To upgrade or not...that is the question.

[RobJC 2,069]

I am really enjoying MSFS but my 4770K / GTX 1070 is only capable of about 24 FPS. Thanks to my G-Sync monitor it is pretty smooth, but there are those times when the frames dip down momentarily into the 14 to 15 FPS range. Silky smooth at 24 FPS. Not so much at 15. So this is going to be one of those threads where I ask for opinions but ultimately it comes down to money. My money. And do I really want to part with it?

My current 4770K / GTX 1070 pc is really a great system for work, and even most games. Unfortunately, MSFS isn't most games. I have 32 GB RAM and all SSDs plus a really nice 1440p G-sync monitor, so I think I am getting just about everything I can out of this rig. I could probably go another few years with this setup (built it in 2013 but upgraded graphics and monitor afterwards) as it works really well. 

If I just suck it up and build a new PC I have the case and SSDs so the rest of the build probably sets me back $1,800. Here's the proposed build:

- Intel Core i9 10850K 
- CORSAIR iCUE H115i RGB PRO XT, 280mm Radiator, Dual 140mm PWM Fans, Liquid CPU Cooler
- MSI MPG Z490 GAMING EDGE WIFI Motherboard
- G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) Desktop Memory
- RTX 3070 

This build probably gets me close to 70 FPS on Ultra settings with my 1440p G-sync monitor. 

Another option would be to just buy a 2080 Ti. Most of the time I am seeing GPU limited results (although not always), so maybe a 2080 Ti gets me into the 30s FPS which with the smoothness I see at 24 FPS should be plenty. That should set me back around $500. Now my concern with the 2080 Ti is that I will instantly become CPU limited, and thus not see a lot of improvement.

My 4770K is overclocked to 4.3 GHz (no lottery winner here). I also thought about upgrading my CPU to the 4790K, but I really don't think it makes any sense for 200-300 MHz improvement. That CPU might cost $175 which in the big scheme of things feels like a waste of money.  

Another option would be to pick up a 1080 Ti. Those are pretty cheap and the performance difference between the 1070 and 1080 Ti is pretty big. It might get me into the high 20s or even low 30s, which should be really smooth with my G-sync monitor. 

Of course the last option is to just enjoy MSFS without doing any upgrades right now. The visuals are really good (most settings are HIGH) but if i turn anything down from here the visual drop off is big. I can take off from Heathrow without issues, and even weather doesn't really impact FPS too badly. 

I don't really want to spend $1,800 atm (too many new products coming out and I might wish I had waiting in a few months) but I also don't want to throw too much money away on stuff that won't have a long shelf-life. And my current rig is excellent in everything else except MSFS, so a lot of parts are just going to collect dust if I go full rebuild. I am thinking that a cheap 1080 Ti might hold me over for a while, still give me a good boost (I hope!), or at most go for a 2080 Ti when prices drop. 

What do you guys think? Thanks for the help! 

Rob

[Bert Pieke 7,584]

Have you looked at your MSFS settings?  I also run a 4770K (but at 4.1 GHz) and a GTX 1070.   Solid 30 fps, limited in RTSS.   HT enabled on the CPU.

I wonder what settings you have that push you down to 24 fps..?  Is it 1440 vs 1080 monitor resolution?

I have mostly  "high-level" set.

[RobJC 2,069]

Hey Bert, yeah I have until my eyes bled. I am running 1440p and that makes a big difference vs 1080p. 

At 4:25 in this video you can see the Ultra performance for each card. But that is not with a 4770K so I am not sure what sort of FPS I would get? 

 

Edited September 13, 2020 by RobJC

[Bert Pieke 7,584]

Have you tried turning on Developer mode and Options / Display fps?

There you can see how your CPU and GPU are doing.. I appear to be limited mainly by the Main thread (CPU).

[RobJC 2,069]

32 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

Have you tried turning on Developer mode and Options / Display fps?

There you can see how your CPU and GPU are doing.. I appear to be limited mainly by the Main thread (CPU).

Yeah I have and see that most of the time i am GPU limited. It does show main thread sometimes and flickers between the two, but in flight I see GPU limited most of the time. 

[Bert Pieke 7,584]

I guess I would settle for "Silky smooth at 24" for now.. not a bad place to be 🙂

And.. turn off the fps counter!

[RobJC 2,069]

8 minutes ago, Bert Pieke said:

I guess I would settle for "Silky smooth at 24" for now.. not a bad place to be 🙂

And.. turn off the fps counter!

Thanks for the help Bert! It really is very smooth at 24 FPS but I do get the drops to 15 every once in a while. When I turn some of the settings down and get 32 FPS the drops to the low 20s do not cause a noticeable stutter, which is why I was trying to get to high 20s. The 1080 Ti is still pretty pricey, used. I am seeing around $400+ on eBay. Hopefully the 3000 series cards put downward pressure on prices. 

Yeah, the FPS counter is a sport! 

[ryanbatc 12,833]

I would not buy a 2080 Ti anymore.....not with the 30xx cards out/coming out.  Of course it may be hard to find them initially.  But otherwise I like your system.  I also didn't read your post thoroughly - what PSU are you planning?  Or using existing one?

[RobJC 2,069]

51 minutes ago, ryanbatcund said:

I would not buy a 2080 Ti anymore.....not with the 30xx cards out/coming out.  Of course it may be hard to find them initially.  But otherwise I like your system.  I also didn't read your post thoroughly - what PSU are you planning?  Or using existing one?

Hey Ryan, thanks for chiming in. The only reason I was considering the 2080 Ti was due to potential savings once the 3070 hits, but you are right in that supply will be very limited most likely. I just spent some time playing around with the "bottleneck calculator" and it appears that my CPU, even overclocked will be right on the edge pushing a 1080 Ti. This might actually make some sense, since when I am flying and have the FPS dev tool up, I do occasionally see the Main Thread/GPU limited flickering back and forth. That tells me my system is pretty well balanced and adding too much GPU isn't going to move the needle very much without a new CPU to go with it. I will definitely see an improvement with the 1080 Ti but not sure how much. 

https://pc-builds.com/calculator/Core_i7-4790K/GeForce_GTX_1080_Ti/0AH0XFm8/32/100/#tbnForm-1820918288

I have a 750 Watt PSU so I think I am okay there. I also have a Cooler Master HAF 932 case which I like a lot. 

[Ixoye 1,821]

I think a 1080 Ti will match well on your system.

Edited September 14, 2020 by Ixoye

[orchestra_nl 927]

On 9/14/2020 at 1:11 AM, Bert Pieke said:

I guess I would settle for "Silky smooth at 24" for now.. not a bad place to be 🙂

And.. turn off the fps counter!

I am still using a GTX 1060, and after turning off my FPS counter most of the issues went away. Seriously!
I mostly fly GA aircraft at the moment, and therefore avoid larger cities as well. that helps probably a lot, but flying is smooth. There is an occasional hickup, but the performance is actually better than in FSX, with better visuals. Will I upgrade to 30xx? Yes, once the reviews are out I will probably go for a 3080 or 3090.

At the moment, that GTX1060 is still adaquate.

 

[G-RFRY 1,710]

I take you guys have seen some pre-orders for the 3080 priced at $1200, i would chill out for a few months and it is not always best to be the first wait to see what the RMA are on the first cards.

[RobJC 2,069]

8 hours ago, G-RFRY said:

I take you guys have seen some pre-orders for the 3080 priced at $1200, i would chill out for a few months and it is not always best to be the first wait to see what the RMA are on the first cards.

Buy the Founders Edition directly from NVIDIA at MSRP. But you might have to wait a bit to get them. 

[RobJC 2,069]

I am actually not going to upgrade right now. I have achieved enough performance out of my 4770K / GTX 1070 to tide me over until later in the year - I think. These decisions do have a tendency to change on a dime lol. 

[G-RFRY 1,710]

40 minutes ago, RobJC said:

I am actually not going to upgrade right now. I have achieved enough performance out of my 4770K / GTX 1070 to tide me over until later in the year - I think. These decisions do have a tendency to change on a dime lol. 

Yes i have just done a case, Noctua fans, 360 cooler ,CPU and MB upgrade £1300 , but would not pre-order or buy the first GPU`s on the market plus Nvidia have more coming possible 3080ti near the end of the year, and we should see the first benchmarks 3070 release tomorrow and the 3080 next week. and the rumour is not as big a gain in some games as people think.