FS Academy - IFR

[stigt 13]

I just saw that there is an addon for MSFS available, named FS academy IFR ( FS Academy - IFR ). I would love to learn the ropes of IFR flying step by step, so it seems like a great add on. Does anybody have experience with this program and would you recommend it?

[Ianrivaldosmith 5,317]

Seems like a good addon, but, something that perhaps should have been included in the sim from the get go. I’d still purchase it though. 

[Andreas Stangenes 1,628]

There is a big problem with the sim in regards to IFR. You cant really do proper IFR at the moment. With that said, you can do much of it, but don't expect it to be especially realistic. IFR is the weaker point of the sim. 

[Janov 2,383]

1 hour ago, Andreas Stangenes said:

There is a big problem with the sim in regards to IFR. You cant really do proper IFR at the moment. With that said, you can do much of it, but don't expect it to be especially realistic. IFR is the weaker point of the sim. 

Surely you must be mistaken or doing something wrong?

This guy here (I think he also posts here at avsim) certainly has no problems at all performing perfectly realistic IFR flights...and so do some other folks, appearantly?

https://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/forums/topic/226086-another-quick-msfs-review-video-of-multi-screens/&tab=comments#comment-2034935

https://forums.x-plane.org/index.php?/forums/topic/226163-janov-ils-including-star-video-msfs/

Cheers, Jan

 

Edited October 23, 2020 by Janov

[jrw4 624]

For what it might be worth, I can confirm that it is perfectly possible to carry out IFR flights in MSFS (and every other desktop simulator, as well). What's currently inconvenient is RNAV utilization, as the present implementation (even when upgraded with the very nice Working Title add-on) is somewhat incomplete. Having said that, so long as one is OK with exporting a PLN flight plan from something like LittleNavMap, and then loading it from the flight planning page in MSFS, that works fine. Those plans are difficult to modify in flight however, but not impossible.

Try the beautiful Bonanza G36 mod. It's very stable in flight and makes a fine practice platform. I rely strictly on VOR based navigation for now, but that will change eventually, once Asobo upgrades the G1000 to something approaching that available from the default X-Plane installation.

Cheers,

John

[Ron Lefebvre 108]

That is all nice, but has anyone tried FS Acadamy and can it really take you to the next level/.

 

On a side not. I agree with John. The modified A36Mod is very good.

 

Ron

[Dharma66 48]

Sorry, I can’t answer your question... yet.

However, I wanted to thank you for bringing this to my attention. It looks like it’s just what I need to enable me to break my VFR habit. I’m going to give it a go and will update in a few days with how I get on.

Cheers

[stigt 13]

On 10/24/2020 at 6:05 PM, Dharma66 said:

Sorry, I can’t answer your question... yet.

However, I wanted to thank you for bringing this to my attention. It looks like it’s just what I need to enable me to break my VFR habit. I’m going to give it a go and will update in a few days with how I get on.

Cheers

Can you tell something about your experience so far?

[Malaromane 421]

On 10/24/2020 at 12:05 PM, Dharma66 said:

However, I wanted to thank you for bringing this to my attention. It looks like it’s just what I need to enable me to break my VFR habit. I’m going to give it a go and will update in a few days with how I get on.

I, too, am eagerly awaiting your first impressions. I'm on the verge of pulling the trigger on this but I'd really like to see some reviews/user feedback first.

[kt069 569]

There s a video related with this topic, which you may like to see.

 

 

[kt069 569]

3 hours ago, Malaromane said:

I, too, am eagerly awaiting your first impressions. I'm on the verge of pulling the trigger on this but I'd really like to see some reviews/user feedback first.

 

[wthomas33065 994]

You can see his IFR issue in the post below if you are interested in some light reading (lol)

He has very valid points on how Autopilot and FMC/GPS avionics systems are handling transitions and approaches and the fact that the database in MSFS is not complete in regards to some Navaids and SIDS/STARS.

These things, however, don't prevent one from learning IFR rules, and the sim will allow you to hand fly any IFR approach that is currently in the DB.  

The fact that the computer may not follow the rules when the Autopilot or FMC is controlling the aircraft is a valid point, but hardly is cause for stating that "you can't do proper IFR".  YOU can.  It's the autopilots and FMC's that can't.  

Edited October 28, 2020 by wthomas33065

[Andreas Stangenes 1,628]

Thomas and I dont always see eye to eye 😉 But thank you for being diplomatic about it. Some IFR procedures are VERY difficult to handfly because you dont have any visual representation of where you are supposed to fly next, other than to guess. I am talking about common RNAV-based STARS that often (at least in Europe) combine with transitions for ils. You simply lose a lot of waypoints in the STAR. And unless you have the appropriate charts, you wouldn't even know you were missing any waypoints (at least as a newbi). 

You probably can use a flight tracker like little nav map or navigraph charts on a second screen and just use heading select to fly an approximation of the route, but it isn't even close to what I would call fulfilling IFR procedures. I can understand the sim is young, and we are talking about default aircrafts here (at least mostly). Unfortunately, because of the bugs, Navigraph (the developers) are not able to overcome the bugs with the sim that produce these bugs. In other words, you get the same bugs whether you use the default nav database or the one from Navigraph. I already spend my days flying VFR all day long and enjoy it, but I cannot say that I am getting much enjoyment out of flying ifr on Vatsim in a tubeliner in MSF. There are too many bugs for that. That is the whole point of the thread that Thomas linked to. 

With that said, learning the concept of SIDs, enroute segment, STARs, transitions and approaches can be done in MSF. Just be prepared to get some unexpected results from time to time. 

Edited October 28, 2020 by Andreas Stangenes

[Janov 2,383]

12 hours ago, wthomas33065 said:

YOU can.  It's the autopilots and FMC's that can't.  

The problem is that in many cases nowadays you are operating in airspace that requires a certain RNP (required navigation performance). And a lot of these, like RNP1, can only be flown with an FMS/autopilot/flightdirector combination that is capable and approved (and the pilots need to be as well).

So yes, you can fly a C-172 on V airways going from VOR to VOR like you did 50 years ago...and that is certainly IFR in the sense of the word.

But you can´t just handfly your A320 from waypoint to waypoint if you get cleared for a P-RNAV transition, the ANP (actual navigation performance) is only 1.1 if it is flown raw-data, even if the procedure is depicted accurately on the nav display. Now you "could" certainly get away with that on VATSIM, but you would still need the correct waypoints shown on the map, not even talking about radius-to-fix segments that define a curved path laterally.

You can´t operate into many (most) bigger hubs because they require a certain RNP capability which goes far beyond what used to be known as RNAV for the last few decades. These procedures require an FMS and autopilot/flight-director to fly them. There is a whole slew of nagivation procedures coming down the line, defined very precisely in 3D space and you simply can´t fly those conventionally with a DME and an HSI.

So yes, technically you can fly IFR with a very basic set of instrumentation, but if you want to simulate the way that airliners and the more complex commercial aircraft operate you need the nav database, avionics and other required onboard equipment that allows to partake in the procedures used at the airports these aircraft operate to.

Cheers, Jan

[Andreas Stangenes 1,628]

Thank God for your great explanation, @Janov! I wish you could write that in the "To Asobo, if you are still reading" thread 🙂