Slow to Climb?

[FDEdev 955]

Just read the list and I can assure you that 90-99% of the things you mentioned are not going to be fixed. They don't do anything outside the FSX/P3D SDK, which e.g. means that no Carenado/Alabeo turboprop will ever have external power. Internal lighting is limited etc...

I don't understand these two:  

1. NP values are too high for the AUTO positions of the Condition Levers

2. really good modelled the engines power and PWR MGT behaviour.

If 2 is correct, how or why is 1 wrong?

 

Even more puzzling is this:

Regarding the power levers, there is a small white arc (between 65-68 d). That is the takeoff notch. With PL in that position, the torque should be 90% and normal engine parameters for takeoff. 

I thought this is already the case?

 

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by FDEdev

[GeeBee 5]

Of course the link is relevant.... it shows an actual pilot flying an actual ATR.

And it matches my Carenado perfectly.

I cannot get more than 68 percent thrust by placing the Power levers in the centre notch.

All SOPs that I have read state you need 90 percent torque for takeoff.

The only way to achieve this in the Carenado is to go to the second notch.... just gefore the red line.

Also, most SOPS for companies, always use 100 percent CL for takeoff.

Sorry my friend, but a real world video is all I need. Especially when it works in the sim, exactly !

If Carenado have modelled it incorrectly, then it makes no difference. Placing both levers in the auto/centre notch for takeoff, is giving you less than 70 percent power, and if you are anything but empty, you will be climbing out at 500 fpm at best.

Edited April 24, 2019 by GeeBee

[46Pilot 32]

NP values are too high for the FTR and AUTO positions of the Condition Levers. In FTR detent, the NP should be around 15%, and in AUTO detent, the NP should be stabilized at 71%.

Once airborne, the power ratio and rate of climb matches the performance of real aircraft, not exactly, but not big differences. Also, when you switch the power management rotary selector from TO to CLB, for example, the engine parameters changes as they should, again, not exactly, but is ok, you can live with that.

[FDEdev 955]

4 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Also, most SOPS for companies, always use 100 percent CL for takeoff.

Don't know which SOPs you are referring to. Nevertheless there should be absolutely NO difference in torque with the CL in AUTO or at 100% since AUTO  = 100% with the pwr management selector at TO or MCP.

[46Pilot 32]

@GeeBee if you want to fly the aircraft with the CL in 100% OVRD, go ahead, but this is not correct. If you have found some docs on the web, as I have already mentioned earlier, for the -200 or -300 series of the ATR, they are not good for the -500 series, because there major differences. 

"Of course the link is relevant.... it shows an actual pilot flying an actual ATR." - No, it is not, because is not a -500 series. -500 have a different engine and engine management.

Edited April 24, 2019 by 46Pilot

[FDEdev 955]

@46 Pilot, so do you get 90% torque in the TO notch? Your bug lists suggests that this isn't the case.

[46Pilot 32]

@FDEdev Yes, I do. As I said earlier, I'm already working to post some docs and a tutorial.

@GeeBee I will show you some differences between 42-300 and 42-500 immediately, to see yourself why it is wrong referring to some 42-300 docs when flying the -500 series.

@GeeBee Please, see attached photos.

1. ATR 42-300.

Note the different Condition Levers markings, and also the safety pins for the flaps and flaps markings. There is also a different PEC and EEC controls, more than that, there are -300 series NON-PEC (propeller electronic control)

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/7489663

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6262786

2. ATR 42-500

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6797444

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6339119

Edited April 24, 2019 by 46Pilot

[GeeBee 5]

Here is another. Of the 42-500 ........ very very clear that the PLs are in fully forward for takeoff and climb out..... they do put CLs into auto (seems to be a SOP thing).

Do watch this super clear video.... please !

https://youtu.be/YcvvzKXM8Ck

Edited April 24, 2019 by GeeBee

[GeeBee 5]

19 minutes ago, 46Pilot said:

@FDEdev Yes, I do. As I said earlier, I'm already working to post some docs and a tutorial.

@GeeBee I will show you some differences between 42-300 and 42-500 immediately, to see yourself why it is wrong referring to some 42-300 docs when flying the -500 series.

@GeeBee Please, see attached photos.

1. ATR 42-300.

Note the different Condition Levers markings, and also the safety pins for the flaps and flaps markings. There is also a different PEC and EEC controls, more than that, there are -300 series NON-PEC (propeller electronic control)

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/7489663

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6262786

2. ATR 42-500

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6797444

https://www.jetphotos.com/photo/6339119

The first notch in the PL is around 50% - flight idle, the second white line is 68%  - cruise, but there is another detent below the red line that provides 90% - take off.

CLs can be used at 100 % override, or Auto, depending on SOPs.

With the Carenado, the PLs need to be just below the red line, to get 90 % torque for takeoff. This agrees 1005 with the video in my last post.

Edited April 24, 2019 by GeeBee

[FDEdev 955]

??? Where did you see that. Again there is only 1 notch and to me it looks like he advances the PLs until they are in the notch.

I didn't see any PL movement thereafter until the video ends.

Edited April 24, 2019 by FDEdev

[46Pilot 32]

Oh, god...

Please, see this video, it's more clear where the engine control levers are, both the Power Levers and Condition Levers.... It is very clear, Power Levers in the notch (you can see the small white marking) and the Condition Levers in AUTO position....

 

Here's another one:

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by 46Pilot

[FDEdev 955]

@GeeBee, since you are so fixated on SOPs, there's NO SOP which says to advances the PL fully for a normal take off.

[SquawkModeCharlie 32]

Oh boy I hope we get conversations this good once Milviz release their ATR which I assume will be a lot more system heavy 😁.

[46Pilot 32]

33 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

The first notch in the PL is around 50% - flight idle, the second white line is 68%  - cruise, but there is another detent below the red line that provides 90% - take off.

CLs can be used at 100 % override, or Auto, depending on SOPs.

With the Carenado, the PLs need to be just below the red line, to get 90 % torque for takeoff. This agrees 1005 with the video in my last post.

Take it easy, please.

"The first notch in the PL is around 50% - flight idle" - This is NOT a notch. It's clear that you haven't undestood what is the notch.....

"the second white line is 68%  - cruise" - THIS is the notch, but it is NOT for cruise only. You put the levers in the notch at the beginning of takeoff roll and leave them there until descend, if there is no parameter going over the limits.

"there is another detent below the red line that provides 90% - take off." - Are you kidding me?

"CLs can be used at 100 % override, or Auto, depending on SOPs." - Please, show me the respective SOP !!

NOTE: The values of the levers are not in %, but degrees, I've have already told this in the previous posts.... The values of the engine indicators (torque, NP, NH-NL) are in percent.

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by 46Pilot

[GeeBee 5]

Ok.... explain this....

https://youtu.be/YcvvzKXM8Ck

And there are notches..... as I move my throttle it clicks in at flight idle.... and then again at the 68% (T/O) position, and another at around 90%. The last is the only position that provides 100% torque for takeoff.

This 90% point is what they use in the video.

The theory is the TO notch is all you need and the PM control switch is then used for phase of flight .... this worked perfectly in the Flight1 ATR (for FSX), but does not work properly in the Carenado.

 

Edited April 24, 2019 by GeeBee