communications etc.

He was an airside airport worker for almost 4 years, and undoubtedly was able to pick up a lot of knowledge in that time, especially if he was motivated to learn. It’s not like he was a “civilian” who snuck in through a hole in the airport fence who had never even touched a real aircraft before.

[Orlaam 306]

57 minutes ago, Cactus521 said:

The College I went to, Napa Valley College, was across from Napa State Hospital so they had a strong nursing program, though that was not my route, I had the benefit of good instructors in Psychological and Health Education, I have never met a nurse, male or female, I did not like, they drive the hospitals, they know their patients anguish when they are ill, and I try in the few hospitalizations I have had to be a good patient, I tease them pretending they are hurting me so much with their needles, I cry for Mommy, get them to laugh and enjoy what they do.  I have stayed close to many of my former nurses.  Ask me to remember my doctors, I can only remember my childhood doctor in Chicago, Dr. Delgado, but I remember every nurse, male and female, I have ever had.

I was hospitalized with pancreatitis almost two decades ago, and discovered the male nurse was the brother of one of my hotel clients in Carlsbad New Mexico, and I had hit it off with that client as I always did, working hard for her (the hotel owner/manager).  I discovered this because the nurse, who first tried morphine on me for the pain then switched to Demerol, was walking me thru my pain and asking me questions about what I did for a living, when I told him I was a hotel business systems instructor for Best Western he told me about his sister in Carlsbad.  Small world, he treated me again when I had a heat stroke some years ago, remembered me.  God bless you all, mental and physical health workers, from the nurses to the janitors to the food delivery people to the doctors, you heal, and we remember you!

John

Thanks John!  We don't get much feedback.  I have a few positive reviews from patients and was even stopped once at a coffee shop miles away from an old job.  The guy wanted to say thanks.  Kinda shocking.  I've been in healthcare now for 19 years, behavioral for 6+.  I hope your interactions continue to be good in any future encounters.  Some doctors and nurses aren't very nice.  I know I've had some that weren't.

[rtodepart 761]

Here in the states if you ever had the chance to work the ramp on a cargo side of some US airports you know that at times you are free to hang really close to parked AC and none of your coworkers are even looking for you at all . Even from the building next to you if anyone sees you pushing back a plane without wingwalkers APU on or even a Beacon on they wont question you at all becasue they asume you are doing your thing or just moving a AC to another space on the ramp to make space for another AC ... someone with the guts and watching a few M Q400 videos and taking some notes can pull the start up and taxi ops deal .....

[Orlaam 306]

So another recent audio clip has been released, and he essentially mentions spending 2 hours to get it started.  I think he positioned it for taxi then went in the pit for close to 2 hours while figuring it out and getting it running.  He could have easily pulled up video on a phone of start up and followed along.  It's at the very beginning.  And he also mentions more than once that he has no idea how to operate the plane.  No idea what power levers should set to or how to program any AP or systems.  His knowledge was very limited.

 

[CFIJose 5,485]

GMA is sticking to their "he learned how to fly playing video games" story. It's pathetic!

[Murmur 3,941]

3 hours ago, Orlaam said:

So another recent audio clip has been released, and he essentially mentions spending 2 hours to get it started.  I think he positioned it for taxi then went in the pit for close to 2 hours while figuring it out and getting it running.  He could have easily pulled up video on a phone of start up and followed along.  It's at the very beginning.  And he also mentions more than once that he has no idea how to operate the plane.  No idea what power levers should set to or how to program any AP or systems.  His knowledge was very limited.

This is very interesting. Very limited knowledge of aircrafts systems and controls, and yet he powered it up, taxied, took off and did a barrel roll. One wonders what an experienced simmer using a study-level product could do.

[CYXR 257]

12 hours ago, Orlaam said:

 From what I hear, this guy had been drinking.  He was disinhibited and possibly hypomanic.  No way to know beyond that.  

Hearsay is not valid evidence to form a diagnosis of substance abuse. There is presently no evidence that the victim was disinhibited by ethanol abuse. And at this stage there is no evidence regarding the state of mind of the deceased. Recordings posted on social media outside a chain of custody are not evidence. They can be tampered with and weaponized; for civil liability insurance purposes in this instance. The evidence in this matter is in the sole custody of the investigators who are involved in finding, analysing and interpreting it.

Let's hope that this investigation will help all who are involved in aviation to avoid such tragedies in the future.     

ben

[n4gix 4,947]

I'm curious how he managed to taxi to the runway and then takeoff without apparently being challenged by the tower...

[scottb613 1,186]

49 minutes ago, n4gix said:

I'm curious how he managed to taxi to the runway and then takeoff without apparently being challenged by the tower...

Hi Bill,

The tape I heard had him challenged repeatedly - he just didn't respond...

Regards,
Scott

[fluffyflops 1,845]

4 hours ago, scottb613 said:

Hi Bill,

The tape I heard had him challenged repeatedly - he just didn't respond...

Regards,
Scott

I believe they challenged him when we was at the holding point not on the taxi ??

Weve had it a few times at my airline that the radios  on the a/c where knackered when they where taxiing out and the tower couldn't get hold of them (but the aircraft behind could hear the tower).  Its at that point we get a telephone call in the ops room to advise us we normally acars them to advise or call the company phone on the aircraft. 

Id say we probably get a couple of calls a month with lost radio comms in mid flight.  Same again, acars and call on the sat phone.  This stuff does happen.   

[charliearon 3,017]

5 hours ago, n4gix said:

I'm curious how he managed to taxi to the runway and then takeoff without apparently being challenged by the tower...

Bill, I got 5 bucks that says he took off from a taxiway!  Any takers??😱

[Wise87 1,275]

9 minutes ago, charliearon said:

Bill, I got 5 bucks that says he took off from a taxiway!  Any takers??😱

I may be wrong but wasn’t it already stated it was off Runway 16C. It’s in the ATC audio tapes. 

 

Edited August 13, 2018 by Wise87

[Orlaam 306]

10 hours ago, CYXR said:

Hearsay is not valid evidence to form a diagnosis of substance abuse. There is presently no evidence that the victim was disinhibited by ethanol abuse. And at this stage there is no evidence regarding the state of mind of the deceased. Recordings posted on social media outside a chain of custody are not evidence. They can be tampered with and weaponized; for civil liability insurance purposes in this instance. The evidence in this matter is in the sole custody of the investigators who are involved in finding, analysing and interpreting it.

Let's hope that this investigation will help all who are involved in aviation to avoid such tragedies in the future.     

ben

Speculation is not a Dx.  Substance abuse is a chronic disorder, unlike a binge.  I guarantee he was on EOTH, and we will find that out at some point.  I stick to my original theory.

[tf51d 284]

Well there's one point in the ATC recording, where he had to be instructed on how to pressurize the aircraft, that tells me he did not learn from a Flight Sim, at least not with any of the complex models like the Majestic Q400 or X-Planes FlyJSim Q400. If he had he would have known how to do that himself.

Edited August 14, 2018 by tf51d