Maddog X Always Skids off the Runway

[thibodba57 462]

If it happens at breaking.  Check your break temps.  The brakes heat up real fast on the Maddog. Also make sure you turn off all realism settings for the aircraft.  You might just be blowing a tire on rollout given you don’t actually have a brake axis it sounds like.  Does it do it during an auto brake landing?

[OzWhitey 3,353]

1 hour ago, thibodba57 said:

If it happens at breaking.  Check your break temps.  The brakes heat up real fast on the Maddog. Also make sure you turn off all realism settings for the aircraft.  You might just be blowing a tire on rollout given you don’t actually have a brake axis it sounds like.  Does it do it during an auto brake landing?

I’m using the Super Tube for almost all of my v5 flying atm, with active sky (with turbulence on), haven’t seen this behaviour personally.

1. I’d second the idea of autobrake landings, that would be interesting to see if it makes any difference.

2. How about an autoland? Maddog tries not to deviate after touchdown until you disconnect the AP - would your skidding problem be constrained by this?

I’m really just suggesting these two approaches as part of a testing methodology. Like a few others here, i have no problem at all with landing this aircraft, so it’s not a ubiquitous problem ie there is hope, keep trying!

(on a quick tea break before resuming ILS approaches to EKVG in the MD-82, through some pretty rubbish weather tonight)

[Mace 1,902]

11 hours ago, Midnight Music said:

My final approach speed is usually around 143, then slowly bleed off over the threshold and at 10 feet throttles off all the way. What do you land at?

Lee

That's about the speed I landed at the other night.

[Mace 1,902]

3 hours ago, micstatic said:

is it possible you have something like asymmetric reverse thrust going on?

That is possible.  

I don't quite have my throttles set up perfectly for the Maddog yet.  I need to fiddle with the reverse zone etc.

It's possible that, when I retard fully, I'm accidentally activating reverse thrust a bit prematurely...and it could be asymmetric....but I didn't notice that on the gauges.  I am really green with this aircraft.  Not sure about Pete, but I am going to revisit my FSUIPC throttle settings before I do anything as radical as uninstalling/reinstalling.

[Midnight Music 252]

55 minutes ago, Mace said:

That is possible.  

I don't quite have my throttles set up perfectly for the Maddog yet.  I need to fiddle with the reverse zone etc.

It's possible that, when I retard fully, I'm accidentally activating reverse thrust a bit prematurely...and it could be asymmetric....but I didn't notice that on the gauges.  I am really green with this aircraft.  Not sure about Pete, but I am going to revisit my FSUIPC throttle settings before I do anything as radical as uninstalling/reinstalling.

Might I suggest not using FSUIPC at the moment and rely instead on good old F2 and F1 buttons for reverse thrust and neutral. Something is going on with FSUIPC with controllers in V5 at present. I am not sure it is all working quite right.

Lee

[PilotPete99 915]

I never use autopilot or autoland, I just enjoy hand flying. Also, I don't experience this on any other aircraft and don't use the FSUIPC payware program. I have uninstalled this aircraft several times for updates, etc. but the problem persists. I have tried landing with the reverse thrust and without but I just lose control. Also, my landings are very smooth so I don't think a blown tire is the issue. It has to be something with the settings, but I use a medium random load when I fly. How would I set up an autobrake landing? Would I need to use autopilot to do that or just set the autobrake and that is it? Back in the day used to use the Coolsky MD-80 and never had this issue either. I can be flying the PMDG 737 with a beer in one hand and poorly controlling a terrible landing and still never skid off of the runway. Also, being a real world pilot I know how important it is to be very gentle on the controls. I have had perfect landings in the maddog and still end up off of the runway.

Cheers, Pete

Edited June 16, 2020 by PilotPete99

[micstatic 4,314]

I think your best bet is top open a ticket with their team.  They seem very helpful

[polosim 837]

5 minutes ago, PilotPete99 said:

How would I set up an autobrake landing?

Select one of the different settings:

RTO: Rejected takeoff 
OFF: off!!  
DISARM: Disarmed 
1-2-3-4: different settings increasing with braking intensity 
MAX AUTO: Maximum autobrake 

6 minutes ago, PilotPete99 said:

Would I need to use autopilot to do that or just set the autobrake and that is it?

No,  Autobrake it's an independent system.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PilotPete99 915]

1 minute ago, polosim said:

Select one of the different settings:

RTO: Rejected takeoff 
OFF: off!!  
DISARM: Disarmed 
1-2-3-4: different settings increasing with braking intensity 
MAX AUTO: Maximum autobrake 

No,  Autobrake it's an independent system.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks, so pardon my ignorance, but if I set MAX AUTO do i not need to manually break when I land? I am terrible with automation!

Cheers, Pete

[micstatic 4,314]

I personally use Autobrake 1 the vast majority of the time and don't touch my brakes until around 30 knots when I take over braking. 

[PilotPete99 915]

13 minutes ago, micstatic said:

I personally use Autobrake 1 the vast majority of the time and don't touch my brakes until around 30 knots when I take over braking. 

Thanks, I will give that a shot.

Cheers, Pete

[cwburnett 1,809]

When you put the gear down, arm spoilers and select Autobrake 1 with the knob and flip the switch next to the knob to arm it. The autobrake control panel is just to the left of the right pnumatic crossfeed control on the pedestal. Note that having the autobrake is an option that can be enabled/disabled in the load manager, so if you're flying an aircraft without it, you will not have the autobrake control panel at all.  Lastly, this may sound silly, but make sure that you don't have the parking brake somehow set before landing? Enabling the red message as in step 1 below will also show if the parking brake is set. Parking brake is set either manually by pulling up on the (right click I think) brake knob on the tiller OR by having the beacon off. Whenever the beacon is off, the parking brake is on.

As for testing and reverse thrust, I would try a few things...

1) Enable the red message text to show "Brakes" or "Differential Brakes" in the lower left corner of the window - this will let you know what's happening with your brakes.

2) Setup a windless clear day and hand fly an approach to a long runway, don't use spoilers, brakes or reverse and see what happens when you touch down - is it a normal rollout or something crazy happening?

If this doesn't work, I'd definitely open a ticket. If it does, go to 3)

3) Setup the same approach, but this time arm your spoilers and set autobrake 1 and arm the autobrake. You should get light braking after touchdown, let it come to a stop itself without intervening. If you touch the brakes manually, autobrake will disengage. Do not use reverse, just idle power as normal for touchdown.

If this works, go to #4, otherwise open a ticket.

4) Setup your reverse thrust. I have my controls configured through P3D; I use a Saitek throttle with three throttle levers. First axis is assigned to spoilers with the invert axis check marked, the second (middle) is assigned to the left throttle (engine 1) and the third (right) is assigned to the right throttle (engine 2). On the saitek there's a 'button' that is activated if you pull the throttle into the reverse range, so I have ONLY the button associated with the engine 2 throttle set to "decrease throttle" with the medium repeat setting and I use this to deploy the reversers for both engines simultaneously. For this to work, both throttles have to be at idle, or you'll immediately get asymmetric reverse.  Make sure throttles are set to max sensitivity and minimum null zone.  Monitor your reverse lights and EPR when you deploy to make sure it is symmetrical.

Hope this helps...

 

[PilotPete99 915]

8 minutes ago, cwburnett said:

When you put the gear down, arm spoilers and select Autobrake 1 with the knob and flip the switch next to the knob to arm it. The autobrake control panel is just to the left of the right pnumatic crossfeed control on the pedestal. Note that having the autobrake is an option that can be enabled/disabled in the load manager, so if you're flying an aircraft without it, you will not have the autobrake control panel at all.  Lastly, this may sound silly, but make sure that you don't have the parking brake somehow set before landing? Enabling the red message as in step 1 below will also show if the parking brake is set. Parking brake is set either manually by pulling up on the (right click I think) brake knob on the tiller OR by having the beacon off. Whenever the beacon is off, the parking brake is on.

As for testing and reverse thrust, I would try a few things...

1) Enable the red message text to show "Brakes" or "Differential Brakes" in the lower left corner of the window - this will let you know what's happening with your brakes.

2) Setup a windless clear day and hand fly an approach to a long runway, don't use spoilers, brakes or reverse and see what happens when you touch down - is it a normal rollout or something crazy happening?

If this doesn't work, I'd definitely open a ticket. If it does, go to 3)

3) Setup the same approach, but this time arm your spoilers and set autobrake 1 and arm the autobrake. You should get light braking after touchdown, let it come to a stop itself without intervening. If you touch the brakes manually, autobrake will disengage. Do not use reverse, just idle power as normal for touchdown.

If this works, go to #4, otherwise open a ticket.

4) Setup your reverse thrust. I have my controls configured through P3D; I use a Saitek throttle with three throttle levers. First axis is assigned to spoilers with the invert axis check marked, the second (middle) is assigned to the left throttle (engine 1) and the third (right) is assigned to the right throttle (engine 2). On the saitek there's a 'button' that is activated if you pull the throttle into the reverse range, so I have ONLY the button associated with the engine 2 throttle set to "decrease throttle" with the medium repeat setting and I use this to deploy the reversers for both engines simultaneously. For this to work, both throttles have to be at idle, or you'll immediately get asymmetric reverse.  Make sure throttles are set to max sensitivity and minimum null zone.  Monitor your reverse lights and EPR when you deploy to make sure it is symmetrical.

Hope this helps...

 

Thanks for these ideas. I will go through this exercise and see if it solves the problems. I initiate reverse thrust by using the F2 key. Also, my current controller only has one throttle which controls all engines at the same time (fairly basic controller with twist axis for rudder).

Cheers, Pete

Edited June 16, 2020 by PilotPete99

[DaveCT2003 1,820]

18 hours ago, PilotPete99 said:

Hello - I have been to the Maddog forums and saw a post about this, but so far have not found a fix. Literally every time I land the maddog the plane skids off of the runway once I begin braking. This has happened in V4 and V5 and I don't understand why this happens. One post said to change the rudder axis to 90, which i did but same result. The plane literally skids out of control. I have no other airplane that does this and in all the hours I have flown in real life this has never happened (that would be bad) even on some of my not so great landings over the years. Any ideas? This can't just be me since several people chimed in on that one post having the same issue. Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Cheers, Pete

I've been a Beta Tester of the MaddogX since the beginning of the project and I've never encountered or heard of this.  I would be interested to know if this happens in any other higher end airliner (I'm wondering if maybe one of your pots in a controller is out of whack). 

Lots of very good ideas here.  I can't think of anything else to add but I'll think on it.

 

 

[sevenflyer 12]

I have had it happen to me a couple times lately as well. I thought it might have been related to hydraulic pressure, because I had forgotten to switch the hydraulics back to high the last time it happened.

I have been more diligent and I haven't had it happen again. However, when it does happen, as mentioned, there is zero possibility of getting under control again.