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Loving this now.

Superb ILS capture, now I actually get to try one !

Really helps when the controllers work properly.

Anyhow, any stuff that can be improved by Carenado via a patch will be welcome.

Did you manage to contact them ?

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1 hour ago, 46Pilot said:

@FDEdev oh yes, they are painted. Also, when advancing the PL to the notch, you have to check the ATPCS arming.

That's interesting. Quite a few planes have the PLAs mentioned in the manuals but none of the ones I've flown have them actually painted.

Concerning the ATPCS arming; I'd guess that you check if it's armed when the PLs are reaching the notch and not at which exact angle.

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@FDEdev the sequence of callouts during takeoff is (this could vary from one operator to another): "start timing, set power". While advancing the throttle towards the notch, CM2 (copilot) verifies the ATPCS is arming according to the procedure and announces "ATPCS armed" and after engine parameters are normal and stabilized, "TO POWER SET".

 

@GeeBee They didn't replied to my email and I've contacted them on facebook, where they said that we might collaborate in the future.

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Hmmm.... the 'public face' on Facebook, but actual support requests ignored .... gee.

What can you say.

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BTW, I notice that the VNAV function actually works in the Carenado SAB.... anyone got it to work in the ATR ?

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17 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Hmmm.... the 'public face' on Facebook, but actual support requests ignored .... gee.

What can you say.

? usually there ticket support system works quite well. Did you open a ticket and if yes, for which issues?

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I was referring to the lack of reponse reported by 46Pilot.

With the world looking - on Facebook - he gets a reply, but an email is ignored.

Make what you will, of that.

I wouldn't waste my time to be honest. I've known Carenado for 10 years.

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2 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

With the world looking - on Facebook - 

Seriously??? LOL

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7 hours ago, GeeBee said:

BTW, I notice that the VNAV function actually works in the Carenado SAB.... anyone got it to work in the ATR ?

The ATR doesn't have VNAV autopilot function, only advisory informations on the EADI.

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I've decided to create a new topic and to have all the discutions regarding the bugs in a single place. I took this decision because there are several topics talking about systems or bugs and there could be informations lost or missed. If someone knows how to contact an admin and to move the posts to a single topic, it will be great. The abovementioned topic is 

Thanks,

All the best, 

Alex

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Posted (edited)

@46Pilot About the whole conversation on the PL notches, is this what you were on about?, CL's in Auto, PL's to white notch?.

IN this CSA Video

 

Edited by SquawkModeCharlie

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Affirm, at minute 1:30 it shows very clear the position of the levers. I saw an youtube clip by carenado where they explain the operation of the prop brake and it's a little bit wrong, as they put the CL in 100%. I've tried to explain them also why this is incorrect, but they don't want to collaborate and to make it accurate, so I think I will make a step back and cancel my intentions.. The idea with CL on 100% OVRD could be an operator procedure, but the manufacturer don't say you have to put the levers there. More than that, there is no normal checklist done by the ATR which says to put CL on 100% OVRD.

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33 minutes ago, 46Pilot said:

I've tried to explain them also why this is incorrect, but they don't want to collaborate and to make it accurate, so I think I will make a step back and cancel my intentions.

I'm in the same boat and it is admittedly a bit frustrating, but we have to bear in mind that they simply don't want to make high quality planes which require a lot of time and money for development.

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Posted (edited)

To be fair guys, I have seen videos and read about different SOPs (sorry !), which suggest that CLs to Auto or 100% override, is acceptable.

Also, PLs on takeoff and climb out, are again, optional.

It may depend on conditions of course.

One video showed takeoff on a very steep runway, at altitude, and they rammed both CL and PLs to max.

I agree with 46Pilot though, that under "normal" conditions.... CLs and PLs should be in Auto / Notch respectively, and the PM control switch will then auto adjust RPM and thus torque, giving around 100% on takeoff, and around 80 to 89% torque for climb and cruise.

If the PLs are NOT in the Notch, the PM dial (with TO, MCT, CLB etc options) simply will NOT have any effect. So, if you prefer, you can simply set the throttles manually to 100% or 89% yourself, and ignore the PM controller, or Notch the levers, and use the PM controller to change thrust automatically. It really makes no difference.

The PLs should only be taken out of the notch, for descent, approach, TOGA or single engine.

Of course extreme conditions where max power is needed, is another matter where max power is the safest strategy.

(I have arrived at these conclusions after watching dozens of RW video of 42s and 72s, and have read manuals from both flightsim ATRs (including the old 'Flight1 ATR' for FS2004 which I had to install get !) .... and RW guides, manuals and company SOPs.)

P.S interestingly, I have been reading up on the SAAB s340, and here, you manually adjust to ensure you max thrust, but only to maintain temperatures in the 850 and 875 C range, below and above (respectively) 15000ft ! So, they are similar free turbine engines, but the approach to flying them differs.

Edited by GeeBee

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Posted (edited)

What would suggest you the name "100% OVRD (override)". It's to override the AUTO mode, when something it's not working as supposed. There are a few situations when you use the CL on 100%, but those are abnormal situations and the checklist will tell you when to use them, as explained before.

To takeoff in "extreme conditions"..... if you kill your engine at takeoff, just to get every horse power available, what do you do with the rest of the flight? There are other actions to be taken for takeoff, for example bleeds off takeoff, limited takeoff weight and others. But, if this is the way you want, ok, go with that, it's just a sim, you won't break anything...

PS: it's my last post on this subject.

Edited by 46Pilot

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Posted (edited)
50 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

1. One video showed takeoff on a very steep runway, at altitude, and they rammed both CL and PLs to max.

2. giving around 100% on takeoff, and around 80 to 89% torque for climb and cruise.

3. Of course extreme conditions where max power is needed

1. Definitely not on a FADEC equipped ATR! 

2. Again and again, no.  Climb (and at lower altitudes cruise) torque is well above 100% and TO = 90%

3. E.g. windshear recovery, but there's NO 'extreme takeoff' where you need max power.

Edited by FDEdev

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@FDEdev leave him alone, it doesn't worth to waste your time with him if it's clear that he doesn't want to learn something and he is trying to convince himself that he is wright.

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I've seen much worse than GeeBee in the last decades and at least he's trying to understand and he tries to learn from various videos and manuals 🙂

There are even people here who are claiming to be FIs and they write incredible nonsense. 

Last but not least, don't forget that you are in a relaxed Carenado, not in a A2A or PMDG forum.

 

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For the love of mike, watch the RW videos instead of thinking you know it all.

And spell correctly, if you want to be taken seriously.

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2 hours ago, FDEdev said:

1. Definitely not on a FADEC equipped ATR! 

2. Again and again, no.  Climb (and at lower altitudes cruise) torque is well above 100% and TO = 90%

3. E.g. windshear recovery, but there's NO 'extreme takeoff' where you need max power.

Wrong on 2 and 3.

And FADEC, no but I corrected it to Performance management which is the same sort of thing.

You are splitting hairs.

Take off is only at the red line if you are at high altitude or on short runway.

Go and watch the videos before you pontificate. I bet you havem't watched one of them.

I'm off to lie down.

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https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.theairlinepilots.com/forumarchive/membersupload/Performance_Manual_-_ATR.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjd3s2UlO7hAhX2SxUIHdZOBPQQFjAAegQIBxAB&usg=AOvVaw0xF8kk9nuWde_zQyC0WxD0

Read it and weep.

Official info from ATR.

Max takeoff is 104, usual and preferred is around 89%

Climb out is around mid 80s.

High alt, uphill, as in one of my above video links, max out to ramp, at around 108.

Carenado have actually modelled it correctly.

 

Oh dear. I've known so many....... blah.

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Please check this document and we will talk after that. You will be looking for "42 PEC" (with blue background) actions. You will also find the differences in operation for all types of the ATR. This is the document underlying daily operation under normal conditions.

https://www.theairlinepilots.com/forumarchive/atr/fctm-norm-proc.pdf

PS: What kind of operations do you want to do, only "Hot and high"?

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Posted (edited)

@46Pilot, I do have to apologize to you. I really underestimated GeeBees arrogance, inability to read performance tables and to believe anything RW airline pilots are trying to tell him. What a …..

Going to ignore him as well from now on. Guys like GeeBee are the reason why I'm trying to refrain from posting as much as possible.

over and out (at least) in this thread.

Edited by FDEdev

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Posted (edited)

Performance limitations of the ATR x-500 engines states....

1. "100% Prop speed (at TO setting in the notch) = max of 90% TQ"

And .... THIS SHOULD ONLY BE USED FOR 5 MINS MAX.

 

2. The MCT setting should only be used if engine out occurs.

In climb, (CL in auto and CLB set, the NP (i.e. prop speed) goes to c 82% (that means circa) ... and the TQ max is 97%.

3. Using a torque above this, is only used at high altitude or temperatures, (as in the video with the sloping runway !!! Yes, the one you clearly haven't watched... as you don't need to as you gave all the answers).

 

As for arrogance, OMG.....  'My' arrogance ?

I have shown you videos of different SOPs, but you deny these exist.

I have shown you ATR manuals that explain that normal takoffs are derated, with higher TQs reserved for high temps and altitudes, or engine outs.

It is your refusal to read, learn and understand, that is arrogant - like Trump, who knows better than scientists AND the CIA, yet has never read a book since college (self admitted).

THAT'S arrogance.

 

I am unsubscribing from this post as there is no reasoning with unreasonable people.

Goodbye, farewell and enjoy the new 1.1 update - the lights still don't work properly !

 

Edited by GeeBee

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