Vulkan Vs DX12

[Ianrivaldosmith 5,317]

Hi. I’ve lurked here since it’s inception way way back. Used to post years ago. 
I’m a relatively seasoned flight simmer and Real life pilot. Had a few breaks overs the years give or take. 
I am no computer programmer or anything like that, but I do follow technology at a layman’s level. And I know my way around a PC. 
 

I used to use FS9, way back, dabbled in FSX too, and then life took over. 
I then came back to simming and tried P3DV2, and X-Plane 10. 
For me, although it had it’s limitations, X-plane 10 changed things. It was good! 
Then real life took over again, until mid last year when fortune took over and  I had the cash and time to start simming again. 
Since then I’ve exclusively used X-plane 11. It’s a good sim. It has its shortcomings yes, we all know what they are. However with the new Vulkan Beta just released last week, it is absolutely butter smooth. 
Now, being a real life pilot, that is a game changer. The immersion with no stutters is AS IT SHOULD BE! 
I thought I would give P3DV5 another go. It’s stuttery. Simple as that. I have a powerful system. That isn’t going to resolve the stutters. Not that I can see. 
 

I didn’t start this to compare one sim against the other. P3D does some things way better than X-plane does. They’re both good. However back to the illusion of fight, and you require smoothness. 
I believe vulkan just won the day over DX12. I wonder what MSFS will use? Maybe that, Along with X-plane 12 is the revolution we are all waiting for! And not an old sim engine that seems to now have been beaten to death. 
 

Yes I’ll keep P3DV5 on my system, purely out of curiosity. However, it’s looking highly unlikely I’ll use it as often as the vulkan competitor.

 

Smoothness = illusion of fight. And illusion is what simming is about, right?

Edited April 15, 2020 by Ianrivaldosmith

[omarsmak30 4,065]

Vulkan is very good, sometimes I fly with it but I get annoyed by the blurry textures and the random CTDs, I think LR will improve it in the next betas but honestly it is a very good step. 

Back to P3D, I still have not installed v5, I have version v4 installed with tons of addons and I have no mood to re-install everything again, is not like XP as you know what I mean. 

However, looks from the videos that DX12 is good improvement, however as I said I haven't yet installed it. I am looking forward to have my favorite add-ones developers issuing official installers for v5 first as really I don't have the mood to do things manually. 

 

However, although honestly XP11 is my favourite sim at the moment (could change with v5, who knows!), I still get back to my P3D to just fly these quality long haul airliners that I miss so much in XP, for example PMDG777,747 QW787 or AS330. 

 

Edited April 15, 2020 by omarsmak30

[OzWhitey 3,353]

9 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

Hi. I’ve lurked here since it’s inception way way back. Used to post years ago. 
I’m a relatively seasoned flight simmer and Real life pilot. Had a few breaks overs the years give or take. 
I am no computer programmer or anything like that, but I do follow technology at a layman’s level. And I know my way around a PC. 
 

I used to use FS9, way back, dabbled in FSX too, and then life took over. 
I then came back to simming and tried P3DV2, and X-Plane 10. 
For me, although it had it’s limitations, X-plane 10 changed things. It was good! 
Then real life took over again, until mid last year when fortune took over and  I had the cash and time to start simming again. 
Since then I’ve exclusively used X-plane 11. It’s a good sim. It has its shortcomings yes, we all know what they are. However with the new Vulkan Beta just released last week, it is absolutely butter smooth. 
Now, being a real life pilot, that is a game changer. The immersion with no stutters is AS IT SHOULD BE! 
I thought I would give P3DV5 another go. It’s stuttery. Simple as that. I have a powerful system. That isn’t going to resolve the stutters. Not that I can see. 
 

I didn’t start this to compare one sim against the other. P3D does some things way better than X-plane does. They’re both good. However back to the illusion of fight, and you require smoothness. 
I believe vulkan just won the day over DX12. I wonder what MSFS will use? Maybe that, Along with X-plane 12 is the revolution we are all waiting for! And not an old sim engine that seems to now have been beaten to death. 
 

Yes I’ll keep P3DV5 on my system, purely out of curiosity. However, it’s looking highly unlikely I’ll use it as often as the vulkan competitor.

 

Smoothness = illusion of fight. And illusion is what simming is about, right?

I did see you post the "it's stuttery" elsewhere.

I don't think your "it's as simple as that" comment is remotely correct. I had that in mind on my last flight, and I saw no stutters whatsoever. I get more in vulkan - whilst I'm excited as anyone for that engine, it's not perfect either.

Whilst I wouldn't go so far as to claim that P3D is stutter-free overall, I suspect it comes down to system and settings. It's still early days for me in P3D, but I'm really impressed by the engine so far. It's a heck of a lot prettier than X-plane's determinedly drab "realistic" vision of the world, to my eyes at least. 

In short, claiming the "vulkan won the day over DX12" based on a single user with presumably very few P3D v5 flights is massively premature.

[Karelpatch 29]

Interesting. I am 99% on P3D v4.5 and 1% on XP v11 and indeed, Vulkan added an impressive amount of FPS to X-Plane. But I don’t suffer from stutters in P3D 4.5, even with tons of add-ons, except in some very heavy sceneries like the London area of Orbx Trueearth GB where I will lose some FPS if I don’t adapt the settings. But I also lose FPS in X-Plane if I max everything out in some sceneries and with some plugins. 
 

So about the stuttering, is that some new bug coming with the v5? 

[Ianrivaldosmith 5,317]

6 minutes ago, Karelpatch said:

Interesting. I am 99% on P3D v4.5 and 1% on XP v11 and indeed, Vulkan added an impressive amount of FPS to X-Plane. But I don’t suffer from stutters in P3D 4.5, even with tons of add-ons, except in some very heavy sceneries like the London area of Orbx Trueearth GB where I will lose some FPS if I don’t adapt the settings. But I also lose FPS in X-Plane if I max everything out in some sceneries and with some plugins. 
 

So about the stuttering, is that some new bug coming with the v5? 

It just does not feel smooth to me. I run an G-Sync monitor, with track IR, and in xplane I can pan around really fast and fly fast aircraft without any stuttering, even if the FPS drops.

In P3D the ground always seems to ‘skip’.

 

Maybe it’s me, and I’ve done something wrong? I don’t know. More experienced people might know...

[Caveney737 66]

9 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

It just does not feel smooth to me. I run an G-Sync monitor

Forget G-sync with P3, it doesn't work well. To get a smooth experience you need to get

a monitor or TV that can run at 30Hz. Then set V-sync to 'on' in the simulator and as long

as your settings allow the FPS to stay consistently above 30 you will have smooth.

You can set the FPS limiter in the sim to fixed at 31 or unlimited which ever appears

best to you. There are a lot of threads on Avsim on how to avoid stutters with P3D, but

this is the best solution most people use. X-plane with Vulkan is very smooth, I also have it

but P3D can be almost as good. I am also a real world pilot and have spent years trying to

achieve smooth so I understand what you are saying. Give it a go.

[Ianrivaldosmith 5,317]

3 minutes ago, Caveney737 said:

Forget G-sync with P3, it doesn't work well. To get a smooth experience you need to get

a monitor or TV that can run at 30Hz. Then set V-sync to 'on' in the simulator and as long

as your settings allow the FPS to stay consistently above 30 you will have smooth.

You can set the FPS limiter in the sim to fixed at 31 or unlimited which ever appears

best to you. There are a lot of threads on Avsim on how to avoid stutters with P3D, but

this is the best solution most people use. X-plane with Vulkan is very smooth, I also have it

but P3D can be almost as good. I am also a real world pilot and have spent years trying to

achieve smooth so I understand what you are saying. Give it a go.

So, I will need a new monitor right? My current one is 100hz. 

[Caveney737 66]

Not necessarily. You can use Nvidia Control panel to set up a new custom resolution at 30Hz if your

monitor will support it. If it won't it will just not work and you can revert to normal. I have a Samsung

49" curved monitor with native speed of 144Hz and I can set up any speed down to 25Hz and it works.

You just need to try it out. Without doing this, the only way to get your current monitor running at 100hz

to be smooth is to ensure your FPS never drop below 100, which is virtually impossible.

[Ianrivaldosmith 5,317]

10 minutes ago, Caveney737 said:

Not necessarily. You can use Nvidia Control panel to set up a new custom resolution at 30Hz if your

monitor will support it. If it won't it will just not work and you can revert to normal. I have a Samsung

49" curved monitor with native speed of 144Hz and I can set up any speed down to 25Hz and it works.

You just need to try it out. Without doing this, the only way to get your current monitor running at 100hz

to be smooth is to ensure your FPS never drop below 100, which is virtually impossible.

Seems the lowest HZ I can go is 50hz. 

[Caveney737 66]

6 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

Seems the lowest HZ I can go is 50hz. 

Then you have two options:

1. Adjust your settings so that you can achieve over 50 fps consistently and use the method I described.

2. If you can't live with those settings you will have to get a monitor or TV that will support lower speeds.

Also, bear in mind that you will always get the odd occasional stutter in P3D even with a perfect set up,

it is just the nature of the beast, although I can't speak for v5 as I haven't upgraded yet.

Or 3rd option, stick with X-plane 🙂

[Karelpatch 29]

1 hour ago, Caveney737 said:

Forget G-sync with P3, it doesn't work well. To get a smooth experience you need to get

a monitor or TV that can run at 30Hz.

Seriously, this is a good idea if you have a bad setup (I used to run at 30Hz sometimes) but it’s generally a bad experience.

Edited April 15, 2020 by Karelpatch

[Karelpatch 29]

1 hour ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

Seems the lowest HZ I can go is 50hz. 

Running a monitor at 30Hz is horrible to watch and in my opinion it’s something you do if you are desperate. You shouldn’t have to resort to this kind of tweaking. 

[Ianrivaldosmith 5,317]

I just don’t get it. I’m on super modern expensive hardware and g-sync is brilliant. Well with every thing I’ve tried so far except p3d. The whole point in it is to smooth everything out and not bother with frame caps performance limiting v-sync. 

[Karelpatch 29]

2 hours ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

It just does not feel smooth to me. I run an G-Sync monitor, with track IR, and in xplane I can pan around really fast and fly fast aircraft without any stuttering, even if the FPS drops.

In P3D the ground always seems to ‘skip’.

 

Maybe it’s me, and I’ve done something wrong? I don’t know. More experienced people might know...

Reason has to be your hardware/settings/sceneries. When flying in complex aircraft, over very complex scenery with hundreds of custom buildings, with a lot of AI traffic in an overcast layer, this can kill your FPS. But then you can change your settings in this kind of situation. I don’t run same settings for a photoreal scenery in Europe and for Orbx Alaska.

[Caveney737 66]

8 minutes ago, Ianrivaldosmith said:

I just don’t get it. I’m on super modern expensive hardware and g-sync is brilliant. Well with every thing I’ve tried so far except p3d. The whole point in it is to smooth everything out and not bother with frame caps performance limiting v-sync. 

Yes you are right and it depends on a million different variables in P3D. If you are running at 1080p with a default plane you should be able to run at 100 fps no problem.

I have a 9900k overclocked to 5.1ghz and a Titan RTX graphics card and I can still bring it to its knees with the wrong settings.