P3DV4.4 - Tweaks to CFG, Why?

[Langyboy63 22]

30 minutes ago, JoeFackel said:

Do you have HT ON or OFF? With HT ON i wouldn't recommend 252 but 4052.
For HT OFF its a good setting you can try.

So HT on =4052 (which is what I will try

HT off= 252. I will not use HT off so will not use this.

I will see what happens with this.

[JoeFackel 760]

2 minutes ago, Langyboy63 said:

So HT on =4052 (which is what I will try

HT off= 252. I will not use HT off so will not use this.

I will see what happens with this.

That was for Davids 9900K, not for your CPU, you said you have the same like me, than use 253.

[AAN1718A 20]

10 hours ago, joepoway said:

The tweaks discussed here and the ones in Rob’s thread are not like the tweaks of the past they are to used by folks with powerful GPUs and more importantly lots of VRAM on their GPUs at least 8Gb but more likely greater than 8Gb. I believe LM doesn’t want to put these in the user interface yet because most people don’t have these GPUs and it would cause more issues than it’s worth. I for one am glad they have embedded the handles in the config file for those with the top of the line hardware to experiment with!

Joe

I would argue that for those with the higher end hardware, LM should have settings/sliders etc. for those options. You can just as easily turn it off if you neither need it or want it on. If all these tweaks are viable and usable and even sanctioned by LM, why not add them to the options. I would rather have that then constantly edit the CFG file.

[Langyboy63 22]

Thanks Joe,

 

253 for i7 processor 8 cores

[JoeFackel 760]

1 minute ago, Langyboy63 said:

Thanks Joe,

 

253 for i7 processor 8 cores

I would say AM=253 for i7 processor with 4 cores and HT available.

i7 CPU are also available with 6 or more cores, you talk about cores ALWAYS for real cores, not for virtual cores gained with HT.

[mpw8679 428]

1 hour ago, monica6211 said:

I think that post says it all! And right to the point. Tweaks are OPTIONAL. They are Not NECESSARY. What part needs to be explained? Makes perfect sense to me.

The majority of the tweaks discussed are technically an “extension” of the in game sliders.  They allow users to take advantage of high end hardware.  I have a 2080ti.  To take full advantage of that card and it’s vram its necessary to make adjustments in the cfg.

Edited December 4, 2018 by mpw8679

[ckyliu 1,749]

1 hour ago, AnkH said:

Why should one do this, seriously, you spend several hundred dollars for a HT CPU, then you turn HT off and even further limit your available cores down via an AM setting? Makes no sense. If you think that HT is such a deal breaker for P3D, why did you not go for a i7-9700K instead and saved some money?

Couldn't agree more, IMO hyperthreading is a waste of money unless you're doing loads of multitasking or processes which can take advantage of it (which most games hardly benefit from HT), makes more sense to buy non-HT processor and spend the money improving specs elsewhere. And it saves messing around with all this affinity mask stuff and/or lasso.

Edited December 4, 2018 by ckyliu

[JoeFackel 760]

I must say a price difference of 120 EUR between 9700K and 9900K is not THAT much differnence where I would making to much thoughts about.

I had this too often that i let make my reason the decision and some time later i regret it 😎 So did i years ago when i choose the 4770K instead of 4790K and last year as i took the 1080 instead of 1080ti 😉

Edited December 4, 2018 by JoeFackel

[Langyboy63 22]

I pretty much only use my laptop for P3d, so you think turning off the  HT is advisable.

[mpw8679 428]

7 minutes ago, ckyliu said:

Couldn't agree more, IMO hyperthreading is a waste of money unless you're doing loads of multitasking or processes which can take advantage of it (which most games hardly benefit from HT), makes more sense to buy non-HT processor and spend the money improving specs elsewhere. And it saves messing around with all this affinity mask stuff and/or lasso.

Everyone’s experience seems to be different.  With my old 7700k I experienced much better texture loading with HT enabled.  With that said I think a 9600k or 9700k is the sweet spot for performance/cost.

[Langyboy63 22]

Looking at Laptop Bios, dont think you can switch it off anyway.

[American 833 Heavy 132]

14 hours ago, joepoway said:

The tweaks discussed here and the ones in Rob’s thread are not like the tweaks of the past they are to used by folks with powerful GPUs and more importantly lots of VRAM on their GPUs at least 8Gb but more likely greater than 8Gb. I believe LM doesn’t want to put these in the user interface yet because most people don’t have these GPUs and it would cause more issues than it’s worth. I for one am glad they have embedded the handles in the config file for those with the top of the line hardware to experiment with!

Joe

Exactly my point. And that is a good observation and you may be right, perhaps if they make it clear enough that for certain settings high VRAM is required or SLI specific settings than it should be obvious to only use it if you have the hardware needed. But to prevent issues they keep it out.

I think out of the box the standard non tweak settings work well for people with a mid-high level GPUs like a 1070 or 2070 which I'd say the vast majority of the community uses GPUs in that category. Coupled with an average of 16GB of DDR4 and K series Intels i7, which are lower core but single threaded optimized CPUs work virtually perfectly fine without tweaks on mid to middle high settings in P3D UI. Those rigs custom or bought already made run P3D really well. 

Developers/Professionals and people that use workstation like tasks and intensive creative applications need a lot more power generally speaking as they use their computers most of the time for these tasks... Then the rest for P3D and misc computing. As well as non-professional consumers with the budget that just want the latest greatest and can afford it.  Like a 32GB + DDR4, 1080ti/2080ti/Titan or Vega with an Intel 9th Gen K, Intel Extreme or AMD Threadripper CPU are definitely not the majority.

So in the end being that probably 65% or more if I had to guess have some sort of 1070/2070 GPU/ i7 6th/7th/8th K series type of rig the UI only settings work perfectly fine. And as you say it's probably why they keep them out of the UI as they would just be problematic and cause issues running the sim, especially for those less knowledgeable.

Edited December 4, 2018 by American 833 Heavy

[Bnash00 85]

8 hours ago, Langyboy63 said:

Bnash,

Hyper threading off?

I have heard this before, could you just explain how you do this, I assume it is at the boot menu somewhere.

The biggest improvements i have seen are when I use Process Lasso to move P3d on the processors 2-7 and everything else onto the remaining processors.

I use a Gaming Laptop with a GTX980m GPU, have tried different tweaks, but find that if the worse blurries occur when using shader enhancers like PTA tweaks, so I only use the Enshade default shaders and find if I regularly delete the shaders this helps. 

There is always a bit of a trade off between performance and appearance, but with Vsync set to 1/2 (60hz monitor) and frame rate limiter to 29.5FPS and Vsync on and unlimited frames with Triple Buffering in P3d, I am getting the best results I have ever seen without any CFG tweaks at all.

Hi Langyboy63,

Hyper-Threading On\Off is a setting that can be found inside you computer BIOS settings. Usually during boot you can press F1 or Del to enter setup. Once your inside the BIOS look for "CPU Configuration" or something similar. Every computer is different. You should be able to find the Hyper-Threading setting it will have two states On or Off. Once you change the setting usually you have to press F10 to save the changes and then reboot.

Please let me know if you notice any improvement. Don't expect to see more FPS. Just expect to see smoother more consistent FPS. If you don't like it or you notice your performance is worse, you can always go back and turn Hyper-Threading back on.

Good Luck!  

[kand 205]

Why all this talk of turning Hyperthreading off in BIOS? why not just run the affinity mask to block the threads from running on the logical cores and only allow P3d to use the physical cores? best of both worlds then when it comes to your other applications which may benefit 

[American 833 Heavy 132]

Another benefit that improves FPS in P3D and overall performance in my experience is setting your memory interleaving in the BIOS to "channel" which makes the computer CPU and RAM run in NUMA mode. This has benefits in certain workloads and particularly on applications that tend to ask for similar data sets over and over like P3D. However for other tasks like audio/video encoding and decoding running the memory in standard UMA mode is a little better. When I'm not running specific Audio related CPU intensive tasks I run my memory in NUMA mode.

I'm not sure if you can do it on Intel rigs but it really helps for anyone running a Ryzen or Threadripper CPU. It's worth a try on Intel rigs if you can do it too.

I haven't seen too much of a difference between running HT On or Off in P3D with my TR 2990WX CPU. AMD calls HT SMT, does the same thing. CPU intensive tasks take good advantage of the extra threads of SMT. Some people say HT on works better for them in P3D. Only way to know for sure is to try for yourself and experiment using a known repeatable scenario in P3D where you can A/B and see the differences first hand.
 

Edited December 4, 2018 by American 833 Heavy