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I believe Laminar knows exactly how valuable a decent weather engine is to both their user base and their sales. It's all down to juggling resources, it's a very small team in terms of game or even flight sim development, but I am pretty sure they already have something cooking. I am also convinced they monitor the add-on community and are at times inspired by that, especially, for example, the shader tweaks X-Vision introduced. I'll just keep my head down and wait for them to show us the goods.

As for X-Enviro, the scenario hasn't really changed. It's the most progressive foray in flight sim weather ever, but it struggles with that ambition in that it's hardly usable in the now. I'd say they need another 1-2 years and handle the transition to Vulkan well - right in time when Laminar might pull up with X-Plane 12. It's a tough business.

 

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Good thoughts Colonel. Laminar does have a small team and I would love to see them add a dedicated developer to head up putting together a decent weather engine that can work with third party developers to create a baseline weather engine feature set that can be extended by third parties. I could imagine that this would be the prominent feature for XP12. 

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On 6/6/2019 at 10:27 AM, france89 said:

I don't share much hope in Austin statement, from what i see he is all over the place with his thoughts and actions too. We heard it all during the year too. procedural seasons, water improvements (remember those test with the waves Ben did quite some time ago?), etc etc. I am thankful for what i get but i expect only marginal things.

Well it is always the problem of long term goals. Priorities change, like now everything hangs a bit on Vulkan, since OpenGL is left by most developers and everything goes to Vulkan.

And now it gets really interesting if they want to keep up OpenGL for a limited time while the Development for Vulkan goes on. I expect more or less a feature freeze in OpenGL with only small improvements and some bigger improvements with Vulkan. But i think the weather model will change in the background. They have to add their compatibility platform GFX into Vulkan so that the 3rd paty developers can start their work. Everyone of them will want to turn off the default weather. So this is a good position to implement a clean interface based on the ideas of the new weather model, so you won't have bigger changes in the near future.They simply turn most of the new functions off for their own weather. Let the 3rd parties play with it and test it and in the background you start a new weather model for X-Plane 12.

It has two advantages: Better motivated 3rd parties. They will debug the new platform but they also have more capabilities than before (which allows them to sell more of their add-ons). They will ask for improvements that will also improve the default X-Plane 12 weather.

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1 hour ago, Oliver Ooi said:

 

Egad, that video is painful to watch.

Austin talking about X-Plane default clouds (before launching xEnviro)..

Quote

 

So today, I'm looking at the X-Plane clouds. Whaaaa... Whaaaa. They're not that great. They're kind of like, okay. I mean, when I look at these, they look all right, but can we do something better? And the answer is, yes we can and we will... IN THE FUTURE!

 

You'd better have that "Future" in mind for XP12, because this isn't really funny at this point.

It was good to hear him acknowledge how thunderstorms are discrete 3D objects, and it can throw 'ya for a loop if you just dip a wing into the vertical convection. Now let's see him take that seriously, and not just gush about eye candy with smoke and mirrors that ignores how X-Plane can't model that thunderstorm he had to MOVE HIS PLANE AROUND to AVOID the DANGER. Because it was a 3D object! 

The worst part...

Towards the end, Austin complains about how xEnviro is getting out of sync with the "clear" weather setting in the sim. Which means he doesn't understand how other weather plugins like ActiveSkyX work either (headslap!). I see clear weather with ActiveSkyX too, Austin, because these companies have to work around your broken weather engine.

And then again... "real weather isn't what we want here." He doesn't understand that xEnviro is real weather only.

It's disappointing that Austin is so clueless in this video about what developers are trying to do, to make up for X-Plane's abysmal weather modeling. Wake up, Austin.

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Posted (edited)

I Take my Hat Off, and exhibit my bald head, to Paraffin for the above post!

Heck Paraffin,  that's paraffin for Austin to skid... 🙂

Actually I think they mess around with weather all of the time, from the overdone effects to the simple interpretation of aviation weather, as we can now see also from an 11.35 supposedly corrected bug:

XPD-8106 Weather screen temp based on sea level not airport

For me when setting T using the UI I always assumed I was setting it for a nearby station, so, reduced to the altitude of that station / airfield ?  No, it was meant to be sea level, and the problem, as Phillip explained at another site / thread is that XP didn't then reduce it to the airfield / station true elevation... So, now it reduces it, but how the heck are the simmers supposed to calculate T to set in the UI ?  They always have to take it from a METAR and then make the calculations for sea level ?

Well...

Edited by jcomm
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6 hours ago, Paraffin said:

It's disappointing that Austin is so clueless in this video about what developers are trying to do, to make up for X-Plane's abysmal weather modeling. Wake up, Austin.

He also had no idea what xEnviro was... This to me was worrying because it would indicate he really is not paying any attention to other developers and the community, and he really should be.

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It looks to me like we’ve been putting way too much faith in Austin and the team to recognize major issues with the platform and correctly identify what so many of us are looking for moving forward.

 

It boggles my mind that a real life pilot like Austin can’t easily see the massive deficiencies they still need to work on. 

 

That video really doesn’t make me optimistic for the future for XP.

 

And this is not the place for it, but this is exactly why many of us were excited to see that new Microsoft announcement. At some point the waiting just is taking too long for certain core things...

 

...and we might be waiting for nothing if he doesn’t even understand what people see as large deficiencies still.

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Posted (edited)

It was clear to me from the Flight Sim Expo presentation that Austin is not interested at all in the same things for X Plane as most other simmers. He very well could be the smartest guy in the room, and his passion is in the physics simulation. That's not a bad thing. The fact that he is able to use XP to help model and design that eVTOL is pretty remarkable.  But his passion is clearly in that  project right now...and probably will remain so for the near future. I have a feeling people complaining about clouds are just a nuisance in his mind.

Edited by snglecoil
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As far as I understood, we wouldn't even have PBR or any of the eye candy improvements if it wasn't for the other guys on his team pushing for it. Probably wouldn't even have begun the Vulkan conversion. We'd still be stuck with that drab, dull look of X-Plane 10 and a very well modeled PT-6.

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12 hours ago, tonywob said:

He also had no idea what xEnviro was... This to me was worrying because it would indicate he really is not paying any attention to other developers and the community, and he really should be.

At 6:50 , "I see it as a cool tech demo..."__Austin Meyer, creator of X-Plane.  What is more worrying is that he has no idea about other weather plugin like Ultra Weather XP, SkyMaxxPro, xAmbience, FSEnhancer, CloudArt. 

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It's kind of like asking Bill Gates if he's heard of "Drive Cleaner XP 4.0". Not a direct comparison, but you get the point. This is a rich guy with rich guy hobbies ("E-VTOL" anyone?), X-Plane clouds really is nothing he loses sleep over, I think he has long passed that torch to Ben - even though X-Plane might still be his main revenue stream.

What worries me more is the fact that this guy, in all his glory, is the overlord of my hobby. You try to forget it, but videos like this one really bring it up again.

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Posted (edited)

With all due respect to all, but if it wasn't for Austin, there would not be xplane, I for one would be stuck with P3D which is in no way an alternative for me, so give the guy credit. 

I could care less if he in particular doesn't not know anything about other plug-ins, as long as Ben, Chris and Philipp know and work with developers is good enough for me.

 

 

 

Edited by CarlosF
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Of course another possibility is that he's trolling us, and the big selling feature in XP12 will be procedural seasons and a great new weather engine. He wants to fool us into thinking he doesn't care about better weather, so he can surprise us later.

We're on to you, Austin.

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, CarlosF said:

With all due respect to all, but if it wasn't for Austin, there would not be xplane, I for one would be stuck with P3D which is in no way an alternative for me, so give the guy credit. 

I could care less if he in particular doesn't not know anything about other plug-ins, as long as Ben, Chris and Philipp know and work with developers is good enough for me.

 

 

 

Carlos I think we all agree the world is better with XP then without, but the way you positioned your comment is a bit of a strawman

We can simultaneously in our head be happy that this simulator exists but also be exceptionally frustrated about where it’s at right now and possibly not going moving forward based on what was in that video. 

Many of us have just been hoping and waiting that weather and ATC, the former in particular, are high priorities as they should be for any simulation at this level of development and stage in its lifecycle.

Austin seems very interested in practicing real life scenarios and that is just really hard to realistically do with this bare-bones antiquated weather system they still have. 

 

 

Edited by irrics
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On 6/12/2019 at 3:12 PM, irrics said:

frustrated about where it’s at right now and possibly not going moving forward.

Same thing was said about xp9, and look where we are now.

Frustration or complaints won't change Austin's roadmap, best we can do is to tag along and be patient, ATC, weather, and what ever else we want will get done eventually.

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15 minutes ago, CarlosF said:

Frustration or complaints won't change Austin's roadmap

I never said it would - lol - just venting a bit I guess.

 

I don't really share your optimism that we'll "get what we want eventually".  Theres' really no guarantee of that at all, especially if the top guy doesn't see the value in many of the features some would like.  It makes it all very much a headwind to getting it done.

 

Hope springs eternal of course...

Cheers

Edited by irrics

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14 minutes ago, irrics said:

I never said it would - lol - just venting a bit I guess.

been there too but then just decided to tag along and be patient, no point in getting my blood pressure spiked for nothing...lol

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9 minutes ago, CarlosF said:

been there too but then just decided to tag along and be patient, no point in getting my blood pressure spiked for nothing...lol

Doesn't spike my BP a bit honestly.

I've learned to expect very little from X-Plane development timelines and it to always take longer and deliver less than perhaps planned.

 

It mainly just bums me out.  They could have totally taken over by now with the long void of MS and the patched together P3D stuff the last 10 years.  Instead, the converts are ripe for the picking by MS next year.

 

Oh well - to your point - tag along and go with w/e works for ya'.

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