whats going on with this comunity

[kand 205]

HiI have just read an editorial at another website.It seems there are a lot of critics of avsim in the major fsim websites,why is this? Surely it cannot all amount to jealousyI have come across ######y comments over the past few years but it does seem that this petty childish playground behaviour exists across the board, I remember avsim not allowing anyone to mention another fsim.com* website as it used to get edited as profanity.The fsplanet situation i know and accept but I really dont understand the background to all this as i have never taken an interest, but it now bugs me as i frequent this site regularly and it is my first point of call for fsim related topicsAnybody care to share the information?If not I guess this post can dissappear!!Keith

[Guest Ken_Salter]

When did avsim not allow mention of flightsim.com? It was (and still is) the other way around.

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

What editorial and where? There are many critics of AVSIM, from the very day we opened. There have been conspiracy stories, again from the day we opened. There are those that would like to see us fail in order for them to succeed and make money off this "hobby". There are commercial sites out there that are jealous of our success, and can't stand the idea that we are not a "pay for site" that would allow them to compete on an even footing. And yes, there are some petty egos involved that take every opportunity to show their petty egos. Anyway, point me to the editorial and I will be happy to respond to it. :)

[Guest]

There was I believe a period when an overzealous forum manager placed the word in the profanity filter ;)Didn't last long...

[Guest]

It's always been that way, probably always will remain that way.I'm not at liberty to divulge information about the root causes, let's just say there are some very strong (and headstrong) personalities involved who have their differences of opinion which have over time led to more or less open hostility between those people.Fallout of this is that some (many?) people are drawn into factional infighting, having to choose which side to support.Personally I try to stay above that, personally knowing people in more than one camp and trying to stay out of the politics as much as possible.Yes, it's sometimes childish and shortsighted. If everyone were to shake hands and forget past adversaties things might be a lot better overall but I severely doubt that's going to happen seeing how long it's all been going on now and how deeply rooted the differences of opinion and the personal animosities are.

[Guest Adverse Yawn]

It's the same everywhere. When I was into racing sims, the main sites subjected to jelous slander and accusations of skulduggery, etc. One such case I recall was "Pieter's Grand Prix 2" site. If you've been around long enough you know to ignore it all. The problem is that some people, due to their recency withing a hobby, don't see this pattern.

[Guest Ken_Salter]

Thanks, I must have not seen that...Too bad avsim is still consider "profane" at other site(s) :-(

[kand 205]

Hi TomThe editors editorial is at simflight , I wouldnt say it is particularly harsh but it does take a swipe at this site .Its a response over this FSX Bs that has gone like widfire over the last few days .I understand the posts/fight against sites that charge people to dl freeware but I cant understand the personal attacks that happen in forums regularly about whose site is bad with no real explanantion as to why. Anyway I was tired when I started this as I have been working all over the holiday and with hindsight wish I hadn't posted as I am now becoming involved in it ,usually I just read the posts !!!Happy new year all and thanks avsim/freeware devs for all the stuff i have dl from your servers over the last few yrsKeith

[Staffan 12]

I remeber back in the FS95, FS98 days, when you really could call this a community. Unfortunately, the community which once was, does not exist anymore. :-(http://www.scandicair.com/images/sa_banner.gif"Real men fly with round gauges"[/color]

[Deaf Pilot 1]

I wouldnt say that... that community is still here... always has been. There's just a LOT more people here. I know it's hard to see it... Example... if something major was to happen in my life... I know I could post about it here and I would get more support than I would in real life. Believe me, this is still a great community. Why do you think I check in every day? I love hanging out with the guys I've gotten familiar with over the past few years. I probably don't have 1000 posts here, even in the past near-5 years I've been a member, but I feel proud to be a "veteran" member of such a great place.

[Staffan 12]

You can

[John_Cillis 2,406]

Staffan, good question..I remember the same types of issues in FS98 days and even beyond those days. I used to belong to Prodigy, where a number of us had a forum dedicated to Packard Bell. You should have seen all the arguments and fires that arose in those forums!Almost any forum can have issues, and most have. I've seen people torn to bits at Flightsim.com, here, and just about everywhere in between. A couple of weeks ago I had to go in for a medical procedure, so I tried to educate myself by visiting newsgroups that discussed the procedure. 99 percent of the time the procedure is done with sedation. When someone wrote to voice concern that the insurance company wanted to balk at paying for sedation for his son, he was flamed with "your son is a wimp" comments rather than receiving the support he sought. There's people in every crowd, not just ours.As moderators, we're sometimes torn. I was ill during the FS2006 discussion and still am and tried to cope with it the best I could. but to be honest I missed many posts. I believe Tom and Ken were weren't present as much either due to the holidays. Matt stepped in and helped out. Every site goes through those moments when the resources just aren't enough. Every site has someone (myself included) that sticks his/her foot in their mouth at regular intervals. As a large community, larger than most, the odds are against us in that regard. But they are also for us, in the sense that here is where most often people come seeking answers to all sorts of questions.-John

[Staffan 12]

Yes John, it

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

Staffan, You have a short memory my friend. I have been "in the community" since November of 1996, and it hasn't changed much. You know that, as you have been around for about the same amount of time. From what I have seen, those that claim the "climate" has changed usually follow that statement by accusing AVSIM of some nefarious attack on their web site, means of making a living, ad naseum. So, my conclusion is that "climate" is a self serving claim that usually is some pretext to attack AVSIM and usually for commercial reasons (read loss of sales, wounded egos, etc. etc.). As for extending that argument to include freeware authors, yes, we have lost some. The truth of the matter is that freeware is alive and well. Despite those that would judge the health of the community by the departure of freeware authors, the truth is that there are many who are stepping up to take the place of those that have departed. My advice to you and others who see the "climate" claims by some site admins, take that with a bit of "salt" and look at the reasons why they might claim that to be so.

[Tom Allensworth 1,532]

Staffan, we posted over each other. It IS NOT "sad but true". The community is robust, growing and the membership of AVSIM proves that. Things have changed, certainly, but to characterize our community as something less than it was 5 or 7 years ago is not correct. It is much better and getting more so.