Audio for VATSIM Launch Date Announced

[leon310 26]

3 minutes ago, CaptDennison said:

Tried it, it was something I was not interested it at all.

I understand.

[CaptDennison 2]

Just now, leon310 said:

I understand.

Ya, thanks though

[skelsey 765]

Hi @CaptDennison,

No worries - I do totally get that it is hard sometimes to update or leave behind something which otherwise seems satisfactory, which is why I'd rather try and outline why I think it is worthwhile! If it were just a straightforward change of codec but otherwise retained the same basic functionality as the current voice system I wouldn't have thought it was worthwhile breaking everything for that, which is why we really wanted to push the boundaries and create something groundbreaking and really immersion-enhancing.

16 minutes ago, CaptDennison said:

In the real world, aircraft radio transmissions are FAR worse that what is currently on VATSIM as to quality, covered transmissions, whistles, pops, static etc. You say you are adding in  ATC real life features such as these, are you going to include a SQUELCH feature as well?

Now - everybody's experience of this is going to differ but what I can say is that we have had dozens of real-world air traffic controllers and pilots from around the world -- from the FAA, NATS in the UK, Eurocontrol, Greece, Iceland, Australia and many others, as well as airline and GA pilots -- involved throughout the development and their feedback is that what we have created is a very, very close representation of their experiences. There are definite regional differences - as a generalisation the UK and Eurocontrol guys generally felt that it should be clearer, the Athens guys thought it should be much worse and the US guys were somewhere in between, but I think we've found a happy medium which seems to have made all of them happy 🙂

The transmissions do include static (sampled from real recordings from inside actual aircraft, not generated) and range degradation effects - so the further away you get from the source of the transmission the more crackly it becomes until eventually it becomes totally unreadable. This also means that your experience of transmissions is absolutely unique -- if another pilot a long way away from you transmits, you will hear them with lots of static and crackle but a more nearby pilot or controller will hear them much more clearly.

We have also created an HF simulation for long range and Oceanic ATC (which may be a bit closer to your shortwave CB radio that you may be used to from your truck I guess?) which includes even more hiss, whine and crackle. One of the most immersive experiences we had was the other day during a test of the HF simulation when we were coming off the Atlantic (having been on HF) and were handed over to Gander domestic -- when we first called up, out over the Atlantic, the controller was really faint and crackly - but as we got closer to landfall of course the signal improved and became much clearer. It really added to the feeling of being out over the ocean!

The squelch, currently, is automatic - which is in line with all the aviation radios I am familiar with but if you are aware of an aircraft or ATC radio which has a user-controllable squelch do let me know and who knows, it might become an option in future!

32 minutes ago, CaptDennison said:

What about the voice transmissions? Are they going to be sent to Google or some other type to be listened to?

Certainly not! None of the transmissions are recorded and the servers are hosted by VATSIM as an organisation, not any of the AFV team personally.

35 minutes ago, CaptDennison said:

As for Squawkbox. you say download an APP, I saw nothing no where to get such an APP, and by APP do you mean for a Phone device?

If you head to https://audio.vatsim.net you will find more details about how to get set up. Essentially there is a small, lightweight Windows desktop program to download which you will need to run alongside Squawkbox (a bit like you may have used to run Roger Wilco or AVC alongside Squawkbox many years ago). Definitely no phone required!

37 minutes ago, CaptDennison said:

As I said, Only Swift seems to be a FS9 client and it is listed as experimental?

Swift is the only FS9-compatible client which is actually being supported by its developers. As I said earlier, I believe the main reason its FS9 functionality is still listed as Experimental is because they are really short of beta testers with FS9 so they have developed it but they need support from the FS9 community to help refine it. I am not a Swift expert but if you head to the main VATSIM forums there are many people there who would be only too happy to help you get set up with Swift. I totally get why you want to stick with FS9 -- but personally I would say the best way for the FS9 community to ensure that FS9 remains supported by VATSIM is to get on board with Swift and help the Swift development team take their FS9 functionality from 'experimental' to 'rock solid' -- if no FS9 users adopt and support the only client that supports FS9, why would that client's development team stay motivated to include and improve FS9 capability?

Hope that helps and feel free to shout if you have any further questions.

Best,

Simon

[ZLA Steve 370]

10 hours ago, leon310 said:

Vatsim? Vatsim, back in the day use to be fun. Everyone helping everyone. Now, it is a dictatorship. ATC is the dictators that do not know what they are doing, Pilots have no say. Turned into a dog and pony show. Left vatsim and never going back.

I fly on IVAO, it is no better, but no atc in the United States and I do not have to deal with IVAO's dog and pony show and put up with bad ATC.

What is to gain by barking so loudly when you are so vocal about leaving Vatsim behind.

Must miss it, huh? Fear not. You'll be welcomed back with a smile should you choose.

[Captain Kevin 586]

7 hours ago, CaptDennison said:

Thus........if VATSIM really wanted to improve, they would NOT allow a controller to pop online and sit on GROUND when no other ATC is running, thats not realistic. Perhaps VATSIM needs to ensure a CENTER is operating before any other more localized areas run?

The problem in this instance is that a controller always starts from ground when they first become a controller on VATSIM. They have to do this for a certain period of time before they are then tested and then able to control tower. Do that for a certain period of time, get tested, and then move on to departure or approach. Do that for a certain period of time, get tested, then move on to center. What you propose would mean that if somebody who only has the authority to control ground, tower, approach, or departure, they can't because center isn't online. That would essentially mean there are far fewer controllers online. Do keep in mind that people are doing this in their spare time.

[CaptDennison 2]

On 9/30/2019 at 1:54 PM, skelsey said:

Hi @CaptDennison,

No worries - I do totally get that it is hard sometimes to update or leave behind something which otherwise seems satisfactory, which is why I'd rather try and outline why I think it is worthwhile! If it were just a straightforward change of codec but otherwise retained the same basic functionality as the current voice system I wouldn't have thought it was worthwhile breaking everything for that, which is why we really wanted to push the boundaries and create something groundbreaking and really immersion-enhancing.

Now - everybody's experience of this is going to differ but what I can say is that we have had dozens of real-world air traffic controllers and pilots from around the world -- from the FAA, NATS in the UK, Eurocontrol, Greece, Iceland, Australia and many others, as well as airline and GA pilots -- involved throughout the development and their feedback is that what we have created is a very, very close representation of their experiences. There are definite regional differences - as a generalisation the UK and Eurocontrol guys generally felt that it should be clearer, the Athens guys thought it should be much worse and the US guys were somewhere in between, but I think we've found a happy medium which seems to have made all of them happy 🙂

The transmissions do include static (sampled from real recordings from inside actual aircraft, not generated) and range degradation effects - so the further away you get from the source of the transmission the more crackly it becomes until eventually it becomes totally unreadable. This also means that your experience of transmissions is absolutely unique -- if another pilot a long way away from you transmits, you will hear them with lots of static and crackle but a more nearby pilot or controller will hear them much more clearly.

We have also created an HF simulation for long range and Oceanic ATC (which may be a bit closer to your shortwave CB radio that you may be used to from your truck I guess?) which includes even more hiss, whine and crackle. One of the most immersive experiences we had was the other day during a test of the HF simulation when we were coming off the Atlantic (having been on HF) and were handed over to Gander domestic -- when we first called up, out over the Atlantic, the controller was really faint and crackly - but as we got closer to landfall of course the signal improved and became much clearer. It really added to the feeling of being out over the ocean!

The squelch, currently, is automatic - which is in line with all the aviation radios I am familiar with but if you are aware of an aircraft or ATC radio which has a user-controllable squelch do let me know and who knows, it might become an option in future!

Certainly not! None of the transmissions are recorded and the servers are hosted by VATSIM as an organisation, not any of the AFV team personally.

If you head to https://audio.vatsim.net you will find more details about how to get set up. Essentially there is a small, lightweight Windows desktop program to download which you will need to run alongside Squawkbox (a bit like you may have used to run Roger Wilco or AVC alongside Squawkbox many years ago). Definitely no phone required!

Swift is the only FS9-compatible client which is actually being supported by its developers. As I said earlier, I believe the main reason its FS9 functionality is still listed as Experimental is because they are really short of beta testers with FS9 so they have developed it but they need support from the FS9 community to help refine it. I am not a Swift expert but if you head to the main VATSIM forums there are many people there who would be only too happy to help you get set up with Swift. I totally get why you want to stick with FS9 -- but personally I would say the best way for the FS9 community to ensure that FS9 remains supported by VATSIM is to get on board with Swift and help the Swift development team take their FS9 functionality from 'experimental' to 'rock solid' -- if no FS9 users adopt and support the only client that supports FS9, why would that client's development team stay motivated to include and improve FS9 capability?

Hope that helps and feel free to shout if you have any further questions.

Best,

Simon

Yes, it seems I will need to use Swift as it appears to be the only thing left. I hate to tell you this, but there is NOTHING at the VATSIM Support site for users of Squakbox, and I would just love to go to X[Plane 11, but do not have $3000 for a new system to run it with all that is needed for it to LOOK good.

[CaptDennison 2]

On 9/30/2019 at 8:25 PM, Captain Kevin said:

The problem in this instance is that a controller always starts from ground when they first become a controller on VATSIM. They have to do this for a certain period of time before they are then tested and then able to control tower. Do that for a certain period of time, get tested, and then move on to departure or approach. Do that for a certain period of time, get tested, then move on to center. What you propose would mean that if somebody who only has the authority to control ground, tower, approach, or departure, they can't because center isn't online. That would essentially mean there are far fewer controllers online. Do keep in mind that people are doing this in their spare time.

I realize this. It is not an issue when it is at a smaller airport. What I was talking about was filing a flight plan, and going online with VATSIM. then suddenly someone starts Ground, and decides to reroute my trip, and after doing the reroute-I depart, and am flying with no ATC at all, does that make any sense? and of note, I have landed many many times, too many to count where the ground controller simply says taxi to parking instead of taxiway guidance to the gate I requested to go to, thus again why I see no rel reason for a better voice control, nor the newer control supporting squakbox. As I said, I guess my online flying days and my flying with my Virtual Airline are about to come to an abrupt end, And that means just one less activity I am able to enjoy anymore. Thanks to all for the replies. Still going to try for a work around for FA(m as I said I do not have the cash flow to have a new computer built to move to FSX or Xplane.

[skelsey 765]

1 hour ago, CaptDennison said:

there is NOTHING at the VATSIM Support site for users of Squakbox

In the menu on the left hand side there are links for users of all the current pilot clients: vPilot, xPilot, xSquawkbox (for X-Plane), swift and others (i.e. anything which is not the above, so Squawkbox and FSINN).

https://audio.vatsim.net/docs/1.0/pilots/others

Quote

In order to use FSINN/SB, you will need to download and install the Audio for VATSIM standalone client.

The standalone client will be available for download here from the 11th October.

You will have to run the standalone alongside FSINN/SBto use new voice.

 

[Captain Kevin 586]

17 hours ago, CaptDennison said:

What I was talking about was filing a flight plan, and going online with VATSIM. then suddenly someone starts Ground, and decides to reroute my trip, and after doing the reroute-I depart, and am flying with no ATC at all, does that make any sense?

Can't say I've ever had that happen before, so this is a new one.

17 hours ago, CaptDennison said:

I have landed many many times, too many to count where the ground controller simply says taxi to parking instead of taxiway guidance to the gate I requested to go to

Can't say I've had this happen too often if I ever had it happen at all. I guess this depends on where you fly.

[fluffyflops 1,858]

went off tonight.  good luck to the team transferring the data.

all the kids on London where shouting down the frequency "allu akabar" as it went down.  sad sad sad. what a mess.

once the unicom voice is up i dread to think whats going to happen with davies,chewy and others fly online and their little fan club go with them and start shouting down the new voice unicom as they did tonight when the servers where being taken down.

on a positive note, i think the new audio codec is a huge step forward.  Just need pilot ratings now for GIB,INN,SZG.  etc etc to stop the 9 year ols doing touch and gos in 747s.. oh well wishfull thinking

 

Edited October 13, 2019 by fluffyflops

[ShortyME 0]

On 9/30/2019 at 10:13 PM, skelsey said:

That said, at some point in the future there really will be no option to update because things like smoother aircraft position updates really won't be compatible with the abandoned clients. Swift does, from what I understand, work with FS9 and I know the team really would appreciate more FS9 users giving them feedback to improve it - from what I can gather the main reason FS9 functionality is still listed as 'experimental' is because they literally could not find any FS9 users to help with testing it.

Hi there,

I haven`t used in a while the sim and the vatsim network due to lack of time and I see that a some things have changed. SQUAWKBOX not connecting anymore, unfortunately ! I also use FS9 because i invested lots of add-ons in it and it works fine on my computer.  The problem is that, with this new SWIFT software I cannot connect my sim to VATSIM even after I followed all the steps and troubleshooted everything I could think of. I understand from this post that the Swift team lacks in FS9 users for feedback. I could help if I would know where to address them. On their website I didn`t understand anything on where to send them a message. I don`t have much spare time but I can do my best for me and for the rest of FS9 users. My problem is that in the Swift`s "simulator" settings I have only X plane and P3D options and FS9 is not even shown as experimental. So if you can help me out in trying to solve this I would do my best ! Thank you !

[skelsey 765]

Hi @ShortyME,

The best place to start is probably the Swift section of the main VATSIM forums (here) -- the developers monitor that and should get back to you.

I'll see what else I can find out for you as well!

Best,

Simon

[ShortyME 0]

Thanks Skelsey, I`ll check it out and see if we can sort it out !