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New ATC App to Set AIs Active Runways & Approaches Testing

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Posted (edited)

I have developed a little application to set ATC/AIs active departure and landing runways, along with setting active approaches for P3D 64 bit versions.

I am looking for some testers. So, if anyone is interested please PM me with contact details. After some testing, I will be posting the release/beta here.

Thanks!

Edited by fs1
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Federico Sucari

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Hi FS1,

How does this differ from the internal ATC/AI runway assignment? I know sometimes that can be a little be faulty/odd when assigning active runway based on the wind but it usually seems OK. 

Just trying to understand what exactly your program does?

Cheers,

 

 


Kael Oswald

i7 8086k @ 5.1 / ASUS ROG Maximus XI / 16GB DDR4 3600 @ 15 / H150i PRO AIO / RTX 2080 TI / 49" SONY 4K LCD TV

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, KL Oo said:

Hi FS1,

How does this differ from the internal ATC/AI runway assignment? I know sometimes that can be a little be faulty/odd when assigning active runway based on the wind but it usually seems OK. 

Just trying to understand what exactly your program does?

Cheers,

 

 

Well, imagine parallel runways, example KJFK 4L and 4R. ATC assigns same 4L to all departing and arriving runways. After 20 minutes sitting watching you will see +8 AIs trying to take off from 4L and a bunch more trying to land on 4L. Why no reroute incoming flights to 4R (or vice-versa)  and free up 4L for take off?

So ends it ends up in a large queue of blocking AIs trying to take off and land from same runway.

This permits detouring AIs to 4R for example making things simpler.

Also, the default ATC does not optimize landing and take off queues so this can help.

The API also controls ATC AIs, giving the possibility to detach them from the ATC control and vector them (maybe someone can help code holds for AIs). There are may other things on the works. For example, non blocking taxi features and non blocking runways (these are on the works)

Also, and last, you can assign approaches for AIs which default ATC seems to assign them for you?

Hope I answered your doubts.

Edited by fs1
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Federico Sucari

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The assigning of parallel runways exclusively for take off and landing can be done via editing the afcad to solve the mentioned KJFK problem I think. But it would be interesting if the tool can allow for assigning of specific landing runways based on parking codes, parking types etc when multiple landing runways are available, since default atc assigns landing rwy based on position of descending aircraft, depending on geographic location of certain airports that can lead to crowding of one runway while the other doesnt get many landings assigned to it. This can also be useful where airlines use certain terminals close to certain runways in real life thus avoiding many taxiing conflicts, and where traffic density exceeds single landing runway capacity.

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, him225 said:

The assigning of parallel runways exclusively for take off and landing can be done via editing the afcad to solve the mentioned KJFK problem I think. But it would be interesting if the tool can allow for assigning of specific landing runways based on parking codes, parking types etc when multiple landing runways are available, since default atc assigns landing rwy based on position of descending aircraft, depending on geographic location of certain airports that can lead to crowding of one runway while the other doesnt get many landings assigned to it. This can also be useful where airlines use certain terminals close to certain runways in real life thus avoiding many taxiing conflicts, and where traffic density exceeds single landing runway capacity.

Taxi positions can be also changed by the tool. Also I am trying to make AIs take off when landing AIs is more than x NMs from the runway so as to decompress traffic in the airport.

Edited by fs1

Federico Sucari

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Can we finally get RJTT right? (North opreation: TO: 04(few)/05/34R, LD: 34L,34R; South opreation: TO:16L/16R, LD:22/23 while nowadays rnav 16s are added)

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What @him225 said is correct - You can adjust what runways are used for takeoff and landings via ADE. What would be sweet is if you could get AI to taxi into position and hold after a landing aircraft lands...that would help flow!

 

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Kael Oswald

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8 hours ago, KL Oo said:

What @him225 said is correct - You can adjust what runways are used for takeoff and landings via ADE. What would be sweet is if you could get AI to taxi into position and hold after a landing aircraft lands...that would help flow!

 

Thanks. Can you clarify more what you mean with this? Thank


Federico Sucari

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9 minutes ago, fs1 said:

Thanks. Can you clarify more what you mean with this? Thank

Which part? The part about ADE being able to control which runways are used for takeoffs and landings or the request?

At present when an AI aircraft lands another AI aircraft thats holding short is not instructed to lineup until the landing aircraft has vacated the runway. Its unrealistic and slows down departures. Can that be changed in P3D? If it was possible I would have thought one of the many AI programs would have tackled it by now. 

Still interested to hear more about your program though...


Kael Oswald

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Posted (edited)
39 minutes ago, KL Oo said:

Which part? The part about ADE being able to control which runways are used for takeoffs and landings or the request?

At present when an AI aircraft lands another AI aircraft thats holding short is not instructed to lineup until the landing aircraft has vacated the runway. Its unrealistic and slows down departures. Can that be changed in P3D? If it was possible I would have thought one of the many AI programs would have tackled it by now. 

Still interested to hear more about your program though...

I understand about ADE. The issue there it is hardcoded? What about a wind change? 

The AI does not line up as there is a landing queue preventing it. I am trying to work on that as well.

Edited by fs1

Federico Sucari

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14 hours ago, fs1 said:

I have developed a little application to set ATC/AIs active departure and landing runways, along with setting active approaches for P3D 64 bit versions.

I am looking for some testers. So, if anyone is interested please PM me with contact details. After some testing, I will be posting the release/beta here.

Thanks!

That would be great ... A tool like this is absolutely needed since long times. It happens too me much too often that I'm approaching a runway with wind from front but ai ac is starting into my direction. Also ProATC likes to assign my approach to the wrong runway with a 30:70 chance. Unfortunately, currently I cannot test because of many other duties. But I sincerely hope that this tool succeeds.


- Harry J.

i7-7820X (@4.8 GHz), 32GB RAM (@3467) 2080Ti (3440x1440), SSD 500GB, (Win10x64),  SSDs 1+2 TB (P3Dv5.x + ORBX). FSGlobalNG (mesh), ORBX (Global+OLC, all FTX Regions, all TE products, many Airports), DDscenery (NY, CH, MIA), Airports (FT, FB, FSDT, AS); PMDG (737, 747, 777), MJC DQ400, RA Piston Duke, A2A C172. Weather ASP5. F1 GTN complete. AI Traffic: AIG OCI

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, fs1 said:

... The AI does not line up as there is a landing queue preventing it. I am trying to work on that as well.

No, even if there is no "landing queue" the AI aircraft waiting at the Hold position will not enter the runway before the just landed AI aircraft has vacated the runway. This is what KL Oo described above.

In the real world the waiting aircraft will taxi onto the runway, wait and then be given takeoff clearance when the just landed aircraft has vacated the runway.


Cheers, Søren Dissing

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5 minutes ago, SierraDelta said:

No, even if there is no "landing queue" the AI aircraft waiting at the Hold position will not enter the runway before the just landed AI aircraft has vacated the runway. This is what KL Oo described above.

In the real world the waiting aircraft will taxi onto the runway, wait and then be given takeoff clearance when the just landed aircraft has vacated the runway.

I am trying to work around the landing queue (including the AI still on runway). So, I will keep you posted on this

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Federico Sucari

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13 hours ago, C2615 said:

Can we finally get RJTT right? (North opreation: TO: 04(few)/05/34R, LD: 34L,34R; South opreation: TO:16L/16R, LD:22/23 while nowadays rnav 16s are added)

That's exactly what I hope to be able to do with this tool.

This is a revolutionary step forward for AI enthusiasts and hobby programmers like me.  

Currently, the landing runway is assigned based on the closest runway to the aircraft as it is spawned in the reality bubble.  The departure runway is the closest runway to the aircraft when it begins to taxi (in addition to some length/weight calculations). Any airport that has the terminal to the side of the runways (e.g., KSEA, OMAA, PHNL) will use only that closest runway for takeoffs. If arrivals typically all arrive from one direction, one runway will be overloaded with those arrivals (e.g, KSEA again). This tool should allow us to distribute arriving and departing aircraft across runways, making AI airport operations more realistic. And I expect we would be able to assign runways based on aircraft type, airline, proximity to assigned parking, and so on.

ADE editing provides only very limited options to change active runways, and the AFD file cannot be changed once the sim is loaded. How can you make aircraft take off or land on 34C/16C at KSEA in ADE? How can you make aircraft only land on 28 in KIgali and only takeoff on 10 (one-way-in, one-way-out airports). How can you make aircraft takeoff on both 08L and 08R at PHNL? What happens if you arrive at EHAM or CYYZ after a 5 hour flight, and you'd guessed the wrong AFD to install for the arrival? 

I have been waiting for these functions for years, so this is great news.

Bryn.

 

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Streaming at twitch.tv/brynmwr

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Sounds like a great addon. I fly tubes in P3D and it bugs me when the AI lands with the wind. For example, I fly out of EWR. The wind is 350@10. You'd think the correct take off runway would be 04L, but the AI is still landing 22L and taking off 22R. I know EWR prefers using the 22s, but a check at flight radar and flight aware shows they are using 04s.

 

Nothing more immersion breaking than running into a 777 facing you on landing.

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"I am the Master of the Fist!" -Akuma
 

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