Do I bite the bullet and leave Win7 for 10?

[Mace 1,902]

That sounds bad.  Last time I checked, my Win10 installation was not hogging the cpu for 15-20 minutes (or even 1 minute) after boot.  (!) 

I guess I will pay a little more attention to it next time.

I've got a pretty draconian Win10 install, with gobs of services set to not start.  It did take me a lot of time and research to get it that way.  No question it has more nannies out-of-the-box than Win7 did, but we all know that.

[pete_auau 1,152]

Was  with  windows 7  for  ages   till  got  a new  pc  and of  course  had  to  get  windows  10,   can  say  that I  got  no issues  with it of  course  my  windows  10  was  a  clean install

[vortex681 806]

17 hours ago, odourboy said:

It routinely hogs 10 to 15% of the CPU along with lots of disk and I/O activity. Whatever it's doing it can often take 15 or 20 minutes to settle down

Then I'd say that the problem lies with something other than the OS. I was reading this on my iPad and booted up my PC to check. I have a flurry of activity for about a minute after reaching the desktop, up to about 10% CPU utilisation for about another 30 seconds after that then 0% to just a few percent from then on unless a program is running.

What antivirus/antimalware apps do you have? Some do a system check on startup which can use a lot of resources.

Edited February 6, 2019 by vortex681

[odourboy 1,288]

In fairness, I should say thst I only boot my machine up when I'm going to fly, otherwise it's off. My schedule hasn't allowed much time for simming lately, so the machine can be off for days at a time.  When I boot up, it could be that there's a lot of "catching up" to do, that might normally have been spread out or done at 2:00am or something. Of course, it's a vicious cycle, I'm less likely to boot the mschine and fly, knowing I have to wait to start my session, which only makes the backlog of updates worse.

[TurboKen 221]

8 hours ago, odourboy said:

In fairness, I should say thst I only boot my machine up when I'm going to fly, otherwise it's off. My schedule hasn't allowed much time for simming lately, so the machine can be off for days at a time.  When I boot up, it could be that there's a lot of "catching up" to do, that might normally have been spread out or done at 2:00am or something. Of course, it's a vicious cycle, I'm less likely to boot the mschine and fly, knowing I have to wait to start my session, which only makes the backlog of updates worse.

This is my problem too. I have win10 on only my laptop which i turn on maybe once every 3 weeks and when I use it win10 loads and then for 45min its updating itself. Very annoying. Thats why I haven't switched my desk top from 7. I turn it on and can use it right away. Laptop I have to turn it on well before I actually need to use so its ready for me. ITs always updating. Can that be turned of to only update when I want it too??? Like after I am done using it...Microsoft are you listening???

[bobbyjack 61]

I've run every version of Windows from W98 on. I've just never had a problem with any of them. I dabble in video and music production. All computer intensive. I can't imagine not wanting security updates. I have a Toshiba laptop with a itb HHD. I understand that Toshiba drives are not very good. The computer was slow to start and as noted above, the drive was very busy for some time after startup. The drive finally failed and I put an SSD in. Everything changed. 

It seems to me that problems arise more from hardware problems that OS. Although trying to make the OS do things that it was never intended to do is a problem.

Something else. As much as we complain about how poorly FSX is coded,and how hard it may be to get to run well (what ever that means), it tends to still run on modern systems and OSs when other software from the same time has long been left behind. 

[stans 702]

Based on what people have reported and my wife's laptop computer, if you are going to move from Windows 7 to Windows 10, make it a completely new installation of Windows 10.  Those, including my wife, who have Windows 7 or 8 and upgrade to 10 seem to have more problems than those who perform a clean installation of Windows 10.  It is becoming a Windows 10 world and although you could keep your flight sim on a Windows 7 machine, at some point add on developers and P3D, perhaps X-Plane as well, will cease to support or develop anything other than Windows 10 compatible software.

We are Windows 10 of Borg, you will be assimilated.

Edited February 10, 2019 by stans

[Cruachan 705]

1 hour ago, stans said:

Based on what people have reported and my wife's laptop computer, if you are going to move from Windows 7 to Windows 10, make it a completely new installation of Windows 10.  Those, including my wife, who have Windows 7 or 8 and upgrade to 10 seem to have more problems than those who perform a clean installation of Windows 10.  It is becoming a Windows 10 world and although you could keep your flight sim on a Windows 7 machine, at some point add on developers and P3D, perhaps X-Plane as well, will cease to support or develop anything other than Windows 10 compatible software.

We are Windows 10 of Borg, you will be assimilated.

Hi Stans,

Everything you have said is, of course, true and I do have a clean installation of Win10 alongside Win7, each on their own dedicated drives. 

For me, the point is I already have a stable and well performing heavily customised Prepar3D installation under Windows7. Limited support for Win7 continues until Jan 2020 and it’s likely that many like me, with their mature installations, will opt to keep it that way until Ver 5 is revealed. Thereafter it will take some time to incorporate all my preferred customisations. In the meantime, under a dual Boot arrangement, Prepar3D v4.x remains available to me in all its glory.

I like some aspects of Windows 10, but the inescapable fact is that Microsoft never really intended it for the likes of us. User pressure is forcing change and doubtless, in time, it will become accepted universally as being the de facto preferred operating system. Windows7 has achieved classic status and, for me, remains the better operating system for my current needs and hardware requirements.

Prior to deciding on a dual boot arrangement to accommodate Windows10 I was arguing from a point of weakness since I had little or no experience of Win10. That is no longer the case and yet I still favour Windows7. I suspect there are still not insignificant numbers who share my impressions.

Meantime, I see no harm in dabbling with Windows10 while observing its ongoing evolution. Yes, the day will come when I am persuaded to jump, but that day has not yet arrived.

IMHO Windows10 of Borg is not yet a match for the joint forces of the Windows7 Federation of Planets! Assimilation was never an option!!

Regards,

Mike 😀

[bobbyjack 61]

I've heard all this stuff before. Same arguments, different decade. Windows ME was a disaster they said. The only thing worse was XP. You had to find away to afford 128mb of ram just to run it. Then it became the rock solid standard. Vista came along, which was more popular than most of us remember  Then W7 landed. What was MS thinking? They changed everything around. They hid stuff. Even more ram was needed. People hated W7. And W8. Complaints about W10 are the same old thing. Seems to me that the strong points about computers is the ability to move ahead. If we try to squeeze a new OS into an old mold then we are looking backward, and not progressing. I know, I know you all just want a stable machine that does what you want. If that's the case, get a Volvo, a computer will let you down much of the time. I've had my share of crashes, lost data, expensive software that no longer works. So what. Does my machine run me, or do I run it. I do not fear a new OS. I have upgraded almost as soon as they come out. So get developers to offer their stuff for W10. And at an upgrade price. Although nobody said running a sim was going to be cheap. We knew that going in. Upgrade and progress happens. Help it happen.

[Adrian123 1,015]

I don't believe the arguments about Windows 10 are the same as previous versions. The Windows extreme security, automatic updates,forced apps and spyware are the problem with Win 10. Great for businesses, bad for gamers.

[Cruachan 705]

5 hours ago, bobbyjack said:

Upgrade and progress happens. Help it happen.

Hi Bob,

It rather depends on your definition of progress. I would hazard a guess that many who have moved to Windows 10 will be having some doubts about the wisdom of that move right now. Few, of course, will admit it as the stable door has, in effect, been closed and there is no going back. So, you learn to live with what you have and convince yourself you have made the right decision. New motherboards and CPUs require Win10 and so, to remain at the cutting edge of so-called ‘progress’, Win10 is required. Does it make it a better operating system? Maybe. Does it run stuff any better than Win7? Perhaps in a few cases, but that is still open to debate.

Win98, XP, ME, Vista, Win7, Win8/8a all suffered criticism. Arguably Windows7, once it matured, proved to be the best of the lot, although XP was not far behind. Windows 10, however, is different in terms of the built in levels of intrusiveness and the sense that big brother is constantly peering over your shoulder looking for ways to modify your behaviour. Unless you purchase the Pro Version you are faced with relinquishing a not insignificant level of control to MS.....in the name of ‘progress’. Yes there are ways to mitigate this interference providing you are prepared to do your own research and have the necessary expertise to implement the necessary changes. How many have such skills?

Lets not forget that progress, in the main, is driven by the need to make profit and ensure the survival of manufacturers. To ensure that profit, it is necessary to find ways of persuading (advertising) or coercing the paying customer to jump on board. I believe MS were fearful that there would be a reluctance to adopt Windows 10 over Windows 7 and so decided to concentrate on the latter model which for many, like me, was a huge turn off and undermined any confidence I had that the corporation could be trusted.

All that said, I know Windows 10 is the future. Microsoft are learning lessons and, in time, it will become the operating system we can all embrace. However, and to address the original question I would say that if you are content with what you have now then there is, as yet, no pressing requirement to move from Windows 7 to Windows 10.

Regards,

Mike

 

[vortex681 806]

7 hours ago, Cruachan said:

Windows 10, however, is different in terms of the built in levels of intrusiveness and the sense that big brother is constantly peering over your shoulder looking for ways to modify your behaviour. Unless you purchase the Pro Version you are faced with relinquishing a not insignificant level of control to MS.....in the name of ‘progress’. Yes there are ways to mitigate this interference providing you are prepared to do your own research and have the necessary expertise to implement the necessary changes. How many have such skills?

I'm sorry, but you're out of date with these views. The latest version of Windows 10 (1809, all versions) allows control of the privacy issues from within the OS settings without having to have any special computer knowledge other than the ability to toggle options from a list - see: https://privacyamp.com/knowledge-base/windows-10-5-minute-privacy-configuration/. You don't need to make any registry changes. The only thing the Pro version really offers for non-business users is the ability to defer updates - it doesn't give any extra options for privacy control. Windows 7 still sends data back to Microsoft, it's just not as transparent about it as Windows 10.

Edited February 11, 2019 by vortex681

[Cruachan 705]

5 hours ago, vortex681 said:

I'm sorry, but you're out of date with these views. The latest version of Windows 10 (1809, all versions) allows control of the privacy issues from within the OS settings without having to have any special computer knowledge other than the ability to toggle options from a list - see: https://privacyamp.com/knowledge-base/windows-10-5-minute-privacy-configuration/. You don't need to make any registry changes. The only thing the Pro version really offers for non-business users is the ability to defer updates - it doesn't give any extra options for privacy control.

Hi @vortex681

Okay, point taken and thanks for the heads up. I'm still on 1803 and likely to remain so for a while yet.

Looks like MS may be listening to us mere mortals after all. Will be interesting to see what else they do in response to user pressures in the coming months.

Thanks for the link. Is this an independent site or in some way linked to MS?

6 hours ago, vortex681 said:

Windows 7 still sends data back to Microsoft, it's just not as transparent about it as Windows 10.

Really? Can you elaborate, please? What am I missing?

Regards,

Mike

[vortex681 806]

13 hours ago, Cruachan said:

Looks like MS may be listening to us mere mortals after all.

We can but hope! They do seem to be making more of an effort.

Data collection: https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/microsoft-gathering-data-windows-7-8/ and https://www.infoworld.com/article/2979054/windows-security/windows-7-8-10-now-all-collecting-user-data-for-microsoft.html

[Cruachan 705]

Hi @vortex681

Interesting article. I doubt whether there is anything there I should be concerned about and it seems quite likely that MS are no longer interested in collecting info from Win7 users participating in their Customer Experience Improvement Program (CEIP). I checked and I see I must have opted out back in 2015 when I installed Win7 Pro on this rig.

In any event, I worked my way through the article and implemented all that was described.

Again, thanks for that!

Regards,

Mike