Does 1/2 refresh rate work?

[SteveW 1,792]

Hi there, You can try that. Adding a cap can mean that there's less swing around the VSync point. The internal frame lock will be very effective at keeping things smooth but it will run the critical core high. It is mainly for low fps because it ensures the same time between frames. With high fps 30+ there is less time between frames becoming unimportant.

 

Quite often a Monitor profile can be created for P3D to VSync at 30 but mouse movements will be less responsive on the desktop during that mode.

 

On RTSS, if you see 100% on a desktop mode no matter what the limit that's not right for it. Smoother is relative. Have to be careful with tests and checking performance characteristics accurately. 100% on that core (or LP) is doing something unnecessary. I checked it out on a system and it raises the P3D critical core to 100% no matter what the limit and so I said 'hey little cooler-fan why are you spinning so fast? I will check it all out on a proper test rig later.

 

 

 

[SteveW 1,792]

21 hours ago, fernandinho said:

Hey SteveW. Thanks for you recommendations. What would you do with an i7-9700K? Leave it as it is without AM?

8 cores 8 threads no HT mode? No AM=255=0 gives it 8 cores.

Try AM=126=01111110 six cores.

I can't be sure about it without properly testing and recording data on the rig with desired settings and addons, but I would expect that should do a good job. No need to allow all 8. You'll see even with six most of the time they don't do much work once the sim is loaded. With that you will see the second core from top left in task manager being the critical core. That is the second digit in the AM from the right going left.

[SteveW 1,792]

22 hours ago, Bert Pieke said:

Monitor 1080p @ 60Hz

No addon apps other than RTSS

Edit:

Actually, my addon GPS is assigned to the third core (00 00 01 00)

Use commas in HT nomenclature = 00,00,01,00 = he one is in the second core (core 1) it is the third Logical Processor LP2. 😊

[SteveW 1,792]

22 hours ago, Bert Pieke said:

Monitor 1080p @ 60Hz

No addon apps other than RTSS

Edit:

Actually, my addon GPS is assigned to the third core (00 00 01 00)

Use commas in HT nomenclature = 00,00,01,00 = the one is in the second core (core 1) it is the third Logical Processor LP2. 😊

[SteveW 1,792]

...with HT enabled if we have an AM such as 00,00,01,00 LP 2 will receive the activity. In fact it is better to think of it as core 1 will receive the load. LP2 shares core 1 with LP 3. It is just with HT enabled the switching of tasks with that sister LP 3 is more efficient than if those tasks appear on core 1 without HT enabled.

There's not so many complications with HT disabled, but I will be showing how much more complicated HT mode really is in a feature I'm doing in the near future. SO when we see 'I switched on HT and it was no good', that's basically correct because we can't just enable it and get good results from P3D ( or FSX) there's more to do.

[SteveW 1,792]

...It's possible with a tool like RTSS that the performance counter is lost rather than the LP is just simply pegged at 100%.That would still be incorrect operation of a sort. Needs careful testing.

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

2 hours ago, SteveW said:

...It's possible with a tool like RTSS that the performance counter is lost rather than the LP is just simply pegged at 100%.That would still be incorrect operation of a sort. Needs careful testing.

I'll try to measure the Core temperature and see if there is a difference..

It is actually not pegged at 100%, but running very close to 100% whereas using NVI as the framerate limiter, it is running around the 60% level.

Edited March 19, 2019 by Bert Pieke

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

5 hours ago, SteveW said:

On RTSS, if you see 100% on a desktop mode no matter what the limit that's not right for it. Smoother is relative. Have to be careful with tests and checking performance characteristics accurately. 100% on that core (or LP) is doing something unnecessary. I checked it out on a system and it raises the P3D critical core to 100% no matter what the limit and so I said 'hey little cooler-fan why are you spinning so fast? I will check it all out on a proper test rig later.

 

 

 

I look forward to your findings!

Here is what I see:

P3D native, either set at unlimited or 30 fps produces a "close to full" load on the first LP that is assigned to P3D.  

In my case with AM set at 254, that is the second LP on the first Core (Core0).

Core0 temperature is steady around 60 degrees C.

Adding RTSS, to limit the fps at 30, produces about the same picture and temperature.

Now, using NVI instead at 30 fps produces a different picture.. LP usage around 60% and Core0 temperature steady around 50 degrees C.  (Both NVI limiters, V1 or V2, have the same effect).

Interesting test follows.. if I now add RTSS at 30 or greater, the NVI picture stays the same.

However, if I lower RTSS to 28 or 25 fps, the LP usage goes right back up and the temperature goes back to 60 degrees.

So, on my system, with NVI limiting the frame rate: lower CPU usage, lower CPU temperature.

With RTSS limiting the frame rate, higher CPU usage, higher CPU temperature... about the same as P3D without an external frame rate limiter.

Now for the not so easy part.. it appears to me that RTSS produces a smoother flight.

My RV7 test plane feels very fluid and very responsive to the controls.

I am going to stay with RTSS for a while longer to see if there are any negative effects, but it feels really nice

 

Edited March 19, 2019 by Bert Pieke

[SteveW 1,792]

I'll be checking it out. I can't see how different versions of limiting can increase the effect of fluidity, that's usually due to a  total increase in fps that accounts for that side of things.

[kaha 205]

16 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

... it appears to me that RTSS produces a smoother flight....

Bert, which settings do you use? All maxed out or 1 notch back...? Shadows? What about during night operation with DL?

 

Thx,

Karl

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

26 minutes ago, SteveW said:

I'll be checking it out. I can't see how different versions of limiting can increase the effect of fluidity, that's usually due to a  total increase in fps that accounts for that side of things.

Could be the famed Placebo effect 

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

20 minutes ago, kaha said:

Bert, which settings do you use? All maxed out or 1 notch back...? Shadows? What about during night operation with DL?

 

Thx,

Karl

Somewhat more conservative settings, and no night flight with DL...

You will have to do your own testing with the settings you prefer.. our hardware is totally different for starters    

[kaha 205]

I experience nice results here with setting MIN_FIBER_TIME_SEC=0.010 in addition to externally limiting to half refresh rate. With that tweak not in I get blurry terrain when flying the F-16 low and fast over photoreal terrain.

I limit in Nvidia Control Panel. The shown frame rates flicker between ~29 and ~34. Is that stable at 30 using RTSS? If it is stable then each even rendered frame is on the 60 Hz boundary and each odd delivered frame is on exactly half refresh rate. That's ideal for our eyes.

[Bert Pieke 7,585]

2 minutes ago, kaha said:

I experience nice results here with setting MIN_FIBER_TIME_SEC=0.010 in addition to externally limiting to half refresh rate. With that tweak not in I get blurry terrain when flying the F-16 low and fast over photoreal terrain.

I limit in Nvidia Control Panel. The shown frame rates flicker between ~29 and ~34. Is that stable at 30 using RTSS? If it is stable then each even rendered frame is on the 60 Hz boundary and each odd delivered frame is on exactly half refresh rate. That's ideal for our eyes.

As I said, try it.. easy to do.

BTW your monitor shows 60 pictures per second, twice as fast as the frame rate which only changes the picture content 30 times per second, every other picture, not the other way around.. 

[SteveW 1,792]

22 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

Could be the famed Placebo effect 

Maybe, maybe not. The RTSS method consumes less frames to determine the cutoff.