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CurtLewis95T

First Thoughts + Bugs List

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I was super excited to hear about Carenado releasing this and knew I had to buy it. I have about 2000 hours in the real C56X and call it 'the best all around compromise' as far as business jets go. 

I have only done one short shakedown flight tonight and was overall impressed. I don't know who had the idea to put a Primus 1000 in there because as far as I know, no Excel has one of those and I have flown 30 or 40 different tails. The visual model is very nice, and the performance/flight dynamics seemed pretty accurate after the first hop. I will also say that I am happy the Thrust detentes are modeled well! 

The list of things I took notes on that may be fixable for v1.1 - 

Cold and Dark Setup - 
- Press Source is never really moved from NORM and would never be placed OFF after shutdown
- Window Heat stays On at All times, even after shutdown (it is temperature limited and only is heated when it gets below a certain temp) 
- Fuel Boost should never have to be moved from NORM and would be left there overnight

- HDG knob moves slowwwwwwwwww. I can barely keep it in front of the turn. How can I make that spin faster?

- The autopilot modes that are selected (on the mode control button row above the MFD, below the engine instruments) should have a green border around the button when active. Just like the default Lear 45... 

- GND Idle Annunciation Illuminates at Idle Thrust in the air? This is a weight on wheels switch that changes the idle speed when on the ground to keep taxi speeds reasonable. If it is illuminating when airborne - something is wrong. Anytime you are on the ground though, whether at idle power or not, this white annunciation should be on.

- The altitude selector knob seems buggy. I can't get the 100/1000 to work, and apparently if you click left the AP goes into pitch mode??? That isn't a thing. Those knobs are just knobs. No push/pull function. On that note, even if you are cruising around in ALT mode and change the altitude selector, it should stay in ALT. This sim goes into PIT mode way too easily. The only time you would get that is if you manually deselected another pitch mode (VNAV/ALT/VS/FLC) or turned the AP on without first giving the FD a pitch mode. 

- Speedbrake is WAYYYYYYY too effective. We joke in the real one that it really just rumbles and makes some noise without slowing us much at all. Reducing its effectiveness by at least 50% would get it closer. 

- Flap extension in the visual model look like about 2 degrees, then 5 degrees, then 35 degrees vs 7/15/35

- AoA indexer above the glareshield doesn't seem to do anything...? Always a green 'on alpha' dot. This system only works when the nose gear is down and locked, and is obviously referencing Vso 1.3 AoA from the AoA gauge on the left panel. Navy airplanes since like FS2002 have had a working indexer so I am sure that you can figure it out. 

- I had to turn the RH Fuel Pump to ON to get the APU to start. While yes, the APU drinks from the right tank, pump operation is automatic. 

- Wing AI annunciation was on at all times with the E/WAI switch off. The only time this light comes on is if the wing (or engine for the engine AI light) heat is selected on, and the power is below 72% N2. Basically saying 'hey, you want heat, but there isnt enough power/air/heat from the engines to guarantee a good enough job.' It becomes annoying sometimes during decent because you are at idle thrust, and getting master cautions left and right. 

- I don't know where you recorded all of the cockpit alert sounds from, but it wasn't a straight XL like the one that you modeled. I am not super familiar with the XLS+ and maybe you used sounds from that avionics set, but the overspeed tone is not correct. On that note, the only real noise you get is from the overspeed. Master Caution and Master Warnings are silent with only the lights going off. Also I noticed that the Pass Safety/Seat Belt sign switch doesn't "ding" like it should. That would have been super easy to get right as well.  

- GPWS isn't accurate. I think the real one only gives a 500' call. It has been 2 months since I have flown one though but I have a lot of videos I can reference. 

- Pressurization panel is....i have no idea what is going on with that. In normal operation you would set the landing field elevation there and let it run in auto. ie - 4500' = 45. 

Anyway. I wish I could have helped beta test to help get some of these little details right! A patch would be nice. I didn't even try the VNAV or anything yet, but as difficult as this PRIMUS 1000 is to use, I am not holding my breath. It really feels like you took the default GPS functions and made it look like a Primus 1000. Can't seem to go direct to anything while keeping the flight plan in etc etc. 

 

Edited by CurtLewis95T
keep finding more things....
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Oh, also just noticed that the 2D panel AP/YD controls illuminate green when in use (as they should) but don't light up in the VC to match.

Played with VNAV a bit and surprisingly it kind of works. But it doesn't stop at the selected altitude so if you aren't cleared below a certain point you have to pay attention and change modes manually.... 

 

Edited by CurtLewis95T

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Great feedback CurtLewis95T! Have you sent this to Carenado for their information? 

Also, as you have lots of time in the said aircraft, I am unable to zoom in and out of the Honeywell Map, any ideas please? 

Thanks for your review!

Edited by Tom_Gratton

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1 hour ago, CurtLewis95T said:

HDG knob moves slowwwwwwwwww. I can barely keep it in front of the turn. How can I make that spin faster?

Place your cursor over the knob and use the middle wheel of the Mouse to turn the knob forward or backward.

At least this is how it is done in other Carenardo aircraft.

Edited by Jim Young

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49 minutes ago, Tom_Gratton said:

Great feedback CurtLewis95T! Have you sent this to Carenado for their information? 

Also, as you have lots of time in the said aircraft, I am unable to zoom in and out of the Honeywell Map, any ideas please? 

Thanks for your review!

I just sent them that block of text in a support ticket. We will see if anything happens from it. 

The MFD zoom is a tiny 'INC/DEC' switch to the right of the screen, below Com1, on the left side of the sub panel that controls TCAS, WX, APT/VOR/etc. Right above the pressurization panel. 

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CurtLewis96T, found it! Thank you.

 

One final point, is there anywhere to input your minimums? Thanks!

Edited by Tom_Gratton

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2 hours ago, Tom_Gratton said:

CurtLewis96T, found it! Thank you.

 

One final point, is there anywhere to input your minimums? Thanks!

In the actual airplane yes, but it looks like it is missing in the model. It would be a knob on the PFD opposite from the Baro set knob. 

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Two more legs, and a few more bugs that I will be submitting - 

- start buttons do not light up when pressed
- Engine Anti Ice is set to On when cold and dark is loaded
- Vspeeds that are programmed on the MFD show up on the airspeed tape when they are unboxed, but they should only show up when "boxed"
- Green Ignition Lights by the N1 tapes dont illuminate with start/EAI/ignition switches
- Right panel light knob lights up all of the landing gear indicators too...
- Panel lights shouldn't come on at all unless the panel light master switch is on
- Speed brakes should close above about 50% Thrust Lever Angle 
- Speed brakes can be armed like an airliner using Shift /. They have to be deployed manually at touchdown in the real plane
- N1 reminder clicker is all 000 and cant be set (above the Meggit/standby attitude) 
- wind indicator points INTO the wind on the PFD?

Seriously guys. Did anyone actually fly this thing at all before it was released? 

Edited by CurtLewis95T
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27 minutes ago, CurtLewis95T said:



Seriously guys. Did anyone actually fly this thing at all before it was released? 

That pretty much sums up Carenado releases 🙂

I bought the plane too....ATC here, minimal jet experience, no rw citation experience though.  

Also, a question about FADEC since you have time (or anyone else who does).  How does the FADEC manage engine parameters in low alt cruise.  Example I fly a lot of TEC routes on Pilot Edge (wonderful service by the way), and it's common to transit the SoCal area at low altitudes even in a jet.  Say 11,000 or 12,000 ft.  I understand fadec isnt an AT but would you still place the throttle in cruise detent even at 11,000?  Will it then adjust engine to not overspeed?  Or will you have to have the throttle far below the detent at that low of altitude?

Edited by ryanbatcund
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|Ryan Butterworth|

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13 minutes ago, ryanbatcund said:

That pretty much sums up Carenado releases 🙂

I bought the plane too....ATC here, minimal jet experience, no rw citation experience though.  

Also, a question about FADEC since you have time (or anyone else who does).  How does the FADEC manage engine parameters in low alt cruise.  Example I fly a lot of TEC routes on Pilot Edge (wonderful service by the way), and it's common to transit the SoCal area at low altitudes even in a jet.  Say 11,000 or 12,000 ft.  I understand fadec isnt an AT but would you still place the throttle in cruise detent even at 11,000?  Will it then adjust engine to not overspeed?  Or will you have to have the throttle far below the detent at that low of altitude?

It is a very basic FADEC, and is actually called "Electronic Engine Control" or EEC. There are switches for the left and right sides under the avionics master, but in the sim they just move without actually turning them off of course. 

It basically just does a nice job of giving you takeoff and climb power settings while keeping temps and speeds within limits. You certainly would be well below the Cruise detent when down low like that. Even up in the 40s we could only stay in the cruise detent on warm/heavy days without it overspeeding. 

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29 minutes ago, CurtLewis95T said:

It is a very basic FADEC, and is actually called "Electronic Engine Control" or EEC. There are switches for the left and right sides under the avionics master, but in the sim they just move without actually turning them off of course. 

It basically just does a nice job of giving you takeoff and climb power settings while keeping temps and speeds within limits. You certainly would be well below the Cruise detent when down low like that. Even up in the 40s we could only stay in the cruise detent on warm/heavy days without it overspeeding. 

Ok thanks for the info!


|Ryan Butterworth|

| i7 4790K@4.4GHz | 32GB RAM | EVGA GTX 1080Ti | ASUS Z97-Pro | 1TB 860 Evo | 500GB 840 Evo Win10 Pro | 1TB Samsung 7200rpm | Seasonic X750W |

 

 

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9 hours ago, CurtLewis95T said:

I just sent them that block of text in a support ticket. We will see if anything happens from it. 

The MFD zoom is a tiny 'INC/DEC' switch to the right of the screen, below Com1, on the left side of the sub panel that controls TCAS, WX, APT/VOR/etc. Right above the pressurization panel. 

  I received an email back from Carenado stating they will address the issues I raised with them. I missed a lot of the ones you and others have pointed out though. As is customary with Carenado, it won't be until V1.2 or 1.3 until the plane is really worth the expense.

Edited by mdreyer

Murray Dreyer - i7 8700k @ 4.6gHz, GTX 1070TI, Windows 10, 16GB DDR4 RAM.

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I will be installing shortly and adding an RXP GTN750 to drive the autopilot.

Hopefully I can make the GTN / autopilot work together a bit better.. :happy:

Shall report back..

BTW, have also been told that a V1.1. is expected out tomorrow.. so hopefully at least some of the bugs have been fixed..

Oh, before anyone can complain that "Real Citation XLs" do not have Garmin avionics.. have a look here:

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/585464

Edited by Bert Pieke
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Bert

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4 hours ago, CurtLewis95T said:

Two more legs, and a few more bugs that I will be submitting - 
 

I also emailed Carenado with earlier today and I note we have noticed the same issues. Does that mean I am type rated in the real world?

In all serious though, I hope they fix all this because this jet has potential!

Edited by Tom_Gratton

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5 hours ago, Bert Pieke said:

I will be installing shortly and adding an RXP GTN750 to drive the autopilot.

Hopefully I can make the GTN / autopilot work together a bit better.. :happy:

Shall report back..

BTW, have also been told that a V1.1. is expected out tomorrow.. so hopefully at least some of the bugs have been fixed..

Oh, before anyone can complain that "Real Citation XLs" do not have Garmin avionics.. have a look here:

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/585464

we need some Bert XML love lol....  I dabbled aha


|Ryan Butterworth|

| i7 4790K@4.4GHz | 32GB RAM | EVGA GTX 1080Ti | ASUS Z97-Pro | 1TB 860 Evo | 500GB 840 Evo Win10 Pro | 1TB Samsung 7200rpm | Seasonic X750W |

 

 

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