Do you currently use VR in your current flight sim?

[Reader 2,021]

14 hours ago, n4gix said:

Maybe it would have been clearer to simply ask "Do you own VR equipment?" Yes or No

No, because I do own VR equipment but don't use it!

BTW Maybe you also should start a poll about who uses ATC...? 😉 

EDIT

 

Edited October 10, 2019 by Reader

[Farlis 2,281]

13 hours ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

I would have thought non-flat runways (as in easy to develop and works with AI) would have been at the top as I know that's been requested many times for P3D. 

There is no need to request something that is already in the new sim. 😉

[Airmail-Pilot 10]

IMHO, this poll was put together way too hastily.  One supporting argument is that, taken literally, it asks, "How many people currently use VR?" with the (senseless, for that question) options "Yes" and "No".  And, while the thread/poll title suggests that the poll applies to flight sim use of VR, the actual question would, as written, be logically interpreted as asking about use of VR with any app.

I think this poll would have been much better with the question "How would you describe your situation?", with options like this:

• I do not own VR hardware and have no plans to buy it.
• I do not own VR hardware but expect to buy some within { insert some sensible time period, e.g. 6 months }.
• I do not own VR hardware but expect to buy some no sooner than { same time period as above } from now.
• I own VR hardware and use it with 1 or more flight sims.
• I own VR hardware, do not use it for any flight sims, but do use it with other VR apps.
• I own VR hardware but am not currently using it with any apps.

Even that poll is imperfect in various ways, but it would be far more useful than the existing poll.

And suggesting that comments in a poll be disallowed is silly.  It's so difficult for a poll's options to cover all people's situations that an explanatory comment is frequently useful, necessary, and/or enlightening.

[vortex681 806]

I can't believe that there's another pointless poll here! It's pointless because all of the VR users will vote because they want to appear to have significant numbers and non-VR users will probably think there's not much point because it doesn't achieve anything. Whatever the poll says (unless VR users come out as a very small minority), we know that VR usage in flight sims is small. I have absolutely nothing against VR, but the poll results here are simply exaggerating the apparent proportion of forum members who use it. The poll doesn't actually tell us anything about the proportion of members using VR headsets, just the number (out of the many, many thousands of members here) who do.

In surveys which looked at several different aspects of the flight sim hobby (and had no particular VR emphasis or agenda), VR usage in sims was at best around 10% and at worst less than 5% depending on which survey you read. I get that if you use a VR headset you want support for it to be included in the new sim but you also need to accept the fact that you constitute only a small minority of the flight sim community, no matter how vocal or evangelical about VR you are. Making it look as though there is a large proportion of the community using VR doesn't actually make it so. The only way to have a poll which was in any way representative would be if you were somehow able to poll all members.

The only way to put this into perspective is, when this poll finally closes, to look at the total number (not percentage) of people who said they use VR and then relate that to the total number of Avsim members. Any other way of doing it is simply not realistic or representative.

14 hours ago, Rob_Ainscough said:

That is interesting, wonder where MS got that data point from?   Steam indicates VR usage is microscopic ... < 4% as I recall.

It's much less than that! If you add up all of the VR stats in the latest Steam Hardware survey it shows that only fractionally over 1% of gamers in the survey use VR headsets. That figure hasn't changed significantly for quite some time.

If there's another publicly available VR data set relating specifically to PC gamers (and not just global sales of hardware) other than the Steam, Navigraph or X-plane surveys, someone should post a link to it here for comparrison.

Edited October 10, 2019 by vortex681

[Casualcas 830]

3 hours ago, vortex681 said:

I can't believe that there's another pointless poll here!

Can I ask a simple question? If its pointless,  why are you writing a dissertation and claiming the world is going to pot "cats and dogs living together,  mass hysteria" give me proof. Please brother. 😞

Edited October 10, 2019 by n4gix
REMOVED EXCESSIVE QUOTE!!! Please stop quoting the entire post you are replying to!

[Mengy 814]

I do not use VR for any gaming, never have, but it's not because I wouldn't like to.  Fact is my PC is over 9 years old and it doesn't have the horsepower to do VR justice.

While the poll's results are obviously skewed and we all know the reality is far far less VR usage than indicated, I still think MFS should strive to support VR anyway for one simple reason: VR adoption is growing.  As better headsets become more affordable, and as people's PC's become newer and upgraded and stronger, more and more people will start using VR in the very near future.  MFS supporting it sooner rather than later future proofs it for a growing segment of the market.

I know I plan to build a new PC power monster when MFS releases, and its very likely I'll be getting a VR headset soon after I have a PC which can use it.  Not just for MFS but for Elite Dangerous too, which according to a few of my friends is one of the best games to make use of VR today.  MFS could very easily take that crown in my opinion, but only if it actually includes VR support.

I'd like to see VR implemented, even though I don't currently use it.

Edited October 10, 2019 by Mengy

[Airmail-Pilot 10]

15 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

I get that if you use a VR headset you want support for it to be included in the new sim but you also need to accept the fact that you constitute only a small minority of the flight sim community, [...]

Like this poll, you seem to (continually, in your case) ignore folks like me who do not own VR hardware but still want VR support in MSFS2020 (etc).  I have no idea how many people are in that situation, but I know that the number is not zero.

[nickhod 425]

6 hours ago, GCBraun said:

No idea what you are talking about XP's VR there. Yes, it is not as performant as Aerofly, but I get much better frames than with P3D and, of course, the touch control implementation is very good.

You have a great system spec and that kind of hardware outlay is needed for acceptable VR in XP.

I'm in the process of upgrading my i5 6800 and GTX 1070. Not a terrible system spec by normal gaming standards. This runs all other VR games fine, usually at 90fps, but XP VR is unusable. I get around 25fps with no add-ons which is nauseating, quite literally.

Having such high end hardware requirements will no doubt hurt VR adoption with XP.

 

[vortex681 806]

1 minute ago, Casualcas said:

Can I ask a simple question? If its pointless,  why are you writing a dissertation and claiming the world is going to pot "cats and dogs living together,  mass hysteria" give me proof. Please brother. 😞

Its my (probably futile) attempt to add some logic and perspective to the VR discussion.

Please point out the errors in what I said. Please also point out where I said "the world is going to pot "cats and dogs living together, mass hysteria" give me proof"? It's this sort of emotive, exaggerated posting that's just stirring up the debate for no good reason.

[vortex681 806]

22 minutes ago, Mengy said:

While the poll's results are obviously skewed and we all know the reality is far far less VR usage than indicated, I still think MFS should strive to support VR anyway for one simple reason: VR adoption is growing.

I completely agree that MS should support VR and, contrary to what others here seem to be implying, I have actually said as much in other posts. VR adoption is, indeed, growing, but just not nearly as quickly, particularly in the gaming world, as some would have us believe. Global VR sales may be increasing but the figures generally include all headsets, including standalone and console variants, and a significant number of those sales go to commercial/trainIng organisations and not solely to gamers. VR has been touted as the next big gaming revolution for the past few years but has yet to achieve the necessary sales and success to fully justify this claim.

Edited October 10, 2019 by vortex681

[nickhod 425]

12 minutes ago, vortex681 said:

Please point out the errors in what I said.

I think it's quite possible that of the users that regularly read and post to this particular sub-forum (MSFS), which seem to number about 300 - 500, a significant proportion are VR enthusiasts.

The results are valid within the set being sampled.

I agree that says nothing about the entire future user base of MSFS, or of other flight sims, and is therefore probably irrelevant.

At a stretch you could conclude that "people who are highly interested in MSFS are more likely than average to use VR".

[vortex681 806]

31 minutes ago, nickhod said:

The results are valid within the set being sampled.

I'm not even sure that half (or much more, if the result of the other poll is to be believed) of the people posting in this sub-forum are VR users. But, even if they are, the results are in no way representative of Avsim, or the flight sim community as a whole, so what do they actually achieve?

31 minutes ago, nickhod said:

I agree that says nothing about the entire future user base of MSFS, or of other flight sims, and is therefore probably irrelevant

Which has been exactly my point all along! Having these polls, particularly one specifically about VR usage is pointless to anyone other than a VR user (who is much more likely to participate).

None of the points you've raised have highlighted errors in my original post which is what I'd asked for in the part of the post you quoted. I was trying to give a balanced, alternative view to that given by those with VR hardware who are, understandably, very enthusiastic about it.

Edited October 10, 2019 by vortex681

[Flybynumbers 42]

Obviously VR is the future if you look at flyinside. I would prefer to have gloves instead of wands however. We will have to see if MSFT can step up to the plate. Actually I'm surprised Avsim doesn't have a flyinside forum.

 

Edited October 10, 2019 by Jim Young
Video removed as it does not meet AVSIM Standards. The narrator gave an obscene gesture with his middle finger on both hands.

[HiFlyer 9,358]

And thus you see why I didn't bother voting. I went into the first poll believing in the sincerity of its intent.

In this second poll. I suspected a particular result was the goal, and if that result was not attained, then the poll would once again automatically be repudiated by some. Or in other words, why even bother?

[skully 1,045]

6 hours ago, Thac said:

The Pimax 8K-X have 4K screens per eye and 170 degree horizontal FOV (will release in december 2019). My 2080Ti/9900K combo can run this. In one year (when MSFS2020 is released) I can upgrade my 2080Ti .... so running dual 4K screens in VR is doable. And what about the VR hardware in 2 years - and still no VR support in MSFS2020?

I will ignore the "Nice attempt though at being provocative" insult. 

No insult intended to your offensive and entitled statement that MSFS should be delayed because a niche group doesn't get the feature THEY want at release.

Calm down, you'll get your vr support.

3 hours ago, Vindeballe said:

and what is the price for upgrading hardware every year?

"Pimax is bringing more of its “8K” model headsets to market this year with the entrance of the $1,300 “8K” X and the $1,000 “8K” Plus."

https://www.roadtovr.com/pimax-8kx-8kplus-launch-dates/

Add to that another $1400 for a 2080ti.