If Laminar Research could add all the real liveries they have on the X-plane 11 737, 747 and MD-80, then i don't see why MS couldn't do the same.

Uhm, why do you need Microsoft/Asobo to paint airline liveries? You think the thousands of free liveries in Avsim's own library were painted by Microsoft, Lockheed Martin or Laminar Research?

 

I have always painted my own liveries and manually added them to the jets in my own copies of whatever sim I used, be it FS2004, FSX or P3D.

In all honesty I have never but only thrice asked airlines for their help. Two of them were not able to provide copies of said graphics but were perfectly fine with me replicating them using real photos. The third did provide everything I needed through a .zip file!

 

And keep in mind the airlines I'm talking about are major airlines.

 

The only one issue regarding liveries I have ever heard of was the Continental 777 Peter Max. If memory serves me well the copyright owner was against anyone reproducing his livery

I don't know if those who still did it got in trouble over it or not.

Interesting question.

Also, if the new aircraft models are based on procedural texturing, instead of the texture sheets of today, how will this impact the ability to make freeware liveries for AI aircraft? 

18 hours ago, DreamSkywards said:

Uhm, why do you need Microsoft/Asobo to paint airline liveries? You think the thousands of free liveries in Avsim's own library were painted by Microsoft, Lockheed Martin or Laminar Research?

 

I have always painted my own liveries and manually added them to the jets in my own copies of whatever sim I used, be it FS2004, FSX or P3D.

Well, I would think that most people would rather not paint liveries and/or manually install liveries for the hundreds of airlines around the World.  I’d rather be flying.

3 hours ago, ual763 said:

Well, I would think that most people would rather not paint liveries and/or manually install liveries for the hundreds of airlines around the World.  I’d rather be flying.

And how exactly should Microsoft go about getting permission from the "hundreds of airlines around the world"? What about those who are no longer part of the "hundreds" you speak of? No airline that went belly up, no private jet liveries? You can't expect Microsoft or Asobo to do all of that work for you.

 

You don't have to paint them either, but you may or may not have to manually install them. Depends if Microsoft releases a small utility tool to install, for example, manually downloaded .zip files or something.

 

But that's how it was for P3D, X-Plane and etc. You either painted them, or installed them...or they came along addons, but even with addons the livery count was limited, so they provided paint kits. Do you even know how the livery sistem worked on these sims?

Edited December 8, 20196 yr by DreamSkywards

16 minutes ago, DreamSkywards said:

And how exactly should Microsoft go about getting permission from the "hundreds of airlines around the world"? What about those who are no longer part of the "hundreds" you speak of? No airline that went belly up, no private jet liveries? You can't expect Microsoft or Asobo to do all of that work for you.

Microsoft is more than capable of negotiating with airlines, if it's a priority. Maybe it's not! It clearly wasn't in past iterations of their flightsim. But this idea that they couldn't secure permissions from airlines if they actually cared to is hilarious to me. We're talking about a massive corporation (one of the world's largest) that is offering to put your airline's brand in their game that's going to reach tens of millions. You really think most of them would say no? (I'm leaving aside here the possibility that Microsoft would offer some small licensing fee to sweeten the deal, of course.) And you really think Microsoft couldn't ultimately convince a reasonable quantity of them to give that permission?

Trademarks are tricky, but mostly with stuff like this is tricky exactly because the little people don't have the resources and institutional clout to take a risk or deal directly with the trademark holders. Microsoft has both, in spades. While I'm not holding my breath and fully expect us little people to have to go in and put the liveries in ourselves, just like we always have, Microsoft could make all our lives that much easier if they really wanted to. Wouldn't that be nice!

James

11 minutes ago, honanhal said:

Microsoft is more than capable of negotiating with airlines, if it's a priority. Maybe it's not! It clearly wasn't in past iterations of their flightsim. But this idea that they couldn't secure permissions from airlines if they actually cared to is hilarious to me. We're talking about a massive corporation (one of the world's largest) that is offering to put your airline's brand in their game that's going to reach tens of millions. You really think most of them would say no? (I'm leaving aside here the possibility that Microsoft would offer some small licensing fee to sweeten the deal, of course.) And you really think Microsoft couldn't ultimately convince a reasonable quantity of them to give that permission?

Trademarks are tricky, but mostly with stuff like this is tricky exactly because the little people don't have the resources and institutional clout to take a risk or deal directly with the trademark holders. Microsoft has both, in spades. While I'm not holding my breath and fully expect us little people to have to go in and put the liveries in ourselves, just like we always have, Microsoft could make all our lives that much easier if they really wanted to. Wouldn't that be nice!

James

You know, as long as Microsoft/Asobo does not take away my ability to add my own liveries, I'm fine with whatever they do.

Hugh Mungus Airlines

1 hour ago, honanhal said:

Microsoft is more than capable of negotiating with airlines, if it's a priority. Maybe it's not! It clearly wasn't in past iterations of their flightsim. But this idea that they couldn't secure permissions from airlines if they actually cared to is hilarious to me. We're talking about a massive corporation (one of the world's largest) that is offering to put your airline's brand in their game that's going to reach tens of millions. You really think most of them would say no? (I'm leaving aside here the possibility that Microsoft would offer some small licensing fee to sweeten the deal, of course.) And you really think Microsoft couldn't ultimately convince a reasonable quantity of them to give that permission?

Trademarks are tricky, but mostly with stuff like this is tricky exactly because the little people don't have the resources and institutional clout to take a risk or deal directly with the trademark holders. Microsoft has both, in spades. While I'm not holding my breath and fully expect us little people to have to go in and put the liveries in ourselves, just like we always have, Microsoft could make all our lives that much easier if they really wanted to. Wouldn't that be nice!

James

 

But why bother doing any of that when instead they could release a paint kit and have the community create these liveries for free?

1 hour ago, highflyer2020 said:

 

But why bother doing any of that when instead they could release a paint kit and have the community create these liveries for free?

This is what I don't understand. Not everyone has to paint either. You can manually select which liveries you want to use. I really don't need Microsoft/Asobo adding hundreds of liveries, real or made up, into my sim. I will never use a good majority of them. Take up space for nothing. Especially if they come in 4K resolution...

 

How is this system supposed to work anyway? For airliners in the base sim I believe we have only seen the A320neo and 747-8.

What about third party jets? Will Microsoft/Asobo foot the bill for them too?

For freeware AI traffic (ironically still the best option) there are liveries available for every imaginable airline - small commuters up to the big stuff. Now with AIG's automated installer it's a breeze to put them in the sim. The only problem with licensing I remember was with the original F1 Ultimate Traffic. You had to download American's liveries separately I believe. But if MS is going to have worldwide AI traffic, I would bet it will be generic, as in past sims.

I would add a request here for Microsoft/Asobo to release paint kits of the aircraft when the sim is available. But please put panel lines, shading, data, etc., on separate layers. 😉

Personally, I don't think there is much point in the developer licensing a handful of airline repaints. Just leave it to the freeware guys, so that we can (eventually) have the full set.

I believe World Travel absorbed Orbit and Pacifica and then doubled their baggage fees.

Yeah, definitely very bland without some liveries. They are a VERY big part of the immersion!

They said during the live stream last week that they have reached out to basically ever single airline.