Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Nyxx

JustSim NICE COTE D'AZUR

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, ErichB said:

Yes, but it was more than adequately built into the initial asking price of £139 (for the life of P3D V4).

PMDG also have an explicit policy of no charge for point releases on a platform. 

+1

And I think it's worth noting that JustSim isn't PMDG or Maddog, which by any measure are big players in the flight sim developer world, and I think most reasonable people would agree with that stark reality.

So maybe some people who seem to be really out of sorts about this 5 quid upgrade thing should just take a deep breath and chill out a little bit. Get the upgrade or don't.. it's your choice.

Share this post


Link to post

I see nothing wrong with people expressing their opinion on this additional charge. Suggesting they just suck it up and either pay or don’t pay doesn’t really help in the debate.

Updating an AFCAD and passing that off an an improvement is outrageous. I bet ADE still finds faults in it. I have yet to find any commercial AFCAD to be fault free which is something that irritates me.

As for adding PBR does anyone know how labour intensive that is?  Nice is hardly Heathrow.

It’s interesting to note Aerosoft also charged around 7GBP for a 64-bit optimised Heathrow whatever that means. If that doesn’t have PBR will that be another charge? Where does it all end?

  • Like 1

Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2, Intel i9-13900K, MSI 4090 GAMING X TRIO 24G, Crucial T700 4Tb M.2 SSD, Asus ROG Maximus Z790 Hero, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6000Mhz RAM, Win 11 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

Share this post


Link to post
40 minutes ago, SunDevil56 said:

+1

And I think it's worth noting that JustSim isn't PMDG or Maddog, which by any measure are big players in the flight sim developer world, and I think most reasonable people would agree with that stark reality.

So maybe some people who seem to be really out of sorts about this 5 quid upgrade thing should just take a deep breath and chill out a little bit. Get the upgrade or don't.. it's your choice.

You seem to totally miss the point, it nothing to do with how much on its own or how much a product cost in the first place, just the fact that it could be setting a president to start charging for PBR for an updated airport how many airports do you own? times that by £6 is that figure still "out of sorts"? I currently have 48 airports installed thats £288 if the others go down that route. That's not a insignificant sum of money for me or "out of sorts" in your words, is it to you?, never mind we all have different ideas of what cheap or expensive.

Like I said if you find it fine to pay the small about, fine, I personally do not like the president it might start. Pls don't patronizing with the "take a deep breath" it's totally uncalled for Scott.

The reviews are funny now as one says reviews says "Interesting reviews about the upgrade from non owners off this Addon-Upgrade here"......you could not make it up.

Edited by Nyxx
  • Like 1

David Murden  MSFS   Fenix A320  PMDG 737 • MG Honda Jet • 414 / TDS 750Xi •  FS-ATC Chatter • FlyingIron Spitfire & ME109G • MG Honda Jet 

 Fenix A320 Walkthrough PDF   Flightsim.to •

DCS  A10c II  F-16c  F/A-18c • F-14 • (Others in hanger) • Supercarrier  Terrains = • Nevada NTTR  Persian Gulf  Syria • Marianas • 

• 10900K@4.9 All Cores HT ON   32GB DDR4  3200MHz RTX 3080  • TM Warthog HOTAS • TM TPR • Corsair Virtuoso XT with Dolby Atmos®  Samsung G7 32" 1440p 240Hz • TrackIR 5 & ProClip

Share this post


Link to post

PBR = Licence to print money. 😠


Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2, Intel i9-13900K, MSI 4090 GAMING X TRIO 24G, Crucial T700 4Tb M.2 SSD, Asus ROG Maximus Z790 Hero, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6000Mhz RAM, Win 11 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

Share this post


Link to post
25 minutes ago, Nyxx said:

The reviews are funny now as one says reviews says "Interesting reviews about the upgrade from non owners off this Addon-Upgrade here"......you could not make it up.

Yeah, probably another of Ank's "paid for with freebie scenery" reviews... lol

You guys win, i'm done here.. Adios..

Share this post


Link to post
46 minutes ago, Nyxx said:

You seem to totally miss the point, it nothing to do with how much on its own or how much a product cost in the first place, just the fact that it could be setting a president to start charging for PBR for an updated airport how many airports do you own? times that by £6 is that figure still "out of sorts"? I currently have 48 airports installed thats £288 if the others go down that route. That's not a insignificant sum of money for me or "out of sorts" in your words, is it to you?, never mind we all have different ideas of what cheap or expensive.

Like I said if you find it fine to pay the small about, fine, I personally do not like the president it might start. Pls don't patronizing with the "take a deep breath" it's totally uncalled for Scott.

The reviews are funny now as one says reviews says "Interesting reviews about the upgrade from non owners off this Addon-Upgrade here"......you could not make it up.

Aren't you ^just missing the point"?  I will give you an example. You buy a new car for price X. After 6 months there will be an upgrade on its exhaust. They developped a new one for more power and a nicer look. If you want it you will have to pay for it. If not, leave it. That's exactly the same with development. Of course every developper is free to decide if he is spending for free or will take a charge for it. This is simply how it works. He doesn't care how much cars you have (or addons). So maybe we have to ask us if we are objective to paste product reviews and disagree on a price for some further development even if we don't own this upgrade. That doesn't has anything to do with a product review. We should stay to the purpose of reviews. Or don't we? I bought it. But only because I like to have this further gimmicks as PBR and Afcad. I can and will not take a statement if the strategy from Justsim is the right one. I don't care. That is their business and risk. Regards Marcus. 

Edited by mpo910
  • Upvote 1

Regards,

Marcus P.

xaP1VAU.png

Share this post


Link to post
24 minutes ago, Nyxx said:

You seem to totally miss the point, it nothing to do with how much on its own or how much a product cost in the first place, just the fact that it could be setting a president to start charging for PBR for an updated airport how many airports do you own?

David, with all due respect......in your professional world, an artist would paint, draw, or etch a picture.  That alone,  would be worth a fair sum of money, unframed.  If you wanted to enhance the aesthetics of the painting, you'd put a frame around it.  That would cost you (reasonably) a fair margin more - in some cases, alot more.  If you think its reasonable to recoup the cost of the frame because the enhanced aesthetic value is worth extra charge, why does that principle not apply to a developer who has spent time to apply PBR to his scenery.  All he has done afterall, is enhance the aesthetics of his product - and essentially given you the choice to pay for a frame around your picture.  Its like saying to an artist, 'but I've already paid for your painting, now you're going to charge me extra to put a frame around it ?'

I'm not disagreeing that it is all becoming expensive,I get that, and I am in the same boat as you.  But as a result, I have just become more fussy about which scenery I choose to enhance if extra charges are attached.  Everyone has to make a living.  I'm sure JustSim are not 'living it up'  in Monaco.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Ray Proudfoot said:

[...]

As for adding PBR does anyone know how labour intensive that is?  Nice is hardly Heathrow.

[...]

I've been trying to apply PBR materials to my scenery over the past month or so, kind of on-and-off. The software is wonderful l - packed with features - but has a steep learning curve. The kind of thing that takes a while to get used to, and then becomes a breeze to use. What certainly does not help is that I routinely find out that I have no correctly specified materials in Blender, where I do the modeling. I then have to go back to Blender, change material assignment, change UV maps, etc, before I can come back to Substance to continue texturing. And usually this means that I have to redo some of the work, since I have changed some of the UV maps.

Perhaps you can already see that, like I also said a few posts above yours, it is not a trivial matter and requires adopting a whole new approach to texturing and modeling, which comes with purchasing new software that can handle the workflow. As such I can understand smaller developers, such as JustSim, charging a few extra bucks for a PBR upgrade, as well as making airports a little more expensive in the future. I will add that some developers have wisely invested in the required texturing software a while ago, such as FSDT. For them the switch to PBR shouldn't be nearly as steep a learning curve. That said, PBR materials work with a whole new set of shaders, from what I understand, and whatever P3D does is not the same as what you see in your texturing software. Thus it requires some going back and forth to get right.

  • Upvote 2

Benjamin van Soldt

Windows 10 64bit - i5-8600k @ 4.7GHz - ASRock Fatality K6 Z370 - EVGA GTX1070 SC 8GB VRAM - 16GB Corsair Vengeance LPX @ 3200MHz - Samsung 960 Evo SSD M.2 NVMe 500GB - 2x Samsung 860 Evo SSD 1TB (P3Dv4/5 drive) - Seagate Barracuda 2TB 7200RPM - Seasonic FocusPlus Gold 750W - Noctua DH-15S - Fractal Design Focus G (White) Case

Share this post


Link to post

@Benjamin J, I fully accept learning new software has a cost and learning curve element. But once learned the PBR effects can be added to airports far quicker than at the outset.

I don’t know the cost of the software but it is a finite cost and will eventually be recovered.

My main objection is the price of 25% of the whole airport for PBR effects. The other ‘features’ are cosmetic.

Until I can experience this myself I won’t know whether it’s worth it or not. Clearly their decision has annoyed some people. They may think twice before buying other JustSim products. Imagine if they had offered the PBR update free of charge. Their customer relations would look very different.

Edited by Ray Proudfoot
Spelling
  • Like 2
  • Upvote 1

Ray (Cheshire, England).
System: P3D v5.3HF2, Intel i9-13900K, MSI 4090 GAMING X TRIO 24G, Crucial T700 4Tb M.2 SSD, Asus ROG Maximus Z790 Hero, 32Gb Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6000Mhz RAM, Win 11 Pro 64-bit, BenQ PD3200U 32” UHD monitor, Fulcrum One yoke.
Cheadle Hulme Weather

Share this post


Link to post
2 hours ago, ErichB said:

David, with all due respect......in your professional world, an artist would paint, draw, or etch a picture.  That alone,  would be worth a fair sum of money, unframed.  If you wanted to enhance the aesthetics of the painting, you'd put a frame around it.  That would cost you (reasonably) a fair margin more - in some cases, alot more.  If you think its reasonable to recoup the cost of the frame because the enhanced aesthetic value is worth extra charge, why does that principle not apply to a developer who has spent time to apply PBR to his scenery.  All he has done afterall, is enhance the aesthetics of his product - and essentially given you the choice to pay for a frame around your picture.  Its like saying to an artist, 'but I've already paid for your painting, now you're going to charge me extra to put a frame around it ?'

I'm not disagreeing that it is all becoming expensive,I get that, and I am in the same boat as you.  But as a result, I have just become more fussy about which scenery I choose to enhance if extra charges are attached.  Everyone has to make a living.  I'm sure JustSim are not 'living it up'  in Monaco.

The best way forward here is to shake your hand with the respect I have for you and say...on this am happy to agree to see both sides and am happy to agree to respectfully disagree...but as I can see both sides of the argument it’s best to not go on about it anymore. If you pay for the PBR am sure you will enjoy it. 

 

  • Like 1

David Murden  MSFS   Fenix A320  PMDG 737 • MG Honda Jet • 414 / TDS 750Xi •  FS-ATC Chatter • FlyingIron Spitfire & ME109G • MG Honda Jet 

 Fenix A320 Walkthrough PDF   Flightsim.to •

DCS  A10c II  F-16c  F/A-18c • F-14 • (Others in hanger) • Supercarrier  Terrains = • Nevada NTTR  Persian Gulf  Syria • Marianas • 

• 10900K@4.9 All Cores HT ON   32GB DDR4  3200MHz RTX 3080  • TM Warthog HOTAS • TM TPR • Corsair Virtuoso XT with Dolby Atmos®  Samsung G7 32" 1440p 240Hz • TrackIR 5 & ProClip

Share this post


Link to post

But is there a president that others may follow V5 80 addon airport cost 25% upgrade price, bear mind they may not work in V5 unless you do pay so your stuck in V4 or cough up. 

  • Like 1

 

Raymond Fry.

PMDG_Banner_747_Enthusiast.jpg

Share this post


Link to post

In this version by LFMN AFCAD wasn't correct only. It's was remake because apron, parkings and taxi marking was reconstructed for real time. Any parkings in real airport was replace, rename or rebuild. Taxi and parkings was update for actually charts schemes. So, AFCAD was modified for this too. It's not PBR update only. There are ground polygons a markings lines in this update.

Edited by Ziron
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post

As of this writing,  I don't seem any negative reviews for LFMN. I see only 4 and 5 stars. 4 total reviews. 


-J

13700KF | RTX 4090 @ 4K | 32GB DDR5 | 2 x 1TB SSDs | 1TB M.2 NVMe

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, Twenty6 said:

As of this writing,  I don't seem any negative reviews for LFMN. I see only 4 and 5 stars. 4 total reviews. 

They have removed/deleted the 4-5 x1 Star reviews, Censorship is a wonderful thing!

The two sides of this Jay are 

A) It's just £6 for the work implementing PBR update AFCAD and some ground polygons and markings, is £6 much to ask? ofc not. 

B) As Ray points out it 25% of the cost of new, that's after buying it new £23 paying £6 for the v4 version and now another £6. If PMDG after taking there livery artist 4 weeks to do the work on converting all 15 747 variants to PBR, could they justify charging £30? yes, they could. One month's wages for someone. But what would the reaction have been if they asked everyone who wanted PBR for another £30? It does not matter how much it was in the first place? 25% of the original price is still 25%.

So Like I've said I can see both sides and it's down to your personly opinion. Each to there own, and that's always good.

 

Edited by Nyxx

David Murden  MSFS   Fenix A320  PMDG 737 • MG Honda Jet • 414 / TDS 750Xi •  FS-ATC Chatter • FlyingIron Spitfire & ME109G • MG Honda Jet 

 Fenix A320 Walkthrough PDF   Flightsim.to •

DCS  A10c II  F-16c  F/A-18c • F-14 • (Others in hanger) • Supercarrier  Terrains = • Nevada NTTR  Persian Gulf  Syria • Marianas • 

• 10900K@4.9 All Cores HT ON   32GB DDR4  3200MHz RTX 3080  • TM Warthog HOTAS • TM TPR • Corsair Virtuoso XT with Dolby Atmos®  Samsung G7 32" 1440p 240Hz • TrackIR 5 & ProClip

Share this post


Link to post

Don't pay if you don't need this things and use old data (old parking places and taxi). I don't remember that some scenery developer after realise this scenery recorrect this any time ago for real situation in airport for free. There are many sceneries with very old data (charts like jepessen) in market. People use it old data and developer don't create new corrections for free. I mean not fix and errors edit, only make data actually after realise any time ago.

Edited by Ziron
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
  • Tom Allensworth,
    Founder of AVSIM Online


  • Flight Simulation's Premier Resource!

    AVSIM is a free service to the flight simulation community. AVSIM is staffed completely by volunteers and all funds donated to AVSIM go directly back to supporting the community. Your donation here helps to pay our bandwidth costs, emergency funding, and other general costs that crop up from time to time. Thank you for your support!

    Click here for more information and to see all donations year to date.
×
×
  • Create New...