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Guest davewins

FSX - Retail - Performance impressions

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"It's really going to make ME upgrade to vista whether it helps the game or not"????!!!!-------------------------------------------If it doesn't have a VC I won't be concerned :)

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>This has been hashed over so many times I am reluctant to>mention it again but the science is that the human eye is>incapable of detecting FPS much in excess of 25 and certainly>not above 30.It is an urban myth and it is entirely untrue.I quote from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frame_rate:"Few people perceive flicker above about 75 hertz.These rates would be impractical for the actual frame rate of most film mechanisms so the shutter in the projection devices is actually arranged to interrupt the light two or three times for every film frame. In this fashion, the common frame rate of 24 fps (frames per second) produces 48 or 72 pulses of light per second, the latter rate being above the flicker fusion rate for most people most of the time.Video systems frequently use a more complex approach referred to as interlaced video. Broadcast television systems such as NTSC, PAL, and SECAM produce an image using two passes called fields. Each field contains half of the lines in a complete frame (the odd-numbered lines or the even-numbered lines). Thus, while only using the bandwidth of 25 or 30 complete frames per second, they achieve a flicker fusion frequency of 50 or 60 Hz."Summarizing, the perceived frame rate of a film is 48 or 72 (not 24), while the perceived frame rate of a TV is 50 or 60 (not 25 or 30).Other details here as well:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flicker_fusion_thresholdhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistence_of_visionAnd whatever anyone says, I know I CAN tell the difference between 30 and 40 FPS, or between 40 and 60 FPS. I'm sure you can too if you try.Marco


"The problem with quotes on the Internet is that it is hard to verify their authenticity." [Abraham Lincoln]

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Can someone please post some screens of the high detail cities and/or aiports please? (Maybe with FPS showing as well.)Thanks.


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Guest davewins

why is that hard to understand?? Who wouldn't want a new operating system?? Basically what I am saying is they got me sold on vista already. It's not like I'm going to get vista in attempt to make the game run better and then realize it doesn't and be screwed. We are talking a brand new operating system. Why wouldn't I want vista????

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Guest davewins

>Can someone please post some screens of the high detail>cities and/or aiports please? (Maybe with FPS showing as>well.)>>Thanks. I will try....I will go to jfk and take off with everything pretty much maxed.

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>why is that hard to understand?? Who wouldn't want a new>operating system?? Basically what I am saying is they got me>sold on vista already. It's not like I'm going to get vista>in attempt to make the game run better and then realize it>doesn't and be screwed. We are talking a brand new operating>system. Why wouldn't I want vista????Someone posted here a bench mark on how FS9/FSX runs in XP and Vista. He said, that It ran poorly under Vista than it did in XP.Would that be a consideration for you?Manny


Manny

Beta tester for SIMStarter 

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Guest davewins

and how did he get the chance to play a game that just came out on an operating system that hasn't come out.I would have to speculate that vista is still in production. Would love to see links to correct me on that. Thanks.Just seems to me that it should play well on vista and be made for vista because I don't have a bad cpu. My ram I can upgrade and video card but I don't see me doing that and making this game play that much better. I am running a velocity micro intel core 2 duo processor (2 2.13 ghz processors) 1gb ram (which I should upgrade) and a geforce 7600gs (which I should definetley upgrade). If upgrading the video card to something really good and ram then that's what I'll do but I have spent a lot of money in the last 3 weeks so I might want to hold off until Vista comes out.

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Guest bigun

"and how did he get the chance to play a game that just came out on an operating system that hasn't come out"My assumption would be that he used the Vista beta that's been out for months. Won't give a good representation of how it will run in final release of Vista since no DX10 etc.

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Guest davewins

>"and how did he get the chance to play a game that just came>out on an operating system that hasn't come out">>My assumption would be that he used the Vista beta that's been>out for months. >>Won't give a good representation of how it will run in final>release of Vista since no DX10 etc. Thank you George!!This is coming straight from the readme of fsx deluxe version that I bought yesterday."Flight Simulator X is designed to run on the Windows Vista operating system. Flight Simulator X was released prior to the completion of Windows Vista."Right there it says 2 important things. It was designed for Windows Vista and it was released prior to the COMPLETION OF WINDOWS VISTA.

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Guest av84fun

<>Hi Jimmy. You have the correct "sense" of this issue but are overstating the benefits as fps rise above 30. In a significant study done by Worcester Polytechnic and the University of Massachusetts (see link below) there is a very minor performance improvement from 30-60 fps.Their study used first person shooter games for the following reason. Sense people are individuals what one person "likes" may be different from what another person "likes."So, they used shoot games where the thesis was if you SEE better, you will SHOOT better...more accurately. Each person interacted with the game at progressively higher fps so the data weren't skewed by a given person being a better shooter, fundamentally, than the others.I can't copy the performance graph (but see link below) but on the left scale, the shooting score is depicted from zero to 4. On the bottom scale, FPS are depicted.Of course, starting with very low FPS, the scores were terrible...about 0.5. As the FPS increased to 30 the performance scale rose almost vertically. But at the 30 FPS level, the performance virtually flat lined rising from only about 3.3-3.5 or only about 6% with a DOUBLING in the FPS to 60.We all see differently and are bothered more or less by blurries and stutters. Personally, I can live with a certain level of blurriness because the real world of aviation is blurry most of the time due to atmospheric conditions even on supposedly clear days but STUTTERS drive me nuts and are unacceptable. Others can live with a stutter or two if they have less blurries...and the beat goes on.But aside from personal taste and the fact that some enormously small percentage of the FS community have EAGLE EYE vision and can actually detect a 6% improvement from 30-60 FPS...the fact is that almost no one can and if you are getting 30, count your blessings and if you are getting 25+ stutter free you should turn your attentions away from improving that to improving...say, global warming.Regards,Jimhttp://web.cs.wpi.edu/~claypool/papers/fr-rez/paper.pdf

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>Hi Jimmy. You have the correct "sense" of this issue but are>overstating the benefits as fps rise above 30. In a>significant study done by Worcester Polytechnic and the>University of Massachusetts (see link below) there is a very>minor performance improvement from 30-60 fps.Interesting study.I would agree that there is probably not much of an improvement in "accuracy" or "skill" within a game from 30-60fps, but I would argue that there is an improvement in immersion through a sense of fluidity. The study talks about that as well, but maybe some people are more sensitive to it than others.But, yeah, I'd be thrilled to hold steady in FS9 under all conditions at 30fps (and I don't stand a chance in FSX). With a detailed add-on aircraft at a detailed airport I am in the low 20's, and there's a big difference between that and 30 or 40.But them, on my commodore64 playing the FS2 I was getting what ... 2FPS?

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I recently bought a Geforce 6800 GS video card. Not a top of the line card--been around for awhile. On the box there are two labels--one reads "Built for Microsoft Windows Vista" and the one next to it reads "Designed for Microsoft Windows XP."It's all just marketing. I'll stick with the developer's comments indicating that FSX is DirectX 9 game.Randall

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Guest davewins

>I recently bought a Geforce 6800 GS video card. Not a top of>the line card--been around for awhile. On the box there are>two labels--one reads "Built for Microsoft Windows Vista" and>the one next to it reads "Designed for Microsoft Windows XP.">>It's all just marketing. I'll stick with the developer's>comments indicating that FSX is DirectX 9 game.>>RandallSo be it. I honestly think this game is too much for windows xp. Why are people having trouble playing this game with brand new computers and the best graphics cards?? Because DX10 is not out yet and that's what this was made for....DX10 and Windows Vista. I might just put aside fsx and try out fs9 for the next couple months until vista is released and then upgrade my graphics card and ram.

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