Completing System etc happens on some airports - solution

[Skywolf 992]

Hi guys,

I just got this addon, and I did notice that on some airport voxatc just boots up fine and some airports it is stuck on Completing System.

Here is what I have found.

Airports with Ground tower etc - Voxatc starts up fine without having a flightplan loaded.

On airports with no Ground tower (smaller GA airports) - it needs a flightplan of sorts to have it bypass the Completing system hangup.

I do not know if this is a bug or a feature but this should help you guys out - I was figuring this by reading the forums and trial and error.

Hope this tidbit helps you out.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Skywolf

[Polymerman 70]

Hi Skywolf, 

Size doesn't matter in most things and it doesn't matter in which airports work within VoxAtc!😁

VOXATC needs several things to work correctly or you'll get the dreaded error messages.

1.The VOX Navdata must be assigned from Level D Nav data.

2. In that folder the Airport.xml  must be listed for the airports you wish to use.

3. Also in that Navdata folder, the Airports.dat file must have the airports you wish to use.

Also remember run the indexer so that the newer data is in the system..

Hope this helps too!

 

 

[vadriver 247]

On 12/5/2019 at 3:12 PM, Polymerman said:

2. In that folder the Airport.xml  must be listed for the airports you wish to use.

rich

did you not mean the "WPNAVAPT.txt" file ..... similar to the "airports.dat" but with ILS data.

ps keeping cool as jay is in the north east ??

[Polymerman 70]

John,

I missed mentioning that one, thanks. 

Too cold so soon in the year!   Hope the heat isn't getting you too bad.

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

On 12/4/2019 at 12:40 PM, Skywolf said:

Hi guys,

I just got this addon, and I did notice that on some airport voxatc just boots up fine and some airports it is stuck on Completing System.

Here is what I have found.

Airports with Ground tower etc - Voxatc starts up fine without having a flightplan loaded.

On airports with no Ground tower (smaller GA airports) - it needs a flightplan of sorts to have it bypass the Completing system hangup.

I do not know if this is a bug or a feature but this should help you guys out - I was figuring this by reading the forums and trial and error.

Hope this tidbit helps you out.

If you have an ORBX account, there's a post with a quote from the VOXATC developer that explains IFR clearance at non-towered airports:

https://orbxsystems.com/forum/topic/80446-voxatc-in-orbx-country/?do=findComment&comment=738870

 

Basically it says:

Quote

The developper was kind enough to answer me  :

"If you're flying from a Non-Towered airport, VoxATC assumes you have got your clearance (as planned) over the phone before starting your flight."

So you cannot call the FSS to get the clearance and consequently you don't get a squawk code. This is weird as it flawlessly works for a VFR clearance.

That isn't really an answer to the OP's question, but it didn't warrant a new thread either. The answer to that question is that at a non-towered airport you need either an IFR or a VFR flightplan. I guess that the developer feels that it's bad practice at a non-towered airport to takeoff and just wander around.🤔

 

20 hours ago, vadriver said:

rich

did you not mean the "WPNAVAPT.txt" file ..... similar to the "airports.dat" but with ILS data.

ps keeping cool as jay is in the north east ??

I thought that is a PMDG file. How exactly does VOXATC use it  (and also WPNAVAID.TXT) and what folder should they be in? Mine are in <drive:>\Program Files\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D v4\PMDG\NavData. Anyway these two files (and both the LevelD navdata and C:\Users\Jay Bloomfield\AppData\Roaming\Internal Workings\VoxATC P3D 4\apdata folders) aren't needed if one has fsaerodata installed, as the default P3d4 navaid database is constantly kept up to date with latest AIRAC. 

BTW, it's been around 50°F here the past few days and the weather is more like the December weather at our other place in WA.☔

[Polymerman 70]

Hello Jay,

Thanks for the information.  I don't quite understand how FSAerodata will take the place of the VoxAtc Navdata folder. 

I thought that the Navdata folder in Internal Workings/ VoxATC P3D 4 was the only data VoxAtc uses and gets that data from a LevelD.

Could you please clarify.

[vadriver 247]

rich / jay

pondering the above ..... it's closer to 40^o so need a few more to help.

i think we need to consolidate our thinking & promote this "abandoned" masterpiece so more can "appreciate" its worth ie it is not for the "candy" one may want / expect but the reality.

hope that makes sense  at 0936Z

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

10 hours ago, Polymerman said:

Hello Jay,

Thanks for the information.  I don't quite understand how FSAerodata will take the place of the VoxAtc Navdata folder. 

I thought that the Navdata folder in Internal Workings/ VoxATC P3D 4 was the only data VoxAtc uses and gets that data from a LevelD.

Could you please clarify.

Most of these extra folders and files are holdovers from FSX and VOXATC 6. With P3d4, VOXATC just uses the default sim navigation database, which can include an individual airport's SIDs and STARs (unlike FSX which has no provision for storing SIDs and STARs in an airport BGL file). If the sim's database is completely updated by fsaeordata, it will match the same Navigraph AIRAC included with most aircraft FMCs and GPS gauges. It doesn't hurt anything to also have the LevelD folder active.

 

[Polymerman 70]

Jay,

Thanks for the reply and explanation!  I'm purchasing FsAerodata due to your posting.

[Skywolf 992]

aren't there some issues with FSaerodata and P3D4.5HF2 - especially HF2 here.  I remember reading FSAerodata dev post that sceneries have to above it in scenery order and this does not work well with third party addon.

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

Without warning LM changed how airport elevations were prioritized in P3d 4.5 HF2. This eliminated the need for those altitude correction ALT BGL files. fsaerodata  recommends placing your 3rd party airport files at a higher priority than the fsaeordata files to avoid airport elevation issues. If one wants to have the fsaerodata AIRAC apply to all airports, one must run  a utility provided by fsaerodata as documented on their official support forum.

[Mad_Mac 21]

On 12/9/2019 at 8:11 PM, jabloomf1230 said:

. I guess that the developer feels that it's bad practice at a non-towered airport to takeoff and just wander around.🤔

LOL, it was how I was trained. For Local flights (practice) I don’t know any pilots who file a flight plan. My instructor never did it, I don’t do it, and none of my pilot friends do either. I  have a standard flight to a local airport saved, which I use to keep VoxATC happy. It doesn’t seem to care that I don’t fly to the specified airport. If I contact Unicom on the CATF, I can self announce, get myself into the pattern, and land, just like real life. 

[vadriver 247]

On 12/14/2019 at 2:21 AM, jabloomf1230 said:

If one wants to have the fsaerodata AIRAC apply to all airports

jay

are you still of a "mixed opinion" as to whether voxatc reads the fsad approach files adequately if at all.

my "best" experience (& the only way to be offered rnav approaches which are rarely included in an afcad, either stock or addon) is to import the fsad approach file into one's "highest priority" afcad, deleting existing out of date & /or duplicates and even culling approaches that may not be used by your aircraft's category.

the above followed noticing the only airports i was offered rnav's for were those few (T2G's) which included (though out of date) rnav's in their afcad ...... & with fsad proc folders enabled.

consequently, i have disabled the those folders from "direct" use.

appreciate your/others thinking on this.

[jabloomf1230 2,445]

VOXATC 7 was specifically updated for P3d 4.x, so one would have to believe that it is capable of reading a third party airport BGL file that contains SIDs and STARs. That also means that VOXATC 7 can read SIDs and STARs from the fsaerodata PROC files. It's also possible that VOXATC 7 still reads SIDs and STARs from the LevelD 767 navidata folder. So the question becomes, which of the three sources takes precedence? I don't think that there is any way of us users knowing the answer to that question. I asked Jose Rubio of fsaerodata that question at one point and he wasn't sure either. And he had been in communication with Tegwyn West.😲

So what's a user to do? Your method certainly would work, but you have to update the airport BGL file if the SIDs and STARs change in a new AIRAC. Other than that, if fsaerodata's files are the highest priority in the scenery library, its procedures would take precedent. Since the LevelD 767 navidata and fsaerodata are always at the same AIRAC, whether one or the other is used (and we users will never know for sure), it really doesn't matter. I have never experimented with temporarily inactivating either fsaerodata PROC files or the LevelD 767 navidata, so I can't answer that question from first hand experience. All I know is that with both sources active, VOXATC finds the correct SIDs and STARs for my airports.

[vadriver 247]

11 hours ago, vadriver said:

whether voxatc reads the fsad approach files adequately if at all.

jay

my earlier was about the files of the folder "PROC" (approaches for many airports including my few regulars), not those of "PROC_SID" (stars for a few & sids for even less .... and not including airports i have ever flown to/from with voxatc 742).

my experience which i'm basing on is that both before & with fsad, i have always received sids & stars (including my  tweaks) from the LDS airac (not from fsad as i did not tweak them). what i can't say is what i will receive without the airac ..... but i'll check for sanity's sake.

but it is because i received rnav approaches at some airports, for example T2G's KSEA, i began to wonder why not at other airports (although they are included in fsad). it is because the example has the subject approaches included by its developer in its afcad & where my other airport's developer/s have not (ie voxatc does not use the LDS airac for approaches)

it is no big task to copy fsad's approaches to an afcad when & if they (rarely / infrequently) change, though the initial update is a tad nuisance ..... but i will also check again what transpires if i delete all approaches from an afcad.

for now, thanks for your thoughts on this.