P3D5 main window with second display blacking out?

[Sea2Sky 4]

@RXP, I'm currently trying to work on a solution with your product and LH through their P3D forum: https://prepar3d.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6312&t=137267&p=214807#p214807

The problem appears to be loading up the RXP window, and moving it onto another monitor. When I undock the RXP window, and move onto any monitor (emuteq, 34" ultra widescreen, etc), it blacks out the main P3D flight screen, and there's nothing I can do but close P3D and reopen, and not use RXP as a popup window. You can see a bit more details in the P3D forum thread I posted above. I wanted to share with you in case this was RXP specific, as the other undockable P3D windows don't necessarily mimic the same issue as RXP's window. Seems like it might be a DX12 issue maybe?

Did you encounter any issues like this yet with RXP + P3Dv5? I'm not sure if the problem lies directly with P3D v5, or if RXP needs to accommodate for DX12? Thought I would share with you in case you had more insight. Not sure if anyone else is experiencing this issue with P3D v5. It worked great in P3D v4.5.

[RXP 2,338]

Hi,

The GNS is purely implemented as a P3D gauges SDK. It is no different sdk-gauge-wise than a gauge with a static bitmap element for that matter, and doesn't use DX in any way but the GUI Settings Panel (and only if you open it).

I believe this could be either a driver compatible issue or a P3D5 bug of some sort, but I'll try to reproduce.

In the meantime if anyone could try and confirm whether this is happening on their systems too, this might help finding a reason quicker by comparison.

[Sea2Sky 4]

Thank you. Let me know if there is anything I can do to help testing.

I'm looking forward to hearing if anyone else is dealing with this issue, as I have a newly installed copy with only Orbx, Carenado C172, RXP, and flight hardware installed.

I've tried this with both P3D and Carenado aircraft, and had the same results. My guess is that it's a P3D related bug, but wanted to update you as well in case you had any insight to the issue.

Edited April 28, 2020 by Sea2Sky

[Sea2Sky 4]

Thanks for sharing Rob. That sounds like the same issue I'm having. I can undock RXP, but as soon as I move it to another monitor, my main flight screen goes black.

I'm looking forward to seeing a potential update, as this is my only limiting factor to using P3D v5 at the moment.

[RXP 2,338]

This sounds like the reverse:

Rob undocked GNS window is blank and the main is ok.

whereas:

Your main window is blank and your GNS window is ok.

is this correct?

Are you both using ChasePlane?

Edited April 28, 2020 by RXP

[Sea2Sky 4]

Oh, i misunderstood. Yes, that's correct. We're having the reverse problem. My RXP screen is fine, but my main is blank. Sorry for the confusion. I do not have ChasePlane installed.

[RXP 2,338]

Hi Rob,

I'm sorry for the unusual delay with this one. There are a number of other things going on with the autopilot link, a couple aircraft betas, a few simulator betas etc... We'll get to the bottom of it.

[RXP 2,338]

@Rob_Ainscough @Sea2Sky

Hi,

I've finally done some tests with P3D5 and can't repro any of these issues.

This might be related to specific display settings though (both P3D and Windows).

Let's make sure I get the complete picture from both of you:

NB: even if you've already told in your messages, I'd like you to sum all up with the questions below for the sake of having all necessary info in one place.

0) What is your video card type and driver version?

Your Windows version?
full version numbers - for example on Win10: Settings > System >  About > OS build 18363.815

Your Simulator version?
full version numbers - for example latest P3D5HF1 is 5.0.24.34874

1) What are you screen resolutions?

2) What are you screen relative positions (like in the Windows > Display settings, how are they arranged one to the other)

    ( [ 1 ] [ 2 ] for example - a screenshot might be easier)

3) How did you setup the following P3D Display settings (a screenshot might be easier):

   - Resolution
   - Black-out Desktop
   - Auto-fill Main View
   - VSync
   - Wide-view Aspect Ratio

4) Do you run P3D window maximized (the top right title bar button), or full screen (ALT+ENTER)?

5) Is the P3D window covering 1 screen entirely, or 2 screens?

6) Is this happening with the GNS, the GTN, both?

7) Is this happening with popup windows or undocked window ?

😎 Is the RXP window maximized? 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by RXP

[RXP 2,338]

@Rob_Ainscough I can't see the screenshots, the URLs seem wrong.

What is your Windows and Simulator version too? (I've edited my post above for more details about these)

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by RXP

[Sea2Sky 4]

Hey @RXP, I started writing down my troubleshooting steps yesterday for a developer at P3D, and will share them with you as well. I am going to do a bit more testing today, but thought I'd share with you what I currently have. But first, regarding your questions:

 

What is your video card type and driver version?

Gigabyte [Nvidia] GeForce GTX 1070: Driver version, 26.21.14.4587 (latest version)

Your Windows version?

Windows 10 Pro: Version 1909, OS Build 18363.778

Your Simulator version?

P3D Version 5.0.21.34709

What are you screen resolutions?

Display 1: 34" Ultrawide, 3440x1440 [DisplayPort]
Display 2: 43" 4K, 4096x2160 [HDMI]
Display 3: 5.6" Emuteq GNS530, 1024x768  [VGA to DVI adapter]

What are you screen relative positions (like in the Windows > Display settings, how are they arranged one to the other)

[ 1 ] > [ 2 ] > [ 3 ] - Extend desktop to this display

How did you setup the following P3D Display settings (a screenshot might be easier):

   - Resolution: Matches display screen resolutions mentioned above
   - Black-out Desktop: Disabled
   - Auto-fill Main View: Currently Disable, initially Enabled
   - VSync: Enabled, also tested with Disabled
   - Wide-view Aspect Ratio: Disabled, Display 2 is not widescreen.

Do you run P3D window maximized (the top right title bar button), or full screen (ALT+ENTER)?

   - Window maximized

Is the P3D window covering 1 screen entirely, or 2 screens?

   - P3D main flight window on 1 screen only, preferable Display 2

Is this happening with the GNS, the GTN, both?

   - GNS530, undocked RXP Window

Is this happening with popup windows or undocked window?

   - Undocked RXP Window

 

Systems Check
- Updated Windows to latest patch release
- Updated latest Nvidia Graphics driver
- Verified all devices were running in Device Manager
- Verified DX12 version, and diagnosis were good

Display Hardware
GPU: Nvidia GTX 1070
Display 1: 34" Ultrawide, 3440x1440 [DisplayPort]
Display 2: 43" 4K, 4096x2160 [HDMI]
Display 3: 5.6" Emuteq GNS530, 1024x768  [VGA to DVI adapter]
** Goal is to get main flight window on Display 2, and GNS530 GPS to Display 3 ***

P3D Tests
Scenario 1:
- Display 1 is set to 'main display' in Windows Display settings.
- I load a flight in P3Dv5 on Display 1, undock RXP window and it runs fine on Display 1.
- If I resize the RXP window on Display 1, the main flight window goes black on Display 1.
- Resizing, or dragging RXP to any other monitors does not fix the main flight window.
- Moving the main flight window to Display 2 brings back the view, and RXP window is working on Display 1.
- Moving the RXP window to Display 2 blacks out the main display window again, this time the RXP window is shown twice on Display 2, both a detached window, and a docked* window within the main flight window.
- Dragging the RXP window to Display 3 still shows a docked* RXP window in Display 2, and undocked in Display 3.
- Main flight screen on Display 2 is still black. Dragging main flight screen window across any of the screens no longer returns an image.
- Dragging RXP window to Display 1, returns main flight window image on Display 2.
- Closing RXP window creates black screen on main flight window image on Display 2.
- Dragging main flight window back to Display 1 brings back image.
- Moving main flight window to any display now shows image.
*** Results: RXP and main flight window only work together if RXP is on Display 1, and main flight window is on Display 2; and main flight window works on Display 1, 2 and when RXP window is closed and only after dragging main window to another display first. The docked window mentioned in Scenario that is noted with '*' is not an actual docked window. The docked* window has no dock menu options, but only an image representation of the RXP window.

Scenario 2:
- Display 2 is set to 'main display' in Windows Display settings.
- I load a flight in P3Dv5 on Display 2, main flight screen loads on Display 1.
- Undocking the RXP window brings the RXP window to Display 2.
- Resizing RXP window on Display 2 does not affect main window image.
- Dragging RXP window to Display 1 shows both a docked, and undocked* window, and a black main flight screen.
- Dragging the RXP window to Display 2 brings main display window image back.
- Dragging RXP window to Display 3, shows docked* RXP window on Display 1, along with black image in main flight window.
- Dragging RXP window to Display 2, and every window is functioning again.
- Closing the RXP window makes the main flight window on Display 1 black, with docked image.
- Moving the main flight window to Display 2, brings back the image.
- Moving the main flight window image to Display 1, 2 or 3, and the image still appears while RXP window is closed.
*** Results: RXP and main flight window only work when RXP window is on the Display 2. The pattern being observed is that the RXP undocked window only works on whatever the 'main display' was specified as in the Windows Display settings.

- Loaded P3D v5 on Display 1 set as 'main display' in Window Display settings to verify differential findings between Scenario 1 and 2
- Attempted to load P3D flight twice, and P3D crashes on all attempts
- Load P3Dv5 a third time, couldn't find P3D logging option in settings
- Tried loading P3D flight on Display 1, crashes a third time
- Restarted PC

Retested Scenario 1:
-  confirmed findings from Scenario 2 that once RXP window was closed, and the main flight window was dragged onto Display 1 and an image was shown, that it could also be moved to other displays with no problems to the image.

Scenario 3:
As much as I was hesitant to load P3Dv5 on a 5.6" display, I wanted to run this test since ultimately I wanted the RXP window to work on Display 3.
- Display 3 is set to 'main display' in Windows Display settings.
- Load P3Dv5, main flight window loads on Display 1
- Main flight window not responding, P3D crashes again.
- This time I look into Event Viewer and find the P3Dv5 Application error that's been causing my crashes:
-- "Faulting application name: Prepar3D.exe version:5.0.21.34709, time stamp: 0x5e9506d, Faulting module name: KERNELBASE.DLL, VERSION 10.0.18362.778, TIME STAMP: 0xafa78a6a"
- There's also an informational windows error reporting log as well.

- Disabled 'stable' CPU and GPU overclock to see if that's what was causing the P3Dv5 crashes. OC settings were stable in P3Dv4.5

 

Other random options that I've tried enabling/disabling:

- Unchecked autofill main view (config set to checked)
- Changed Emuteq resolution to 800x600, no difference made
- I've tested by changing:
-- FXAA to both ON and OFF (current config set to ON)
-- Tested texture Resolutions from Medium to Ultra (current config set to Ultra)
-- VSync to OFF (currently config set to On)
-- Triple Buffering to OFF (config set to checked)
-- Enhanced Atmospherics (Beta) to ON (config set to Off)
-- HDR Lighting to Disabled (config set to Enabled)
-- P3D Display settings reset to defaults

 

Going to run more tests today with Scenario 3. After that test has completed, I am open to trying out new scenarios.

I've noticed that the main flight window will only work if the RXP window is running on the display that 'main display' is set to in Windows Display settings.

Edited May 1, 2020 by Sea2Sky

[RXP 2,338]

@Sea2Sky thank you for the very detailed information which is most valuable in this case in order to try understanding and reproducing the problem you're experiencing.

I'd suggest you try something thought

1. Disconnect display 3 entirely (its adapter, cables etc...), then reboot the computer, then try scenario 1
   (on display 1 and 2 remaining).
    
2. Reconnect display 3 and disconnect display 1, reboot the computer, then try scenario 2
   (replace everything you were doing on now disconnected display 1 with display 3 instead)

Is there a way you could hook up at least 2 displays in HDMI or HDMI/DP instead of S-Video and compare?

Besides, where do you get VGA output from?!

update: you might be over budgetting your video card capabilities!

https://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-1070/specifications

Maximum Digital Resolution: 7680x4320@60Hz

Your total:  (3440+4096+1024) x (2160) = 8560 x 2160

You might want to try setting display 1 and 2 to 1920x1080 and see how it goes.

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by RXP

[Sea2Sky 4]

Disconnect display 3 entirely (its adapter, cables etc...), then reboot the computer, then try scenario 1 (on display 1 and 2 remaining):

I have not uninstalled the display adapter drivers from Device Manager > Drivers. All monitor displays showing up as Generic PnP Monitor making it difficult to distinguish which driver is used for which display monitor.

Scenario 4:
- Main Display is set to Display 1
- Disconnected Display 3 on Windows Display settings
- Unplugged Display 3 VGA/DVI from GTX 1070
- Rebooted PC, and retried Scenario 1

- Loaded P3D flight, main flight window loaded on Display 1
- Undocked RXP window
- Resizing RXP window causes main flight window to black out
- Dragging main flight window to Display 2 brings back main flight window image.
- Dragging RXP window to Display 2 blacks out main flight window.
- Dragging RXP window back to Display 1 brings image back to main flight window on Display 2
- Closing RXP window, then dragging main flight window to any Display afterwards reloads main flight window image
*** Results: Same outcome as Scenario 1

Scenario 5:
- Main Display is set to Display 2
- Reconnected Display 3, Disconnected Display 1 on Windows Display settings
- Unplugged Display 1 DisplayPort from GTX 1070
- Rebooted PC, and retried Scenario

- Attempted to load P3D flight on Display 2, P3D crash
- Event Viewer showing error logs:
-- SOURCE: .NET Runtime - "Application: Prepar3D.exe, Description: The process was terminated due to an unhandled exception. Exception Info: exception code c0000005, exception address: 00007FF9`5E112DE. No stack trace provided.
-- SOURCE: Application Error - "Faulting application name: Prepar3D.exe, Faulting module name: VCRUNTIME140.dll, version 14.23.27820.0, Exception code 0xc0000005, Fault offset: 0x00...0012de, Faulting process id: 0x608.
- Attempted to load P3D flight a second time, P3Dv5 main flight window loads on Display 2
- Undocked RXP window, RXP window displays on Display 2, both RXP and main flight window show image until resizing RXP window.
- Dragging main flight window to Display 3 returns image to main flight window.
- Dragging main flight window back to Display 2 blacks out main flight window.
*** Results: Seeing similar issues as before

 

Is there a way you could hook up at least 2 displays in HDMI or HDMI/DP instead of S-Video and compare?

Unfortunately not. My GTX 1070 video outputs are 1x HDMI, 1x DisplayPort, 1x DVI. I've tried to enable my onboard HDMI video card from my motherboard (enabled in BIOS), but never had any luck with getting both onboard HDMI and GTX 1070 video inputs to work at the same time.

Besides, where do you get VGA output from?!

The VGA output comes from the Emuteq GNS530 hardware as mentioned here: http://www.emuteq.com/GNS530.html
I use a VGA to DVI adapter so I can plug in the Emuteq GNS530 hardware to my video card. This worked fine in P3Dv4.5.
 

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by Sea2Sky

[Sea2Sky 4]

@RXP I meant to say that Display 1 was using DisplayPort, not S-Video. Sorry for the confusion.

[RXP 2,338]

@Sea2Sky ok I get it of the VGA/DVI. Is there a way you could borrow another NVidia card and see what results you'd get? In doing so, you won't have to change any driver on your system and this might help a lot, especially looking at the other data information from geforce.com website about maximum digital resolution.

Now given what you've said before (this works fine in P3D4.5 but this fails with P3D5):

- it could be the DX12 driver (used on P3D5) for this card has bugs which the DX11 driver (used on P3D4) doesn't have,

- or, LM has implemented something with DX12 which is not working as good as DX11,

- or, Windows10 has a bug currently in these "multi-screen" setups and they will correct this in a next build.

- or because you're using NVidia Surround it makes it failing in DX12 but not in DX11. Can you try with Surround off to compare?

@Rob_Ainscough I don't remember but do you also use NVidia Surround?

 

[Sea2Sky 4]

Thanks for the detailed response @RXP. I'm starting to lean towards a bug, the issue is just identifying where that bug may be coming from. You've mentioned some very valid and good points, including that both DX12 and P3Dv5 are the newly implemented change cases. My hardware, operating system, etc have all remained the same except for those two software applications you've touched up on.

16 minutes ago, RXP said:

because you're using NVidia Surround it makes it failing in DX12 but not in DX11. Can you try with Surround off to compare?

To confirm, I'm not using NVidia Surround since my display resolutions are vastly different from one another.

Unfortunately for me, it appears that my only options are to:

1.) Wait for a DX12 update, and verify.
2.) Wait for a P3Dv5 patch update, and verify.
3.) Roll back to P3D v4.5

If I don't get this resolved in the next week or two, I will most likely go with option 3. Ideally, I was hoping to remain with P3Dv5 due to the performance increases, but will most likely have to wait a while. Thanks @RXP for deep diving this issue with me.

I should also mention, that I currently do not have access to another video card, so that will not be an option at the moment.

Edited May 1, 2020 by Sea2Sky