My Parents survived a Drone attack!!

[Jazz 1,046]

7 hours ago, PATCO LCH said:

I cringe when I see videos about the flying car concept. The way many of these turnips here in South Carolina drive and the thought of them flying!😰

I confess to having had similar thoughts when I have seen those too.

[HighBypass 2,339]

13 hours ago, Jazz said:

.. when operated by morons ...

My emphasis. Now THAT is the whole crux of the problem. Depending upon the quadrotor thanks to GPS lock, hard envelope protection (just let go of the sticks) and send home functions, ANY MORON can fire one up and fly it.

Conventional line of sight flying models at least require some time and practice invested in them so you don't return them to kit form on your first sortie - certainly weeds out most of the morons.

Oh, and Gatwick,? Show me the proof. No one has ever been caught. So much for all that radio jamming gear to actually shut down a flying model. In the "incident" at Heathrow I link to below, the model was happily flying around and didn't get jammed out of the sky... Did our airports buy the wrong frequency crystals?? 

I'm not doubting Kevin's claim, but the majority of pilots fail to see quadrotors and don't have the eyesight of a steely eyed missile man... Kevin I applaud you for spotting it and hope that the perpetrator was caught...

https://generalaviationnews.com/2019/10/31/pilots-approaching-a-runway-cant-spot-a-drone-especially-if-it-isnt-moving/

Kevin, at about 50 feet distance, wouldn't the quad have been sucked into an engine?

I hate to link to mainstream tabloid media but to find someone who was actually arrested, found guilty and charged, I'm using this Heathrow "incident". I must point out that this guy was flying a model plane, not a quadrotor. Admittedly it can be fitted with FPV, but it's a plane and not a "drone". It has to keep moving in order for it to fly and cannot hover in place waiting for an unsuspecting airliner. No pilots spotted this moving object above a park 1/2 a mile from Heathrow, only a couple of police on patrol noticed it in the sky..

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6619967/Judge-slams-stupid-father-one-38-flew-160-model-aircraft-near-Heathrow.html

This was the model plane apparently. Only one propeller. It might be STOL, but it cannot hover and lie in wait....

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/durafly-tundra-1300mm-51-sports-model-w-flaps-pnf-upgrade-version.html?___store=en_us

Anyhow, this escalated quickly.. Almost anything a human touches can be weaponised in some way.. Cyclists have killed more people than model aircraft or quadrotors.. another mainstream link, sorry..they are soooo easy to pull up from the internet as that's how the sheeple are controlled.. (yes, me too, no doubt!).

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/07/number-pedestrians-fatally-seriously-injured-cyclists-has-doubled/

Some cyclists are morons, some quad operators are morons, some vehicle drivers are morons, some firearms owners are morons (usually not for very long though! ), some people are morons... I'm seeing a trend here.. Nothing to do with the machine being operated..

Sorry if this thread has run its race.. I leave it up to the mods to decide if this is shut down more effectively than any "drone" or stays in the interest of further debate..

[ErichB 3,639]

This thread has rekindled my idea of buying a drone.

[HighBypass 2,339]

Don't worry Erich, I'm not calling you a moron...yet! 

[Chock 17,769]

2 hours ago, Jazz said:

And in my opinion it was a ridiculous thing to write. Anyway, I have no wish to quarrel with you, Alan. I rather admire your contributions around here.

And you are absolutely entitled to that opinion, but it is fun to discuss it and alternative opinions. So no, I'm not arguing either, merely discussing stuff. 🙂

To be clear, I absolutely do agree that some pillock being able to fly a drone with no sense of responsibility and possibly with nefarious intent, is something which probably should be curtailed. In fact my ex-missus once used one of my .22 target rifles to shoot down a drone which was being used to 'case' properties including ours. I was impressed incidentally, she got it with literally one shot after a quick tutorial from me on how to load and use the rifle safely and how offset one's aim properly for steep trajectory shots. She's a natural. The noise of that thing crashing after one of its motors was shot off was hilarious. 🤣

I don't think anyone seriously into drones and their responsible use would object to a reasonably inexpensive and accessible licensing/registration scheme. I've got a couple of them, which I use for film-making to get aerial shots inexpensively, and I am careful to follow the rules on flying these, which to be fair I pretty much already knew anyway since I have several RC aeroplanes too and am quite into making them (currently working on a B-17F Flying Fortress), but I would not object to these having to be licensed for use and even registered as well, so long as it was not stupidly expensive or impractical to do so.

Edited April 21, 2020 by Chock

[KevinAu 441]

1 hour ago, HighBypass said:

 

I'm not doubting Kevin's claim, but the majority of pilots fail to see quadrotors and don't have the eyesight of a steely eyed missile man... Kevin I applaud you for spotting it and hope that the perpetrator was caught...

https://generalaviationnews.com/2019/10/31/pilots-approaching-a-runway-cant-spot-a-drone-especially-if-it-isnt-moving/

Kevin, at about 50 feet distance, wouldn't the quad have been sucked into an engine?

Like I said, it flew over my head. The engines of the E190 are under wing. Things only get sucked into an engine on the ground. When you’re flying, things fly into the engine. This thing was never in line with the engines. 50 feet was my guess. Probably closer. I saw a glint of sunlight on something ahead, thought it was a balloon, then saw that it was a quadcopter as it went over. We filed an asap. The report is out there. Kennedy tower switched runways and sent the nypd helicopter to look for it afterwards. This was probably 2015.

A second encounter later on an approach to 31R. That time the tower was reporting that someone ahead had called a drone. We looked and actually saw something pass well below. Probably from one of the fishing boats.

They are hard to spot. Unless you know to look for it or it just passes that close to you.

Edited April 21, 2020 by KevinAu

[KenG 492]

You see a toy drone at the store and buy it for little Johnny who goes out and plays with his new toy, most likely without adult supervision. Little Johnny, being well Little Johnny, flies said toy over neighbor's backyard. All if fun and games right?

Well it all depends on your jurisdiction, but Little Johnny and you being the adult may have just violated a number of laws.

• At least in the U.S. if the drone weighs more than a half pound it has to be registered. So you may be violated by the feds for illegally operating an aerial vehicle.
• Torte law in some locations have expanded to include aerial trespassing. Circling or hovering a drone over someone's property can led to a lawsuit.
• If there were kids in your backyard, then Little Johnny could also be found to have operated an aerial vehicle over unprotected persons.
• There are lots of places you cannot operate UAS, close enough to an airport and Little Johnny just illegally flew an aerial vehicle in U.S. controlled airspace.

In the U.S.drones (fixed and rotor wing variants) are highly regulated. Unless you want to risk losing way more than the purchase price of said drone in federal fines and possibly a court battle for aerial trespassing, then don't be uninformed. Ever toy drone sold in the U.S. should refer you to the following website: http://knowbeforeyoufly.org/

As for other national jurisdictions, I'd start with your local aviation authorities and if you must fly over someone else's property, a call to the local police. There are also numerous Remote Controlled (RC) aircraft and model rocketry clubs. They normally try to say out of trouble with regulators and stay out of the courts and thus are a good source of information. 

Drones are a great way for people who may never make the move to the cockpit to find a way to earn a living in aviation. There has been a huge expansion in commercial UAS cinematography. I know local real estate agents around here pay for UAS footage of listed properties. It is also a great opportunity for retired pilots.

Edited April 21, 2020 by KenG

[bobbyjack 61]

Laws concerning drones vary from place to place. Shooting at one is a particular problem. In most places, a homeowner's response to a threat must match that threat. Someone coming at you with a gun or knife can be met equally. Someone parked on your front lawn taking photos is not a physical threat. Plus firing at ground level is one thing, but firing into the air is quite another. What if you miss? That bullet of shotgun blast has to land somewhere. Even if you hit it, unless the bullet lodges in the drone, that bullet has to land somewhere. And certainly not all the balls from the shotgun hit the drone. And what if the drone you shot down hits and injures someone. In many places it is illegal to shoot an aircraft.  

[KenG 492]

There is a special place reserved for civilians who shoot at aircraft (lasers included.) 

[Dave Morgan 68]

I have to confess to having a strong dislike of toy drones. I've had them buzzing round me while climbing. Once off the crux I lobbed a few stones and was gratified a few seconds later to hear a distant shout of outrage. For commercial operators they're fine, and even for anyone licensed (or trained) but I do think they should be withheld from the average ASBO.

I found yesterday on one forum or another (possibly not Avsim) a comment re. social distancing and isolation along the lines of "and because the skies are empty I ignored the 400' limit and took it up to 1500". I don't object to that if the skies really are empty but I do object strongly to childish and word not allowed use leading to invasion of privacy. From my experience above, I can tell you the things are difficult to bring down.

I find myself also wondering what the consensus is among pilots, rather than quad operators (quad operators are no more pilots than I am a F1 driver with my RC car).

 

Edit: why has 'igno***t' been replaced with 'word not allowed'?

Edited April 21, 2020 by Dave Morgan
censorship

[KenG 492]

12 minutes ago, Dave Morgan said:

Edit: why has 'igno***t' been replaced with 'word not allowed'?

Because most people are not educated enough to know the difference and are offended. Believe me it was major eye roll at the mods when it did it to my post as well.

[HighBypass 2,339]

1 hour ago, KevinAu said:

When you’re flying, things fly into the engine. This thing was never in line with the engines. 50 feet was my guess. Probably closer...

Apologies, Kevin. I always thought that there was a danger "cone" within which objects would still be sucked into an engine despite the aircraft being in flight.

[KevinAu 441]

1 hour ago, HighBypass said:

Apologies, Kevin. I always thought that there was a danger "cone" within which objects would still be sucked into an engine despite the aircraft being in flight.

Once in flight, it’s pretty much all airflow. Think of the engine as a hollow tube that the airflow just passes through. I went through a gaggle of geese once in a 145. One hit the right side of the fuselage at the lower part of the galley door and the blood smear went along with the airflow back and up over the wing and then back down the trailing edge in front of the engine to away below the engine.

[HighBypass 2,339]

5 minutes ago, KevinAu said:

I went through a gaggle of geese once in a 145..

I bet that made you tighten your grip on the yoke.. and the seat cushion!  Glad you're here to talk about it.

[KevinAu 441]

5 minutes ago, HighBypass said:

I bet that made you tighten your grip on the yoke.. and the seat cushion!  Glad you're here to talk about it.

The fo was flying, but the second or so i saw them before we went through them was enough time for me to see in my minds eye the dual engine failure, the glide, the ditching in the st lawrence and the how wet everything will be.