SPAD.neXt and X52

[Rusty Gunz 2]

I am running the trial version of SPAD.neXt 0.9.6.025 (the "latest" version).  I am also using Logitech software version 8.0.213.0 for creating profiles used by my X52 Pro H.O.T.A.S.  I can load the profile I prefer (and spent many, many hours developing) then start FSX-SE.  My joystick works exactly as I have programmed it.  I do not have an active Multipanel or Radio Panel, naturally, because I have not yet started SPAD.neXt.

FSX-SE functions just as you would expect with no problems.  I then start SPAD.neXt to activate the flight panels.  Once it starts, the displays on the flight panels are visible and function in their basic mode (I have not yet configured any changes to them with SPAD.neXt).  However, my joystick now no longer functions according to the loaded profile.  FSX-SE does respond to control surface commands, but the button programming I so diligently created has disappeared.  Some of the buttons do have functions but I am not sure what they all do as I have only tried a few as a test.

If I exit SPAD.neXt, I still have no Logitech profile functionality from the X52.  In fact, once SPAD.neXt has been activated, the X52 loses the profile functionality and it cannot be restored without restarting the PC.  This is true even if I exit SPAD.neXt and try to use FSX-SE, either by leaving it running or by closing and restarting it.  Unplugging the X52 and plugging it back in has no effect either.

My pre-SPAD.neXt research found mentions of deleting the Logitech drivers before using SPAD.neXt, but I'm not sure how to do that.  I also understood that SPAD.neXt would work with the X52 without changes.  Apparently this is not the case (unless you count the VERY basic functions I mentioned above).  I know I can access the X52 in the Controller menu of SPAD.neXt, but I really don't want to start over with the programming of it to suit my needs.  AND I don't even know how to do that, as I can find no detailed documentation concerning the programming of ANY device with SPAD.neXt.  Yes, there are Youtube videos about how to make SPAD.neXt do this or that but nothing that explains the relationship between LVARs, Events, Actions, Data, etc.  Most of the videos are concerned with things that are not of interest to me anyway.

Having been a programmer in a former life, I know from experience that "trial and error" is an excrutiatingly slow method of learning a new "programming language" - training and/or a manual are greatly preferred.

Is there anyone who can explain to me what I'm doing wrong re: SPAD.neXt, X52 and FSX-SE?  Is there anyone who can explain to me the relationship that I mentioned earlier?  And finally, is there any sort of detailed documentation beyond the "Getting Started" for SPAD.neXt?

I have been simming since the Apple II and Sub-Logic and have found our "fraternity" to be very understanding, generous and helpful to one another.  I'm hoping that will be the case here also.  It is not my intent to belittle anyone or any product, though there have been a few over the years that deserved it.  I'm just looking for information and help.

Ken in Kansas

P.S.  Just before posting this, I found a video on the SPAD.neXt channel entitled SPAD.neXt 0.9: What's new Part #2 (Event configuration).  Hopefully it will answer some of the questions I listed in my post.

Edited November 14, 2018 by Rusty Gunz

[fppilot 4,371]

My first advice is that if editing your post is still available that you clean up the references to Spad (one product) and Spad.Next (a totally different product).  It appears to me that all of your references should be to Spad.Next. Please clean up those references. That will increase the quality of responses.

I have also spent hours and hours with Spad.Next and a simplistic Saitek Pro Cessna Yoke and Saitek Multipanel setup with a host of different add-on aircraft.  My best working arrangement is, to my best knowledge, with Saitek drivers dated about three months after Windows 10 was officially released (August 2015?), Spad.Next, and with a comprehensive war against Windows Advanced Power Management.  Your issue(s) could be due to any one, or all of these.

I have relentlessly written messages of advice here in regard to Windows Advanced Power Management. The most recent likely only two weeks or so ago.  I do not wish to continue writing new duplicatory messages of advice when my previous advice is already out there.  Please take your time to seek out and find it and apply it. WPM may be at time intervals reducing or shutting off power to your Saitek USB connected devices.  It may or may not be the issue you are encountering but it is a well known influencer of issues and certainly worth your time and effort to investigate.  Just know it was the root of all of my issues and issues reported by others, and I am now issue free.

Edited November 14, 2018 by fppilot

[Rusty Gunz 2]

Frank,

Edits made per your request.

The Windows 7 Device Manager shows no Power Management tab for the X52 (HID) entry or the X52 (USB) entry in the Human Interface Devices list.

Will the SaitekUSBFix application work considering that I updated the original Saitek software to the Logitech software for the X52 (since it is now a Logitech product)?

Ken in Kansas

[Rusty Gunz 2]

I have checked all USB & HID entries in the Windows 7 Device Manager.  None that have a Power Management tab were set to allow the computer to turn off the device.  However, while researching the whole Windows  Power Management scenario outlined by Frank, I came across a post that mentioned a problem when using a USB hub for a device.

"Aha!", I said to myself, "I have my X52 plugged in to a hub, don't I?".  "Why, yes I do", I replied, "maybe I should move it to a free USB port on the PC.".  So I did.  In addition, I started SPAD.neXt and disabled support for all devices I either don't have or don't want SPAD.neXt to "control".  (I learned of this capability while watching the video mentioned in the P.S. of my original post.)  I then saved that information and exited SPAD.neXt.

I rebooted the PC (always a good idea when making changes of this sort), waited till all the startup procedures, etc. had quieted down, loaded my X52 profile using the Logitech software and started FSX-SE.  As expected, the X52 functioned as desired without any problem.  No panels active yet since SPAD.neXt had not been started.  So far, so good.

I started SPAD.neXt.  The first thing I noticed was the absence of the Controllers option on the menu bar.  Thinking to myself that this was a good thing since I disabled all joystick support, I looked at my panels to see if they lived - all lights on and panels responding to button pushes and knob turnings.  So far, so good.

Now the "acid test". I returned to the X52 and started using buttons and toggles which had been configured in the loaded profile.  Houston, we have liftoff!  The X52 performed all functions of the loaded profile without exception!

BUT, could this be a fluke?  Enquiring minds want to know, so I duplicated the entire procedure.  I moved the X52 back to the hub, rebooted, started all the apps and experienced the original problem.  I returned the X52 to the PC's USB port, rebooted and was able to, once again, successfully use the X52-FSX-SPAD.neXt combo.

At this point, I'm a happy camper.  I need to purchase and register SPAD.neXt now, then I need to get a USB extension cable - the short X52 cable being the reason for connecting it to the hub in the first place.

Sign on my door now reads "Gone flying."

Ken in Kansas

[fppilot 4,371]

44 minutes ago, Rusty Gunz said:

Sign on my door now reads "Gone flying."

Great news!

Did you ever apply the SaitekUSBFix ?  It advises you of results.  Will say # of items fixed or something similar.

Per success on bypassing the hub.  Advanced Power Management may be affecting the hub itself. See if you can locate it in Device Manager. May need something plugged into it, then unplug and replug the hub and see if you can ID it that way.

The reason I mentioned these two steps is that if you have not done both it is possible you may still experience an issue mid-flight.  What was happening to me back in late 2015 was just that.  It was with a newly build system and Windows 10, and before Saitek provided Windows 10 drivers.  My Saitek Pro Cessna Yoke and Saitek Multipanel would go AWOL during flight.  Very noticeable as the LED display in the Multipanel would go very dim.  The yoke axis es would work, but none of the selectors on the panel or switches on the yoke would respond.  I had the Multipanel plugged into the built in USB hub (not powered) on the yoke.  The yoke in turn was plugged into a powered USB hub

My first attempt to cure the issue was to order a Saitek power supply for the yoke.  That not only did not solve the issue, for some reason it only made it worse.  It actually caused the Multipanel to stay dim at all times.  During preflight if I plugged the power supply into the yoke the panel would go dim.  If I unplugged it, the panel would come bright again.  Made no sense.  I was plugging the yoke itself into a powered USB 3.0 hub. I was advised to avoid using a 3.0 hub with the yoke, so I plugged it into a direct USB 2.0 port on the computer. Even that did not solve the problem.

Then I found a reference to the SaitekUSBFix on the Spad.Next web site, along with instructions on disabling Advanced Power Management for the devices in Control Panel/Device Manager.  After taking those two steps everything came alive, and stayed alive.  I could then plug the yoke into the USB 3.0 hub. No problem.  And I could also plug the Multipanel into the built in hub on the yoke, and that without the yoke's external power supply.

Happily Ever After?  Not quite.

I sincerely hope you have chased away your gremlins!

Once a month I clone my system SSD to a similar capacity SSD that I can put into a plug-and-play bay. That primary system SSD contains of course the system, including drivers and device settings.  As the last step in that cloning process I verify that the clone will boot the system.  For some reason, after I remove the clone and revert back to the primary system disk, I find that I need to disable Advanced Power Management once again with the fix and with Device Manager changes.

This may also occur with Windows Updates. So I recommend keeping the fix and Device Manager instructions handy. And one last thing to other users reading this.  I had the issues described on a Windows 7 system as well before building the Windows 10 system.

Edited November 14, 2018 by fppilot

[Rusty Gunz 2]

Quote

Did you ever apply the SaitekUSBFix ?  It advises you of results.  Will say # of items fixed or something similar.

Never found a site that had the fix executable file.  Even searched the SPAD.neXt site with no success.

Also: 

Quote

I have checked all USB & HID entries in the Windows 7 Device Manager.  None that have a Power Management tab were set to allow the computer to turn off the device.

So, for now, I'm going to consider this matter closed - unless something else jumps up and bites me in the ---

May your number of landings always equal your number of takeoffs.

Ken in Kansas

[blaunarwal 432]

The USB fix Software can be found here

http://uraster.com/de-ch/produkte/usbenhancedpowermanagerdisabler.aspx